Sense Heading - Progression Server Changes

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Roshen, Apr 29, 2016.

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  1. Extra Extra Lorekeeper

    are the devs really this out of touch with the player base?
    Friday likes this.
  2. Nolrog Augur

    This is not a bad idea either.
  3. yerm Augur

    I want a new thread because I do not want discussion to get clouded with the various other changes and/or locked when the stickied thread gets locked. I disagree with other issues in that thread but this is the one that WILL get me to quit, so I want to focus on it.

    Roshen, the removal of Gates of Discord as a standalone expansion unlock is a complete slap in the face to myself and others who have already begun investing time into your server. This is the single worst mistake I expect you can possibly make in the management of Phinny and I want to lay out as many reasons as I can angrily fire off, and invite others to critique, disagree, or hopefully agree and provide even more.

    1. Challenge is not a problem.

    I believe you will agree that the vast majority of development effort on these servers has been on buffs to raid mobs. This attempt to make the game harder has been a defining element of these servers and easily one of the most discussed changes from past TLPs, that and instances. With all of the effort that has gone towards making content a challenge, the fact that Gates of Discord is already a difficult expansion in era should be seen as a good starting point rather than a problem.

    2. Gates of Discord does NOT negatively impact prior expansions.

    Gates of Discord, unlike almost every other expansion, actually does not take away from anything that comes before it! What I mean, very simply, is that the additions it makes do not at any point cause one to skip, avoid, or bypass anything that comes before. LDON is still equally valuable, the augment content is not really tarnished until the floodgates of Anguish in OOW. POP is still a generally preferable xp path, and exclusively superior for non-top-raiders, and guilds will want to do all of the raid content up to and through potime before they hope to enter Qvic. EVEN IF guilds find the expansion to be challenging, the expansion itself is not going to be causing a detrimental impact on the content preceding it.

    3. Omens of war DOES negatively impact prior expansions.

    The existence of OOW actually obsoletes prior content in quite a few ways. The level cap of course makes level 65- content that much easier, of course. The expansion also includes a rather significant quantity of loot that is of "raid" quality compared to prior expansions, but can be obtained by groups. Walls of Slaughter is the easiest place to look for these, also check the epic 1.5 chests. The result is that a great deal of loot from prior expansions, most notable LDON, is trivialized by content which can be obtained by a group and frequently will be sold on the market. Finally, at a raid level, OOW is significantly easier for its loot quality than GOD. The result is that pre-tacvi content becomes a general waste of time in the face of MPG and Anguish loot. A guild capable of doing Tacvi is likely able to do MPG trails and get into Anguish, which means that a good chunk of enjoyable raid content is not worth the time for a guild to do. I would wager it might even be easier to do MPG into Anguish than to high priest and zun into Tacvi, assuming level 70 and qvic+time gear for both cases.

    The very simple result of this is that GOD will be released with many raids already not worth repeating, half of txevu never worth touching even once, and almost all of its group content being a wasted effort.

    4. Gates of Discord is a cult favorite for many veterans

    For every person who decries the expansion, there's another who love it. Most importantly here, many people - myself included - are really just putzing through the current content waiting for THIS expansion. I don't want to be all dramatic and put a big ol 5. I'll quit if you do this, but, in reality, I will honestly quit if you do this... and more importantly, so will many others. This is my favorite expansion. This expansion is one that people who actually put the time through it and not quit after POP because their nostalgia ended go on to really like. Inktuta at 65 is a frequent favorite. Killing Tunat at 65 is one of the most memorable moments in everquest to the point where I can still, almost a decade later, close my eyes and visualize that corner of tacvi with everyone screaming cheers, and needing a minute to collect myself in my excitement and then start rezzing cause I was honestly that pumped. This is a feeling the dozens of raiders on Phinny, many of them doing "top guild" content in era for their first time, do not deserve to have taken away from them.

    5. Berserkers are GoD-tied and this change puts them effectively in with OOW instead.

    While hardly even close to as important as the other points, its definitely worth pointing out that GoD has a class tied to it for whatever reason and people planning to make one will be forced to do so coinciding with a level cap increase. With standalone GoD you can level your berserker and be ready for the next cap raising, including things like the epic 1.0 beforehand. With the bunding suggestion your main is liable to have needs and the 1.5 and 2.0 are coming in all along (with the bypass). While in a literal time sense there is not a delay here, in a relative content sense this is effectively putting berserker yet another expansion away.

