Riposte Change

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Venalin, Sep 19, 2019.

  1. Allayna Augur

    Dmg based AE Hate:
    Hateful Bargain
    Insidious Denial

    Non-Dmg based AE Hate:
    Revulsion Line
    Harmonious - requires a priest class casting single target heals on you to work

    AA Non-Dmg based AE Hate:
    Explosion of Spite
    Explosion of Hatred
    Stream of Hatred

    Quick SK tutorial on AE hate for you. The hate reduction on a knight was negligible, you could also swing a 1H with the rune proc, as that's AE hate as well.
  2. Bamboompow Augur

    Have whatever attitude you want. The Get Guuders are having a field day with this patch, but the bottom line is the patch is an annoyance. Its not game breaking or OMG Quitting my subs tier of lameness. Not to that degree. Its definitely a friggen obnoxious annoyance. Another classic example of surgery with a chainsaw, complete with the collateral damage one has to expect from a reactionary dev team under the sway of a small cadre of unyielding, "One Way" type elitist players .

    Obviously raid gear and skill level mitigate the impact to the point that the usual dispensaries of arrogance (not naming any names) can claim that there is nothing to see here and to move along. Oh and Get Guud, fool. Mash them buttons. Carpel Tunnel be damned. Bottom line is some things that were a straight up mind numbing chore are now even more tedious, for no reason other than to make some player subset happy. Same with multiple mob aggro. Mash more buttons say the all knowing masters of EQ. Can we ever perhaps move this game in a direction where LESS buttons need mashing?
    Gadreel likes this.
  3. Bamboompow Augur

  4. Bamboompow Augur

  5. Gadreel New Member

    Has Machin Shin always been so annoying and so sure they are better then the rest of us poor casuals?Reading thru this it would seem that all of us who liked the way the game has been for 20 years are just idiots who should learn to play our classes. As well it comes across that MS is the best at what they do which is true if all they do is tick off people for a pastime. Well as we can not all be as great as them I hope they will be kind to us poor players.
    Venalin and Lilybeme like this.
  6. Bamboompow Augur

    Ad hominem attacks or singling out a specific guild doesn't help. Its a few specific individuals posting as well and not an entire guild. Some of which you will never convince them of anything beyond their viewpoints, so don't waste your time.
    Cadira and Allayna like this.
  7. Gadreel New Member

    True i should not of lumped MS with Allayna or the others who are calling people idiots and to learn their class.
  8. Allayna Augur

    Never called anyone an idiot, but okay. I did, however, offer some knowledge of the class that was complaining about aggro loss due to riposte changes (which is laughable).
  9. Warpeace Augur

    Except were not allowed to solve our own problems or help others. Daybreak must do it for us like server mergers to fix apparently struggling guilds. Or else your a no good ELITE raider and have no clue how the masses are effected.

    Don't blame guild leadership for seeking solution and looking outside their everything should come to them and fix their problem.
    Allayna likes this.
  10. Bamboompow Augur

    Look, you guys just want people to play decently so you don't have to train them or hand hold them or whatever, right? AKA you don't want to deal with "Projects". No one has to play as well as you all the time but there is a bar and its set at a reasonable level according to your perceptions.

    Well, if the bar is getting missed frequently enough to merit a certain degree of public concern, then where does the fault lie? How would you fix it? Serious question being asked here.

    20 year old game that is more complex than required? Flying an airplane or even driving a car is "easier" these days and takes less time to learn. Certainly less button mashing per hour.

    Acquisition cost in terms of time is ridiculous? As in 20 years worth of catch up?

    Skills and tricks of the trade either proprietary, shrouded in secrecy or no longer supported by class and fan sites?

    How do you propose this all gets fixed? Or should it be?

    Players just want to be able to play where other players are and not have it be running a Rube Goldberg machine to make it happen. You might find more useful "casuals" if they can get into the game faster to where all the players are at and the combat system was simplified. Not sure if that cuts down on the prestige of mastering something that compared to other games is ridiculously inefficient but some players have had lots of time (20 years) to learn it. Just something to think on. It can't just be players being lazy.
    Oggrah likes this.
  11. Warpeace Augur

    Reply to the derail that has nothing to do with the repo changes that didn't break EQ but made farming level 10 mobs painful.

    Ideally they would come plug and play and not need teaching, who would not like that. You might be surprised at how much teaching and coaching goes on for so called apps or prospects. But, if these top guild don't bother to spend that time they would fold. That does not mean patience goes forever to achieve the guilds standard for said classes.

