Server Discussion - Non Truebox rule set.

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by dreamweaver, Oct 25, 2019.

  1. Houseofpain New Member

    Yeah but the level playing field concept is another arbitrary with no real point. So whats level about people with 1000's of dollars of disposable income buying crafting potions and xp potions verse barely enough money to play the game? Whats level about people with 100's of hours of free time to play a month verse a few hours a week?There currently exist dozens of nonlevel playing field concepts baked into the game. Why randomly apply it to this Ghubuk? Whats the importance of this thing being subjectively level? So if i roll into an encounter say for instance with 6 toons and 6 mercs in two groups and beat it ,life is good. But if i roll in with one group of toons with similar automation it now becomes an unfair advantage? This is a perfect example of what i was talking about. Why for any reason should this be a sticking point? Why should everquest automation be considered fair and noble and a tool of the just and mighty. But the very same automation from a third party site be dirty and vile and cheating.And how do all the players of everquest not have access to these programs? You make it sound like these third party programs are some elite item only gifted to the chosen few
  2. That0neguy Augur

    Theres a big difference between the two.
    I remember a bunch of griping about a boxer locking down Giants on mangler. You think he was botting to do this? Probably just had a autoclicker setup. Now do you think that situation gets better or worse without truebox?
  3. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    A non true box server would be tempting. I don't do free to play and it would be nice not to have to buy expansions for a while. Though I suspect I would stay on my Live server.
  4. Ghubuk Augur

    This a bit of a straw argument. I get that if someone has lots of money (I don't :)), then sure they probably will have a somewhat advantage in that they can afford more accounts. But that is a "legitimate" source until they also take the ability to pay for more accounts and then automate them on top of that. Same goes with playtime, it's a "legitimate" source, same as just plain being better at playing the game. But when you throw in 3rd party cheats that automate your toons (even if you are driving one of them), then it further throws those that want to play in the spirit of fair play using only those abilities provided by the game itself under the bus.
  5. qweasy Augur

    Are you trying to say an autoclicker isn't botting? Because it is and is against the rules on both truebox and non-truebox servers. Daybreak not enforcing their own rules has no place in a discussion around boxing vs non boxing.

    It will stay exactly the same until rules against automated gameplay are actually enforced. Again, it has nothing to do with truebox vs non truebox.
  6. PathToEternity

    I'm not huge on boxing myself but I do think this should be done. It's really just a convenience thing.

    I recognize there are some casual/group-level issues with boxing because of how that affects PUGs and such, but the biggest server-impacting issues really became non-issues with the introduction of AoCs and /pick.

    As far as other rules go, I don't have major opinions on that but a FV/free-trader TLP server is overdue and this would probably be the most suitable server to offer that on.
  7. Tmerz New Member

    Im for a non-truebox server if you fix the current problem with truebox in conjunction with the release.
    Right before its release would be the best time to finally fix the current issues with players circumventing the truebox code with simple to advanced methods. It will also give a home for these paying accounts to go.
    Yinla likes this.
  8. Houseofpain New Member

    Yeah but thats the crux of the argument and why i do not feel it is in any way a straw argument. There is zero validity to the legitimate argument. Some vague concepts of things your not supposed to do, programs that nobody mentions the name but three quarters of the game or more uses. Back water deals between the game and the creators of said programs.The literal exact same action is okay in one form but ban able in another? So if i use 3 different computers/3 different logitech keyboards and macros it doesn't interfere with your sense of fair play? But if i use one computer and 3rd party automation it does? This will basically to me come down to common sense. There is a reason they put melody and autofire into the game. It was absurd to expect bards and rangers to play one way while everyone else was living the dream. Like it or not boxers exist. Not only do boxers exist but they are in fact the only thing keeping the lights on and paying the games bills. The idea that i should be made to jump through ever increasing hoops to play the game to accommodate your sense of fair play? I am in no way shape or form Advocating for 3rd party usage. I am advocating that an honest look into what these programs are providing and why. There is zero reason (stick) should not be avail in game to boxers. If my pet and mercs already do it. If program x can improve an already existing feature. Use the programs code to fix it in everquest or leave people alone when other means are found.Auto follow being a big one that comes to mind.
  9. Rayvorn Elder


    The point of a discussion thread is two-way conversations. We would really like to know what the Dev side thoughts are? Do you guys have a top 5 plan for the server? Right now it's us talking amongst ourselves (ranting mostly). If you guys could let us know the possibilities that are available we could probably hit some pro's and con's you guys might not think of. I just don't see this turning out well unless there is open communication. If you like 100 people tell you what they want and there are 20 different ideas thrown out..and you only pick 1...19 people will be unhappy (not good math). If you narrow the playing field for us, we can discuss those and I bet we would come to the same conclusion as you.
  10. code-zero Augur

    The real draw of non-truebox is that you DO NOT need to have multiple computers do play on it. Yes, I know about all the "google xxx" implying that you can just cheat.

