Rogue Disc - Aspbleeder Issues with 6/19 Patch...

Discussion in 'Melee' started by Caudyr, Jun 20, 2013.

  1. Caudyr Augur

    I'll start with the spell info given from the winparser (parsers the spells_us.txt file for the spells) thing that parses the spells file...

    [35333/12528] Aspbleeder Discipline
    1: Increase Spell Damage by 5151
    2: Limit Resist: Poison
    3: Limit Effect: Current HP
    4: Limit Type: Detrimental
    5: Limit Min Level: 250
    6: Increase Hit Damage Taken by 0%
    7: Limit Class: ROG
    8: Increase Defensive Proc Rate by 50%
    9: Limit Spells: Group - Tallon's Tactic Poison Strike I
    10: Increase Proc Rate by 510%
    11: Limit Spells: Group - Asp Blade Strike

    A couple of issues have sprung up with this...and I have a couple of questions, as well.
    1. This, in my opinion, is the biggest issue with this patch's changes. Our Envenomed Blades AA line is an activated poison proc and should be included in the Group to get the boost in damage for the duration of this disc. However, it's not...so one of the main reasons this disc was actually worth using is gone now. Can we get this AA line added back to the boost list, please (it was boosted by the disc before, but isn't now)?
    2. It's not as important as the above one, but the Form of the Recluse illusion+proc buff doesn't get this boost, either...was wondering if this was intentional as well, and if not, could we get this added to the grouping?
    3. Why does slot 8 say "Increase defensive proc rate by 50%"? Is it just a text error with the parser and it's actually Spell Proc Chance like Lucy says (their data is outdated so not sure, heh)?
    4. Why is there a "Increase Hit Damage Taken by 0%" slot in there? It doesn't make any sense to have that there at all...it doesn't even do anything with it set at 0% (this is assuming it's not a parsing error in the spell parser, of course). (This has actually been an 'issue' since the disc was put in back at the start of the SoF add-on)
    5. Why is the proc rate only increased by 510% for Asp Blade Strike (the spell data given by the spell parser indicated that it only includes this one line of procs (3 procs) and nothing else, though some others do seem to get the proc boost...but I can't say that for sure)?
    6. It doesn't seem like the rogue only poison's proc rates are increased like the other abilities are...and if they are it's not even really noticable it seems. If nothing else can we get the raid ones added to the bigger % proc rate list? They have a really low proc rate in general, so having this disc increase them makes some sense...seeing as how they're also activated poisons.
    On another quick note while I'm thinking about it...with regards to Asp Blade...is it possible to get one or more of the following done to it so it's more viable, please?
    1. Increase the base damage of Aspbleeder and/or the type 3 aug that goes with it.
    2. Reduce the reuse on it to like...2-5 minutes. At the moment w/o using Aspbleeder it does a whopping ~85dps because it's only usable every 10 minutes and only has ~15 procs or something like that before it disappears...so it disappears in like 15-30 seconds.
    3. Vastly increase the proc count (to like...50 or 100) on it so that it lasts longer and you get more dps from it. Each proc counter added is 5.3 dps with the duration at 10 minutes, so it's really not even a mediocre disc in its present state...even with using Aspbleeder in conjunction with it it is only 13.885 dps added per counter. :(
    4. Do 1, 2 and 3.
    5. Leave the duration and reuse the same, but just take the proc counter off of it so it lasts the full length that the buff has on it. TBH, this is what I'd prefer over 2 and/or 3...along with getting #1 done (if possible, heh).
    Thanks and stuffs~ :D
    Krickitt likes this.
  2. Songsa Augur

    I have sent Aristo a pm yesterday to have some infos about new aspbleeder as the data are not very clear, we will see if we can have some clarification.
    But if i understand things well this disc went to barely noticeable DPS increased to even worse...
  3. Songsa Augur

    Ok i have parsed Aspbleeder rkIII after the patch.
    Firstable it doesnt work with envenomed blade AA anymore, why? this is a bit strange as it is a poison rogue specific proc AA.
    It works only with poisons from asp blade disc and poisons applied to our weapons (raid or group ones).
    I have tested several combination of poisons and here are the dps results :

    Without Aspbleeder disc :
    bite of the shissar + envenomed blade AA : 1439 dps
    bite of the shissar only : 1192 dps
    Tallon's tactics XVI only : 1034 dps

    with Aspbleeder rk III disc :
    bite of the shissar + envenomed blade AA : 2852 dps
    bite of the shissar only : 2547 dps
    Tallon's tactics XVI only : 2133 dps

    The duration of each parse was the time to empty the 60 counters from bite or in the case of tallon 30 tallon's for each parse.

    So the dps gain is between 1000 to 1400 dps in the parses above, that could be more accurate with longer duration (we are limited by the bite and tallon counters here) but we would be in that range of dps anyway.
    If we use asp blade in combination with it we can expect at max 16 (asp blade counters) * 5679 (dmg added by aspbleeder) = 90864 dmg/60sec = 1514 more dps (if we proc all the 16 counters in the 60sec duration of the disc.

    Comments : 1k-3k dps gain for 60sec duration / 10min reuse discipline is clearly undertuned imo as the total dps gain in 10min is 100-300 dps.
  4. Caudyr Augur

    You should almost always get all 16 procs off in that time period...keep in mind that you will never go through a Tallon or Vallon poison in that 1 minute...you may get one extra proc than usual, because of their crappy proc rate anyway. The same is true for Hero's Toxin and other poisons...you won't go through a charge of them in that 1 minute...though you will go through the non-tactic poisons quite a bit faster.

    You're also forgetting to take into account the 10 minute reuse of Aspbleeder. If the fight is short then it's ok, I guess...but how many fights are actually short these days?
  5. Songsa Augur

    Sorry Caudyr but i don't understand what you want to say here. If you only parse for 60sec you can parse it for maybe 5k dps if you are lucky with for example tallon's proc or simply 0 more dps if you don't proc at all and you will not be able to make any conclusion about the dps. Parsing for more time like i did (in GH with timer frozen of course) enable some average dps we can expect even if i know it can be less or more depending on the procs. Theres no other way to have more accurate DPS parse calculation of discs.
    On the 16 counters of asp blade it took me 75sec to have all fired so its not a guaranteee to have all 16 in 60 sec duration of aspbleeder like i said in my first post.
  6. Caudyr Augur

    Ok, I get that first part (sorry, I wasn't fully awake :p)...but with Asp Blade + Aspbleeder I usually go through Asp Blade in less than 45 seconds it seems, on average...so yeah I can see it occasionally not getting through them all during the duration of Aspbleeder.

    I'm seriously hoping the fact that Envenomed Blades isn't affected by this anymore is an oversight and isn't a stealth nerf...since as you mentioned (and I did, heh) it's an activated poison ability like our poisons + asp blade.

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