raid group song setups and advice

Discussion in 'Hybrid' started by sojero, Jul 10, 2014.

  1. sojero Augur

    I have recently started raiding in raids with other guilds with a bard I got to 100. I am seeking advice to see if I can do things better.

    normal spell bar:

    Aria of Va'Ker
    Doben's Spry Sonata
    Psalm of the Forsaken
    War March of Protan
    Kaficus' Song of Suffering
    Arcane Hymn
    Kaficus' Spiteful Lyric
    Siavonn's Psalm of Potency
    Gosik's Aria
    Pulse of Salarra
    Wave of Quietude
    Aura of Va'Ker

    always have Aura of Va'Ker as my aura for when the spell drops for the second or 2 during melody.

    in groups I mix up songs based on if the tank needs the ac, more melee or caster dps.

    in raids I generally use:

    tank group song melody:
    Aria of Va'Ker
    Kaficus' Spiteful Lyric
    Psalm of the Forsaken
    War March of Protan
    Doben's Spry Sonata

    caster group song melody:
    Aria of Va'Ker
    Pulse of Salarra
    Arcane Hymn
    Siavonn's Psalm of Potency
    Gosik's Aria

    dps group song melody:
    Aria of Va'Ker
    War March of Protan
    Kaficus' Song of Suffering
    Arcane Hymn
    Pulse of Salarra

    If someone has any recommendations on burn setups, we generally do long sustained fights not burst so if there is do Y during main burn then do X to sustain the group.

    atm I click almost everything at once.

    we call out funeral dirge so that we have it for the longest period of time and no bards waste it.

    I use epic when shm uses theirs, or save for bun if its within the 3 min recast.
  2. Zentara Augur

    If you are in a full tank group (2-3 war, 2-3 cleric, bard), I prefer going full force tank support...drop Aria of Va'Ker and War march in this case and use Ruarrbi's Reckless Renewal and Pulse of Salarra.

    Also keep in mind that you can run more than 5 songs if you make an extended melody, and barely lose a second or two on any one song...I find this useful for melee dps groups--you can add in Dobren's Spry Sonata to give just a touch more survivability when the MT goes down.
  3. sojero Augur

    I can see the point of dropping one of the dps songs, I leave them in there as my main is sk, so dps can add to survivability, and adding in pulse for the extra heal. Reckless renewal is broken atm so I wouldn't throw that one in, I think aria would be the best to drop for pulse because I would have the aura going. and keep the DS of war march.
  4. Zentara Augur

    Reckless is by no means still broken--don't have the specific patch it was fixed in, but was sometime in the last few months. I use it every raid and it is definitely working ;)

    /ninjaedit: RRR was fixed April 2nd patch.
  5. sojero Augur

    Thank you, I didn't catch that.
  6. Sirene_Fippy Augur

    Which songs to play becomes complicated because it depends on so many variables. I would think of things generally like so;
    1. Always make sure AE songs are covered, as they are far more benefit to a full raid than one group getting War March / Pulse
    2. Always make sure Harmony of Tone is covered when you're fighting one boss
    3. Only play mana regen if your group/raid will use it (some events don't last long enough to warrant it)
    4. Fill in the rest of your melody with whatever songs provide the most ADPS to your group, from greatest to least benefit.

    Here are some things I do differently from you -

    normal spell bar -
    1 - 6 = normal melody, 6th song can be for during A Tune... disc
    7 = Crescendo
    Crescendo is a very efficient use of time for what you get (3 seconds of casting for group 3133 mana, every 42 seconds). It adds HP and END as well. I highly recommend adding it to your melody (7) like so:

    /melody 1 2 3 4 1 5 2 3 1 4 5 2 1 3 4 7

    By having this song 1/16 songs (for example) you add a lot of regen to your group with little interference to your normal melody. Song 5 will drop briefly, so try to keep songs in order of importance (1 being most important) so you keep the good stuff covered more frequently.

    8 - 10 = utility; nukes / cure / slow / charm / aura (depending)
    11 = AE mez
    12 = Single mez

    I have spell sets for group types - melee dps, tanking, & casters. I don't like to keep every melody song up because I'm really only going to use 6 of them max, and having slow etc up often comes in handy.

    Tank group -
    I usually do not play Aria in tank groups. The benefits for playing the song vs aura only are +11% spell dmg focus, and +13% chance to triple attack. I do not play Psalm of the Forsaken either (only use this for PLing), the AC is too small to warrant using a melody slot. Although still somewhat useful to tanks, I don't feel these are worth it considering the opportunity cost of playing other songs.

    My tank melody usually looks like so:

    Doben's Spry Sonata
    War Chorus of Protan
    Kaficus' Spiteful Lyric
    Chorus of Salarra
    Pulse of Salarra
    Ruaabri's Reckless Renewal

    Because I'm not playing Aria, I can melody 6 songs. If Harmony of Tone is not already covered, and you're only fighting one boss, the tank group bard should definitely do it.

