Sort of. I mean the damage *before* having critical bonus applied and before damage bonus, heroic str, etc applied has to be < 20k. So you'll see crits landing for more than 20k, depending on your veteran's wrath rank and whether it is a special attack type, but the base pre-crit figure will be < 20k. Where we witnessed it first (as it's so obvious) was when using high damage multiplier discs or AAs, such as Rogue's Fury.
This. Rogues will beat me on long events due to better disc refresh and general sustained but we will catch up hugely due our short burst damage. I find wizard burst higher than rogue and a tad lower than berserker burn And their sustained is similar to rogue sustained, so we are really both getting outgunned by wizards during a raid. Mages do seem to be doing well lately too.
I will have to check my logs Brog, I know we have some skills that definitely hit higher for base, ie Slap in the face line, but I seem to recall my normal crits going no higher than 43k ish under burn conditions.
That would be consistent with what we have seen thus far. How high do your normal hits go that accompany those 43k crits? More than 20k?
To work out the expected max given the hypothesised bug I'd need to know two things - what your crit multiplier is for that skill and what the damage bonus is. Simplified the formula is: DB + CritMult * HIT Where HIT comes from 5 + DIRoll(1 to 20) / 10 * WeaponDamage * DamageTableRoll(1.00 to 3.95), possibly all multiplied up by some other damage multiplier when discing. The crit multiplier is outside all of that. If HIT > 20k then it won't crit, I think. For most classes CritMult starts at 1.7 and goes up to 3.5 with top Veteran's Rank AA (or 2.3 for backstab with the recently added Assassin's Wrath AA), but it depends on attack type. I forget what Berserkers and Warriors get for CritMult. It's lower as they have significantly higher crit rates, but how much lower? 1.5? Does Slap In the Face use a normal attack type or is it considered a special and not boosted by Veteran's Wrath (like kick and backstab)? Do you have other AAs to boost it? For normal hits with relatively low damage bonus I'd expect you to see maybe around 66k max. If you can though post distributions of hit values and it'll probably become obvious. See http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showthread.php?t=38256 for an example discussion and how the data reveals the bug in classes other than rogues.
[27271/3313] Slap in the Face Rk. III Classes: BER/87 Skill: Hand to Hand Endurance: 411 Restriction: Out of Combat Target: Single Range: 50' Resist: Unresistable Reflectable: No Casting: 0s, Recast: 2m, Timer: 8 1: Hand to Hand Attack for 2846 with 10000% Accuracy Mod Text: You are struck in the face. So it's a normal (albeit h2h) weapon attack, maybe that means it gets the standard veteran's wrath boosts. Although I don't know the max critical hit multiplier for berserkers. 2846 alone isn't enough to trigger the bug, but when multiplied up by DI roll 20 and 3.95 as your damage table (that's another assumption btw, but I think monk is the only class to have a higher table) then we get to 22484. I'd expect this to show the bug, even without discing. Rank II however comes in at 19830 so wouldn't trigger it.
So did some parsing today in GH. Using a 30/289 damage weapon. I have max AA. I was under full burn conditions even got an RF to increase my hit rate. Things being used. Savage Spirit Reckless Abandon Frenzy of Thule Third Spire juggernaut Surge Frenzied Resolve + bard in group + rank 3 Shammy buffs. + rank 3 ranger buffs Normal Slash Hit Max: 4745 Crit Slash Hit Max: 40733 Parse Total Damage 163m/1482s I tested the slap in the face line (new one is called punch in the throat) while I was there too: Normal Punch Hit Max: 42016 Looking at the above I would need a hugely high damage weapon to get anywhere near 20k damage for zerks from normal melee, and the slap in the face line doesn't hit this hardcap your pointing too. I will have a play with our other skills but really I doubt we have other skills that come close to the 20k magic number. Log is available for you if you want it Brog, I did see if you were online.
Also while I was looking through my logs I noticed that gamparse has a small bug where it doesn't count procs as critical blasts, it counts them as normal direct damage, which is obviously wrong. Maybe I have an old version...
Did some more parsing under burn conditions while mashing my normal spam keys, highest hit was for 8.5k, again nothing near the 20k mark. Looks like this is a rogue/monk only issue.
So non-crit slap in the face won't ever hit for more than 20k? That's not what the spell data seems to imply.
If you re-read my first post where i mention a normal punch hit you will see i mention this is from slap in the face (or rather its new equivalent), punch in the throat, I also mention that this does not hit this magic 20k normal hit cap you refer to, it scored a 42k normal hit (non crit) without issue. Other than that skill nothing comes close to the 20k mark and we have no other skills that hit this hard under disc.
For clarity sake Punch in the throat/slap in the face can only be used out of combat, meaning its either our first attack in our fight or we cant use it. It also shares a timer with warcry, it is not a spam ability like backstab or the monk high damage attack, berserkers dont have anything like that.
Has this become an internal discussion? I don't want this issue to vanish into the ether, it may cause scaling issues down the road for many melee classes.
Well that's good right, maybe we'll have something to look forward to when hate rising update goes live
Good work guys. Special kudos to Brogett for tons of data gathering, and working with the monk community as well.
