Ranger DPS

Where is our DPS, seems the class is slipping a bit compared to others? Daybreak has pushed the class to Range/Cast for DPS. I'm fully raid geared TOV (best in slot), TOV earring max, max aa's, Artisan Prize, all procting 18/19's augs, hero dex 2662 when using 2 hander TOV raid spear, spamming spells. Yes I know how to DPS, even with the best ADPS raid groups. Our class is 5th at best, with Zerkers, Monks, Rogues, Necros ahead us and competing Beastlords for 5th. Don't even get me started with Palies as they are now a contender with Daybreak making 99% undead x-pansion. I know some can easily dismiss this as a rant, but our class is slipping as a DPS class.

Our position seems fine considering the utility Rangers have compared to the DPS only classes you listed.

I've seen rangers putting up over 500k dps on fights like kael 1 and 2, zerkers in the 600k range. I've also seen rangers parse 100k dps on the same fight in other guilds with the same adps. Not directed at you, but the issue is usually in the player not the class.

Seems fair to me considering all of the utility and ease of dpsing via range and spells rangers get.

Isn't this where rangers should be generally?

should? no. 6th after wizards. sighhhhhh

You are at the right spot behind these others classes as a ranger, as beastlords are too.

On burn aren't wizards being placed between Rogues / Monks and Beastlords / Rangers ? Aka 4th spot around. And sustained, competing with Rangers / Beastlords ? I have seen wizards doing this, but I don't know if it's due to them being good or the Rangers / Beastlords being less good ? I think anyhow Wizards should be at least equal to Rogues / Monks in DPS output.

Ranger DPS at the moment is in a very good spot. There are obviously things we could use as quality of life upgrades but that's a trend for the other 15 classes as well. Namely a mana recovery ability and having Pureshot/Scarlet reduced to a 15m CD to mirror the other full burns (I don't count Destructive Force or Furious Rampage, their main burn is 15m or less sans those abilities). Alternatives to mana recovery would be to just remove *1:Increase spell mana cost by 100%* from Scarlet or at least let us upgrade the AA down to 50% next expansion. Aside from those 2 main gripes the state of the class is relatively well off.

There may be a need to delve more into the support you receive on raids, both in and out of group. As you said you're doing everything right, support plays an extremely large factor in ranger sustained DPS. Another thing might be changing how you tackle the event yourself. Proper feeding of a raid ranger will net you roughly 675-725k sustained on 4 events this expansion, the other 4 will be a ballpark 500-650k. Then there's Sleeper which is just a mega bummer and nobody should count for parses ;P

I'm not sure I understand the jealousy for just paladins. Any of the 3 tanks can do extremely well in a full supported adps melee group. Paladins are just going to suck balls against the non-undead mobs.

I can't believe no one has mentioned druids here ... top druids are killing the parses right now (not necro and not zerker, but definitely challenging for the 3rd class spot unless they have to heal caster groups that stand in auras).

I think ranger dps (at least on current raids) is about in the right place ... good rangers are separated from slackers on the parse. The thing about rangers is that they must manage their resources (aka mana) far more than any of the other classes near the top, especially with these marathon raids. I could see some help in that department in the next expansion without any other real changes that would make rangers a little better in dps at the top end.

And yes, wizards probably behind all the classes listed above at the end of night parse. Is what it is. Griklor's the only short event in expansion. There are no more burns on these raids, just constant throwing of dps, cycling your stuff as much as you can and managing resources (if you have to).

Rangers will never lose their spot on a raid, I'll tell you that. With no adps, our long lasting discs and scarlet cheetah fang do well on their own in ways other classes wouldn't bring to the table.

Auspice of the Hunter is amaze balls, the more adept high attendance Rangers you have on your roster, the better. ToV BETA AA consolidations were very good to us, as well.

Could we use a boost in some areas? Sure. I'm sure most classes would say they need this or that boosted. I switched to this character from a crappy healing druid in November '99 because I was interested in having more utility than ports and a 483 point heal by level 55. I never looked back and I've always been of the understanding that utility should dictate where our dps lands.