    In caster groups, you usually want to drop Arcane Hymn if you have an enc/dru (Mana Reverb/Wildspark is better), as only one of these can fire per cast. Gosik is the #2 caster ADPS song (after Aria), especially for mages, so you'll want to play it second in most cases. Always play Chorus instead of Pulse if Chorus isn't already covered. Fatesong is a good option if you have a wizard heavy group, and I would only play Siavonn's if I had 2+ necros (it only works on fire/magic dots). I weigh melee songs like War March and Kaficus' Song of Suffering (for pets) more heavily than Fatesong & Siavonn's if there are 3+ pet classes in my group, and it's fairly mixed (1 mag, 1 wiz, 1 nec, etc). The ADPS from melee songs on pets is not very good, so this is another opportunity for the bard to play Chorus of Salarra or War Chorus if it isn't already being covered.

    If you're in a caster group and mana regen is not an issue (they aren't low / oom by the end of the event), Dobens can be a good choice (for events with AEs), and Harmony of Tone. It really depends what the group makeup is, if they wouldn't benefit more from something else. Sometimes I will play Dobens in a caster/melee group instead of an ADPS song when we are short healers (shammy box or paladins filling in, and often let the group die). Unless the fight is short enough (or all mage group), I almost always use regen aura in caster groups.

    My caster group melodies usually look like so:

    all mages:
    Arcane Hymn (if no enc/dru) / Kaficus' Song of Suffering
    Chorus / Pulse of Salarra
    War Chorus / March
    6 -

    all wizards:
    Aria (wiz familiar is avg 2% more spell damage than aria)
    Arcane Hymn (if no enc/dru), another AE song otherwise
    Pulse / Chorus
    6 -

    all necros:
    Arcane Hymn (if no enc/dru)
    Siavonn's Psalm of Potency
    War March
    Kaficus' Song of Suffering
    6 -

    6th song:
    Whatever provides the most benefit - usually AE songs if they aren't covered, HoT, or more mana regen (if it will be used) / war march if the group has pets. I will play Dobens in a caster group if there are heavy AEs (WK1, Bixie 1).

    Your melee group melody is good, except you might swap Pulse for Dobens if the group lacks hybrids. You also should not play Kaficus' Song of Suffering when grouped with Rogues (the proc interferes with their personal procs, which are far superior dps).

    As far as discing/burning goes, I usually do the following:

    Aria - 100 Insult - 95 Insult - 2nd best ADPS song - 100 Insult - 95 Insult

    I will run that until I'm OOM and switch back to a normal melody. For a really long fight, you'll want to use the burn melody during FE/Epic and switch back to normal after they fade.

    When discing in long events, I recommend using each disc whenever its up. Epic & FE will be up together most of the time, QT and 3rd Spire will be up at roughly the same time, and the BP isn't augmented enough by our other discs enough to wait for them to refresh.

    For events with different parts (i.e. WK1, Bixie 1, DH2) timing comes into play. You'll want to remember how long your guild takes to do these events, and plan accordingly. In WK1, I do a full burn on wave 1, epic every wave, and do FE on waves 1/3. Then I have full burns up when the boss comes. In DH2, I will epic/FE at the start, but save my other discs for Kanteer (and only when his self buff isn't up). In WK2, I do a full burn at the start, epic/FE whenever up, and stop using them when the prison guy is at 20-30%. The first few times we do each event, I have to adjust, and as we kill things faster, I have to continue to adjust. The same goes for use of A Tune... you'll want to identify the most important points to have extended songs, and use it then.

    Try to use Lyrical Prankster as much as possible as well, this really helps mages. Vainglorious Shout is also a really powerful debuff that stacks with everything, but two bards need to cooperate to sustain it. It's worth using as long as you aren't going to mess up anything (it can aggro mobs through walls and will break mez).

    A few things about disc stacking you might not be aware of -

    T'Vyl's is a lot better than Funeral Dirge, and should go first.

    In caster groups, + % Crit Damage (on DDs) doesn't stack, so discs should take the following priority (self only class discs not included):
    - Illusions of Grandeur (250%) > Group Spirit of the Black Wolf (200%) > Glyph of the Cataclysm (160%) > Fierce Eye (110%) > Intensity of the Resolute (100%) = Third Spire of Enchantment (100%)

    Whether or not your group is going to communicate this well is another story. Now that FE is a 4 minute reuse, I wouldn't worry terribly much about it.

    In melee groups, this is less important. You always want Shaman & Bard epic together, and FE as well when possible. FE has a few other stacking issues, but the proc & crit bonus makes it worth using as soon as its up.

    The HHE on Quick Time (13%) used to be really powerful, but these days we really want it for the +22% Chance to Hit. Ruaabri's Fury (33% HHE) is much more powerful. If you really want to min/max things with your group, and can get RF, you might hold off on using QT, but QT lasts so long (~3 minutes) I use it when burns start.