    6. This is not something the community has requested.

    No matter how many times people talk about the wonders of POP and Al'Kabor, or list their loves, I have never once read an actual request to remove GOD as a viable expansion point. LDON and LOY, absolutely, brought up and people go both ways. DON, once, mentioned. Merging classic and kunark, starting with velious, or having each level range merged into one, all also discussed. Skipping GOD and going straight into OOW? Never, ever, not even once considered. In fact, even back on Combine when we struggled to get through and unlock OOW and considered the one snake in tacvi to be impossible without a higher level enchanter mez, even then, nobody was mentioning partial unlocks like loy and ldon had been given (I think with RZTW kill). Nobody. It was never a desire then and it's not a desire now. We do not want this change.

    Please take more than a moment to seriously consider the mistake you are proposing and not make it.
    Lithien, 1337bwr, Punchu and 8 others like this.
  4. Realitycheck Elder

  5. Ikzi New Member

    Is it 1. of april.? :cool::cool:
    PathToEternity likes this.
  6. yerm Augur

    Hopefully Rosh is actually just trolling and has actually found a lateral promotion with another country and this is his jovial way of saying goodbye or something of that nature. I don't want to imagine the OP is serious.
  7. Girth-Matters Lorekeeper

    Yes, they are. That should have been evident last fall.

    6 months in POP is a horrible idea and it's my favorite expansion. Grouping GOD and OOW is an even worse idea. I'd ask them to please stop and think about what they are doing, but that will likely make things worse. Stop thinking and revert your plan please or you will damage the server. Unless of course that is your plan. Incoming Quarm server in July?

    P.S. Luclin should NOT have MOTM. Velious' version of MOTM should barely do anything. The most recent negative resist aura is a very ridiculous and poorly thought out idea.
    Punchu and Friday like this.
  8. Semah Augur

    I thought that GoD was already rebalanced vs. what we experienced in-era on live? Am I misremembering?

    I rather liked GoD; although I never got past Kod'taz on live, I'd like to experience all that without the pressure to focus on cutting-edge OoW content.
  9. Girth-Matters Lorekeeper

    So let's arbitrarily make un-fun content harder and more of a chore but then completely gut a fantastic raiding expansion by skipping it because it's too hard.

    I feel that unpaid interns could make better decisions than whoever is running this server.
  10. Polekn Augur

    The only post Prathun liked in this thread is a troll post from somebody who does not play on TLP.
    Punchu likes this.
  11. Girth-Matters Lorekeeper

    This is where I'd like to take the time to remind the powers that be that Fippy and Vulak took a tremendous population hit because they stayed in POP too long.
  12. Pikallo Augur

    Agree 100%. Not quoting to avoid massive text wall, but I could not have worded it any better.

    Please reconsider. This seems to be a universal opinion. Often times on these forums you have staunch supporters of various ideas and plans, frequently butting heads and disagreeing about almost everything. However in this case, I strongly believe the community as a whole would support the idea of keeping GoD as its own, separate expansion.
    Friday likes this.
  13. Nolrog Augur

    Not entirely true. That is the time when the hacks occurred that shut the game down for a long time. It wasn't because they stayed in POP too long.
  14. Mysteweave Lorekeeper

    I really like what Ckador had to say. And I hope dev's will listen to everyone on here screaming NO, god No, when it comes to delaying Luclin and combining GOD/OOW. Two bad mistakes. I know a lot of people waiting for Beastlord and I can't understand why you would add six weeks onto Velious anyhow. Go ahead and add time onto Luclin before PoP if you need to, that's fine.

    Also, I'm not 'new' whatever this thing says. The forum acct is new but I've had my account since PoP was first released :)
    Banecrow and Vexed like this.
  15. Krizem Augur

    Agree...don't bundle. Maybe just keep unlocks at 12 weeks for awhile until ~ SoD.
    Friday likes this.
  16. Semah Augur

    Folks, please please be civil. :) There's nothing that makes a dev decide to stop reading a thread and start drinking heavily than hostile players. We want the devs reading this thread; we want them to reconsider.
  17. Nolrog Augur

    IBTL. They want to keep the discussion into one thread to make it easier to follow.
  18. bodes Augur

    They are saying POP won't be ready by December which is a big show of honesty and transparency. Calling this an arbitrary change of the rules means you didn't actually read or understand the situation.

    The choices are:
    A) Longer Velious/Luclin
    B) Immediately thrown into incomplete/broken POP
  19. Gremin Augur

    Hacks occured in classic of Fippy/Vulak if you referring to the 30 day shutdown to all of Sony's services.
  20. Banecrow Elder

    Same I just want my beastlord, I do not even care if I have to wait to do my epic till Luclin comes out if I can play my beastlord now.
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