It isn't right for Rangers beating classes like Wizard, Zerker, Monk and Rogue to be consistently better at dps without absolutely breaking your keyboard clicking buttons - at least in my opinion. We're battling with Mages, Beastlords, Bards and Enchanters for the next tier of dps classes and that just feels like that's as it should be. Druids are somewhere in the middle to top tier if not focused on healing/adps support. Necros, we'll have to see after the DoT revamp is done and whatever balancing follows.

I've never really been on Team untie Bow and Melee disc timers for Rangers. I'm not sure what the Devs really think of this as being too OP or just saying no to say no. With all these 20+ minute marathon run raids we've had in recent expansions, were this to continue, I might hop on board Team separate Disc timers. It's an interesting wrinkle that if I had it to time on ToV raids, I might not fall asleep due to the boredom of EverQuest in 2020. I LOATHE Torment of Velious. This could do some really interesting things for the class to be competitive throughout the course of these raids - and I'm sorry to admit I'm one foot on board with this idea because I just don't believe Rangers (or Druids) will ever see a method to recover mana that doesn't have several days reuse time or cost 45 AA's for 10 minutes of use. We've been in need of mana recovery for years and it just falls on deaf ears.

Probably be thankful there isn't enough Dev time to nerf you now that you brought attention to your power.

The definition of burst event has definitively changed. You can probably now consider that events until the 5 min mark (300 sec) are burn event, when before it was like under 2 min. Griklor is probably the only event that fits this mark, and wizards can hit top 6-10 (unless there are 10 necros, zerkers, rogues, monks).
In the majority of events past that mark, if we consider this sustained DPS, without bard support they can end in the 15th-20th spot, probably after rangers / beastlords reaching 11th to 15th.
Mages seem to be again slightly lower than wizards, or roughly equal ? On burn events like Griklor I'm not sure they can even hit the top 10 in a competitive raiding guild.
Definitively, wizards should do more DPS than rangers and beastlords in all DPS situations, as they are a more pure DPS class than rangers and beastlords.

Saying "we're 5th in DPS behind x DPS-orientated classes" seems pretty fair to me. It's difficult to obtain perfect balance in a game in any case - I'd be frankly gobsmacked if every DPS class could obtain exactly the same DPS at the top level, so as long as the ranger gets some kind of benefit or utility that offsets them against said pure DPS classes I don't see an issue. They get good support skills/AAs and, well, can fight at range.

Seems good to me. The discussions I was seeing a couple years back or whenever it was ago where the unanimous analysis was the necs could only manage around a third of the DPS of other DPS classes seems like the kind of thing to make noise about.

a top raid ranger whining lol. if you want more dps make another char rangers have never been top dps from what i remember. only way that might happen is if they make all mobs humanoid.

Andarriel

I put forward this idea during beta and most of the other rangers crapped on me for it. I still think its the key to improving utility and dps without pushing us too out of balance relative to other hybrids or pushing us above pure dps classes.

As a side note to the OP... if your dps sucks, then its time to stop bowing when pureshot isn't up. If you have the raid 2-hander, equip that thing and get up next to the mob. Right now, melee dps with the right adps is better than bowing without pureshot running. You're welcome for your raid's dps boost!

Have you been swapping spit with Avory? Sure seems like you caught something from him.

Not quite seeing this. Obviously I am missing the "right adps," but without bowing seems to be about 60k ahead of melee with the 2hp without any modifiers. I am willing to learn.

It's my understanding that "right adps" is, in particular, shm Dissident, mnk & bst Synergies, enc NET buff - those are the ones that don't work on archery? Also any +chance to crit boosts melee not archery, as a consequence of already having 100% crits on archery, so that's also Falcon Strike & Auspice?

Heh. Since the thread was bumped. Rangers have nothing to complain about in CoV, that's for sure. Enrichment is still silly but damage is not an issue for us.

just main change, there are a few good flavor of the month options out there now, even bards with a /mel are doing decent dps these days

Hows would you like to be a wizard and only 6th being a pure dps class! Can see why i stopped playing a wizard lol. Btw my main is a ranger now ;P

Andarriel