    Yes I use to be a complete with apps, but now with time and better prospective you just don't generally get top end players apping to may guilds period. Those players are either already in a top raiding guild, gone "casual" or retired from the game. You have to be willing to teach and train them with standards and expectations. You also need to be willing to extend their application period if they just are not there yet but making progress or don't have applicant knocking down the door and see if additional time might help them. Seriously I have seen 3-4 moth apps because they were a wanted and needed class but honestly they were horrible. Since there was no one apping to replace them they stayed as they were not causing wipes but could be replaced if another in the class came along and was better or a Rockstar in another class that would benefit the raid.

    People have set beliefs of raid guilds or their members that probably need some objectivity. Yes members as individuals can be abrasive, however the leadership in many are bending over backward trying to find and keep talent to maintain a full 54 raid force and ideally a bench.

    Take it for what its worth or dismiss it. Its just sad to see non stop bad information for Everquest in general.
    Allayna likes this.
  12. Smokezz The Bane Crew

    You keep saying that, but you have no idea how much people help others.
    Allayna likes this.
  13. sojero One hit wonder

    I don't. I tell apps (SK) how much I hate them, how much better I am than them, you know, give them motivation. Then I prove it, and they better look at logs and parses and see the glory that is I and mimic it!
  14. Lianeb Augur

    I really don’t care how anyone plays this game. What I do care about is when a single changes is made that affects little to nothing is now game breaking to those that don’t “play” their class.
    If you choose to just auto-attack on the one class in game with hands down the best AE Agro, and then complain that a riposte change broke your AE Agro abilities. The only way to respond to that “is” git gud or learn to play, push more buttons, or whatever coin term you want to use.

    Riposte changes did not break anyone’s Agro, except the lazy player (coining a new term) because calling them casual is an insult to even most casuals I have met

    Learn the class before you spew it’s broken
    Allayna and Thancra like this.
  15. Laronk Augur

    Also some apps aren't very good with anything technical, some people pretty much need you to remote onto their computer for help setting up GINA or setting up something like Teamspeak. Some people really need help organizing their UI or Hot buttons in such a way that actually makes sense for them for raiding like setting up their hotkeys for burns in the proper order on a hot bar.

    There's a lot of knowledge required but, lots of people don't think much of it though and different people learn differently. Guild leaders and others (officers or nice people) often are spending lots of time with people new to raiding to help them learn the ins and outs that might seem minor but make a big difference to your parse. This isn't 2008 or when ever, most guilds can't afford to just willy nilly kick apps who aren't amazing.

    How would I fix it, instead of a tank forum and a caster forum there should be a forum for every class and a few community members should be given the rights to sticky posts make it so its easier for people to find information. Most performance problems in EQ are caused by knowledge gaps making it easier to know how everything works would help. It would be nice for quality information on classes be located on the official forums stickied to the top of a class specific forum. Also for spells that don't stack with other spells it would be nice to have more information in the actual spells like:

    70% haste v1, does not stack with other v1 haste only the best is applied haste v1 + worn cap is 100%

    It's more wordy but having good descriptions for every ability hosted somewhere by the everquest team so people don't have to go thru spells on lucy would be great.

    Also the game needs a dps parser built into the game, a lot of suck comes from people that don't know they're doing terrible compared to their peers. If 2 rangers grouped together and one sees he's always doing half the damage compared to the other ranger he might ask some questions of the other ranger.
    Allayna likes this.
  16. Dwimmerlaike Lorekeeper

    I use all of them but the top 2. I don't load them in case I do need CC on a pull.
    Glad it's working great for you all.
  17. Oggrah New Member

    I find it interesting how the eliteist mentaliity shown in some of the posts in this thread apparently fail to understand that different players find different aspects of this game fun. People play games for fun, and if you change a game too much and remove what people think is fun, then said players will quit.

    Is the only standard to evaluate whether if a change is ok or not, only how it affects the top and newest zones?

    If a nerf makes your characters skill 99% worse in older parts of the game (actually most of the expansions released to this game), then is that irrelevant as its not end content- or most optimal place to get a certain goal?

    This game lasts longer the more players that are online, and many play older zones for farming and nostalgy. If their character suddenly gets severly worse, and for no good reason, why should they play? Not a good incentive to develop your characters.
  18. Lianeb Augur

  19. Lianeb Augur

    If this change made anyone SEVERLY worse, I don’t know what to say.

    See my mountain out of a mole hill comment.
    And for posterity the developers have given a “good reason”
  20. Thancra Augur

    If they quit over this, they'd quit anyway, why trying to desperately please them. Also, can I have their stuff?
  21. Allayna Augur

    The issue seems to boil down to a knowledge deficit. When someone in these threads can post about how earth shattering this nerf is, while there are those in the end game that can say, “what nerf, they changed something?” comes down to ability to know the class and adapt to changes in the game. This is hardly the first change in EQ.
    Thancra likes this.

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