    If I want to two box, like I have regularly played EQ for over 15 years I do not want to have to fall back to having a laptop actually sitting on my lap while I fumble around with my main game computer. I had friends who used KVM switches and game pads to try and play and it was just kludgy

    True Box = kludge, not fun
    Aneuren and Eangel like this.
  11. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    Other then the fact truebox blocks the most commonly used program to automate on live.
  12. That0neguy Augur

    Yes an autoclicker is no where near what I would consider a bot. A bot implies intelligence and takes a little bit of effort to set up.
    When you turn off truebox and you allow everyone to 6+ box. You don't think HG's and FG's will be even more toxic then they already were?
  13. qweasy Augur

    Truebox doesn't do that, the program itself prevents it from being used on certain servers. And other programs have come along to replace that one.
  14. Eangel Elder

    I four boxed on Agnarr and 4 different computers (PC and three laptops) to be able to play the way I enjoy and to be able to get objectives done without waiting for someone else to get to the zone or be ready. I grouped with other folks and raided on top of that. I also played other games and had zero want/need to box. There were ingame tools to help with grouping and queues in excess of 30 mins at times, but the big thing was I could get things accomplished like questing or exping on my own while waiting for a group or I could just solo if I wanted to on ANY class and make meaningful character progression. EQ does not give us those tools or the ability for any class to solo if they wanted to for meaningful progress.

    Since the tools aren't there, folks get bitter when they can't find a group and in turn rage on boxers and look for every and any reason to blame them for their own ability to not progress in a meaningful way (see the above comments all through this post for examples). Saying that truebox fixes grouping issues and botting issues is just being naive.

    To all the folks coming in making negative comments on a thread specifically asking for non truebox ideas... well, bless your little hearts. Enjoy your 6th(and counting) truebox server(HoT) without spewing your vitrol all over this thread, please.
    Oakenblade likes this.
  15. qweasy Augur

    Then you're just wrong. A bot is any program that plays the game for you, just because it's simple doesn't mean an autoclicker isn't a type of botting.

    Even if it is, so what? DPS race them, find a different place to kill, go into a pick, use an AoC. Not getting the camp you want is part of the game sometimes.
    Reht and Yinla like this.
  16. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    I'm aware that people also use other programs. I'm also aware the amount of botting on even the most recent truebox servers is nothing compared to what RF and LJ were like.

    Botting would increase if they created a TLP without truebox.
  17. Relentless Insomnia

    I would support a non-truebox server, because if you are not going to enforce the rules and ban the players on the current TLP servers that are circumventing the Trubox code then the best answer is to open the flood gates and let everyone be on the same playing field once again.

    Mangler has box armies going hog wild, using M Q 2, VMs to get around the code, and nothing is done about it. Give us a server with almost all of the aspects of Truebox but allow us to box multiple toons on a single pc. Keep Motm...the game is too easy without it.
  18. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    Not getting the camp you want because some RMTer is locking it down with a 12 box crew really shouldn't be "part of the game" it definitely wasn't originally. Picks don't help enough, there is still plenty of content that simple gets locked down by box crews. Want to camp Efreeti in classic nope tough there isn't enough good XP camps for picks to spawn. Want to camp Frenzy or AM in lower guk. Fat chance 6-12 mages at both of them, in every pick.

    DBG has already tried this. 80% of the server quits after a few months because they can't do a lot of stuff that they want, then the RMT crews leave cause they can't make money and you're left with a tiny community like LJ and RF are currently,
  19. That0neguy Augur

    In video games, a bot is a type of AI expert system software that plays a video game in the place of a human. Not sure I would call an autoclicker a form of AI.
  20. Relentless Insomnia

    I would like to add my support for a boxing server that started in Luclin similar to Selos.

    I feel this was successful in allow players to spread out and enjoy much more of the early leveling zones and mid-tier areas than they would have if everyone started in just classic or kunark. Luclin is a very fun expansion for everyone to start fresh in. Very enjoyable.