Server Discussion - Non Truebox rule set.

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by dreamweaver, Oct 25, 2019.

  1. Machen Augur


    This is EXACTLY the sort of ruleset they should NOT do on their first non-truebox server in 4+ years.

    There is too much here that much prevent people to play. If the server fails, they would blame it on the fact that it doesn't have truebox, when likely that wouldn't even remotely be the issue.
    Skuz likes this.
  2. Vicus Elder

    Yep, I agree that the first non-truebox needs to be more of a standard server but since Miragul was...100% the perfect situation to put in a non-truebox server...and they blew it..like SUPER blew it, I have no faith they will do anything correct anyways. So I put out a server ruleset that would be atleast fun to play if our playerbase wasn't scattered over 8 TLP servers.

    I mean there was forum discussion about the server for 2 full months prior to it's announcement. They had two "real" options to make it successful,
    1. Make the server non-truebox since it was SO far into the expansions. This would of been the second best option because it still would of split the playerbase.
    2. Instead of creating a clone server of one that existed, add the ability to make heroic characters to Phinnigal to boost their playbase and keep everyone on one thriving server.

    2A is not related but a level 51 or 65 heroic character for Selo's would also be a smart idea since catching up on that server is not easy because on your journey to catch up, another expansion drops and you are behind again.

    Anyhow,

    I agree a legit hard server that requires skill and coordination isn't the best choice for a non-truebox server that will have a lot of boxes that won't be able to keep up with the reflexes needed to complete difficult raids. Be a nice server for a premium subscription server though. Still a win for DBG money wise.
  3. Machen Augur


    Err, if there is one thing software does well, it is reflexes...
  4. Vicus Elder

    Come on Machen, you been around long enough to know that high end raiders playing their six characters separately is better then even the best boxer playing 6 characters at once. Plenty of raids have been saved over the years by a well time weaponshield, rez, cure, the ability to drag corpses fast to rezers, mez, ect. If you are talking a pure dps raid..then maybe I would agree but as later expansions progress, the raids arent just tank and spank. Especially on a server where you get a 20% penalty making raids harder.

    There are better box programs out there for WoW compared to the ones use in EQ and if your statement was true, then a boxer would be server first on Mythic raids instead of Method.

    Eitherway it's all hypothetical because they won't release a server like I listed and they will botch the first non-truebox server in 4 years.
  5. Machen Augur


    I've also been around long enough and widely enough to note that many of the things you mention above happen faster with software. Ever been in a raid where someone was using a scripting rezbot? They can have your corpse dragged and rezzed almost instantly, before the human clerics even realize you are dead. Scripted curer? The instant the debuff hits, it is gone, and if the programming is done well, it will cure only the ones it should and not the ones it shouldn't. I don't enjoy raiding like this, what's the point? But I've seen it enough to know that scripted boxes can be very, very good at this sort of thing, far better than real players.

    Things that involve judgment, players do better, generally. Although I'd take a scripted character over a few mains I've played with over the years, lol...
  6. Machen Augur

    I'll add, EQ really isn't rocket science. We like to think it is hard, but it really isn't. It is complex, but in any given situation, usually there is one right thing for each character to do, and someone who understands the game and the dynamics of the situation can usually identify it pretty easily.

    If software can play far more difficult games at a level beyond what most human players are capable of, eg https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-019-1724-z or https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AlphaGo_versus_Lee_Sedol , we shouldn't be threatened by the idea that good software can outperform human players in many situations in Everquest.
  7. Vicus Elder

    Aye, we have both raided with some of the same people so I will agree with that. But I also know that while a raid force will have 1-3 players that can play their box group well, there are just as many that we had to let box because we didn't have the players and half their boxes were worthless. I.E. boxing 4 warriors but only being able to play 1 at a time while the other 3 auto attack while waiting for current tank to die or defensive wear off (also having a bard and cleric in the group that literally help their group only). There are pro's and cons but I can dream of a server where challenge is real and pro players stand out:)
  8. Naturalist Journeyman

    The people have spoken.

    Non-Truebox-
    Free Trade-
    Start in The Serpents Spine expansion-
    AoC's Active (no reason not to)

    Optional - 2x or 3x XP rate full time, reduced lockouts full time, increased rare spawns full time.

    From my perspective a real group always wins over boxing, however the option to box a couple extra characters to get something done when a group isn't available is key in keeping folks happy.
  9. Machen Augur


    I mean, we are 80% of the way there on Ragefire right now. If this is what people want, they should just come play on Ragefire. AoC's would be nice, but they are basically not relevant at this point of the game. Only real thing ragefire is missing from your list is free trade.
    Kattria Minx likes this.
  10. Vicus Elder

    I also vote ragefire..IMO still the best TLP server created. Buried Sea just dropped last week so have plenty of time to catch up before they raise the level cap. Plus they have a raiding guild for nearly every timeslot.
    Kattria Minx likes this.
  11. kenmei Lorekeeper

    If it was no trade krono, I might consider it.
    Otherwise, it's just another kronofarmer-fest that dies when everyone who isn't a krono farmer leaves.
  12. Berkwin Elder

    This may upset a lot of people but, all servers should be true box, its how we did it to begin with. that being said. it is a grouping game not hey I have a great computer ill just make my own group. this game runs great on a toaster and those on a low budget do not have the means to box on more than one toaster.
  13. sauron69 New Member

    Beg to differ, I was three boxing as early as kunark once wineq or w/e it was came out. Closing off options that appeal to a variety of players isn't really a good business model. There's plenty of aoc truebox servers already and zero aoc non truebox. I don't think it's really asking for too much to at least have one and see how it goes.

    Although at this point I'm fairly sure this thread was created just to placate people when it was announced miragul was going to be truebox. I haven't seen anything to indicate they're even considering it.
    code-zero likes this.
  14. Aelivaa New Member

    Cannot tell for sure, personally i have my hopes up still.
    However I do agree that starting the thread and not adding any update if they at least consider it i creating some suspense :/
  15. Gherig Augur

    It has been a month, a new TLP came and went in that time that should not have been a Truebox Server. Can we get an update here about the progress of this topic inhouse?

    Also there is a Multi-boxer helper program that is widely used and officially accepted in every MMO on Earth but Everquest and Everquest 2, that you guys still have not publicly said it was OK but privately say its OK. Need to be more clear on it.
  16. dreamweaver The Traveler

    I believe there is an update somewhere in this thread but I can update the main post as well. This was more or less the previous update.

    There is no information at the moment and there will likely not be for the time being as the team is currently busy with beta and then with the expansion launch.

    I have shared the responses in the thread with the team and they are aware of the desire for a server based around a non-true box rule set, besides that there are no other updates at this time.

    Once there is more information to share I will share it.
    Skuz and Duder like this.
  17. Gherig Augur

    Thank you .. and this thread is so long I probably missed a page or two where the last update was, thats on me sorry.
  18. dreamweaver The Traveler


    No need to apologize! I definitely understand wanting to be up-to-date especially on a topic so many of you are incredibly passionate about.
    Hdizzle and Machen like this.
  19. Hdizzle Augur

    Things don't last for 20 years without passionate customers/users whatever...

    I think the long term loyal customer just wants a fun server (does not need to be super high population!) with a guild or two to raid with and know that they are not p_ssing their time away investing into a server that is going to be destroyed next spring. Knowing a clean slate is coming every spring is a HUGE incentive to grief because new server..

    We don't like to waste our time and investing in a truebox TLP is a proven waste of time unless your intent is to accumulate loot and cash out for krono before the floor drops out and the new TLP pops up. And if that's your bag baby go for it!

    I don't get to see your books and if the road to being financially sound is making these TLPs every spring with truebox then fine so be it. It would be a complete shame to not have a classic server with AOCs and no truebox penalty.

    If you STILL think truebox is a good idea, go make a brand new lvl 1 on Coirnav right now and go LFG. Tell me when you start raiding.
  20. sauron69 New Member

    Well thanks for the update, I guess I'll look again around the summer.

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