    The BP clicky doesn't really have stacking issues, and is amazing for everyone except necs (useless for DoTs). After the BP clicky fades (I use an audio trigger for "The _____ octave can no longer be heard), use 2nd/3rd Spire.
    Wiji, RPoo, Tutmir and 1 other person like this.
  7. Bryan Augur

    I use spell slots 1-7 for melodies, and the rest for utility/mez/crescendo/etc on raids.

    There are some raids where using AoE songs can mess with the raids, so I have two versions of each spell set saved;

    R Necro/Mage 6
    R Necro/Mage 6 (no AoE)

    That's two examples. I have spell sets for pretty much all raid situations based on group assignment and/or raid mechanics; necro/mage/wiz mix, necro only, wiz/mage only, melee, tank/healer, kiter

    Because you can keep 6 songs up (sans aria of va'ker due to shorter duration), I really only play that in a 5-song twist-style melody in mage/wiz or melee groups.

    More often than not I'm placed with necros or a necro-mix group. In that case, the benefits of having both choruses up to help the entire raid outshine the slight increase in damage of having aria of va'ker up in addition to aura.

    aura of va'ker
    war chorus
    regen chorus
    pulse regen
    psalm of potency
    gosik's (in mixed group, or I wing it based on defensive needs - resists? etc)

    In a tank/healer group;

    aura of va'ker
    war march (sometimes switch to chorus if there's a need)
    pulse (12% bigger heals)
    psalm of the forsaken
    spry sonata
    reckless renewal

    I can't say I'm right. I'm experimenting a bit at this point. It's not so easy to quantify the benefit of str, atk, dmg, and DS of an entire raid compared to not having someone run war chorus for example... or the sustain/recovery gained via running regen chorus.

    I suggest you do the same. Create a hotkey for a 6 song melody;

    /melody 2 3 4 5 6 7

    Create another hotkey for 5 songs w/ va'ker (aria of va'ker in spell slot 2 in this case);

    /melody 2 3 4 5 2 6 3 4 2 5 6 3 2 4 5 6

    For each group type you're in in raids, experiment based on group needs and raid needs (will war chorus benefit the raid more?). Once you figure out your songs and whether you'll be playing 5 or 6 songs in the melody (figure out if you'll be playing va'ker), right click the spell book icon, and save spell set; Use whatever format works for you. I usually use R or G (raid or group) followed by group type and number of songs in melody. As I said and described above I usually make a normal version and a AoE version of each so I can pick either one at the start of the raid depending on if other bard(s) are playing choruses, if there's a need, or if there's raid mechanics that makes using choruses a no-no.

    Then it's just as easy as seeing "oh I'm in this type group"... load this spell set, choose melody hotkey to move to whatever slot you usually put that button, good to go.

    If you decide to make a change later, it's easy enough to delete that spell set from the list and resave your new spell set under the same name.

    Edit: I've been questioning my decision to cut aria of va'ker from some raid groups, so don't take what I've written as gold. I'm just voicing (writing) my own experimentation and what I've learned from raiding for a fairly short duration relative to a lot of folks. The post above mine is very well written too.
    Tutmir likes this.
  8. Tutmir Journeyman

    Great writeups both of you, just have one questions Sirine:
    How does LP help mages? We actually banned swarm pets a while back (for any non pet classes) because some people have computers built before EQ was released I guess....But if there is some synergy here I do not know of I might have a leg to stand on for an exception lol.
  9. Zaknaffein Augur

    I made this post a while ago of the song lineups and hotkeys I made for my bard. Some may be outdated, I put FE in with my epic click hotkey with the recent hastened line added to FE just because it's closer in cooldown with epic than QT or other similar activated AA. I'm still not sure what to make of the new agro AA either, I have yet to use this but I also box a raid geared warrior so I really have no need to tank on the bard.

    I haven't really messed around with it or looked into it really but I am curious if Ameliorating accelerendo is of any use to toss into caster group lineup.

    I can't stress this enough. Communicate with your other bards and coordinate who is going to play which ae's and HoT. Sirene points out a lot of the situational circumstances concerning wizzards and rogues there as well and other details like the new SK buff and FD or stacking issues with druids/chanter auras and hymm and also a good Burn melody to twist in when able. Check out the other post Sirene made for bards as it was helpful in my creation of these keys/lineups I made ~

    My hotkeys, in no particular order :

    Line 1: /alt activate 15073 - Banestrike
    Line 2: /alt activate 8205 - Selo's Kick
    Line 3: /alt activate 669 - Bladed Song
    Line 4: /timer 60, /alt activate 8204 - Lyrical Prankster
    Line 5: -Empty-

    Bard Tank
    Line 1: /bandoilier activate Shield
    Line 2: /alt activate 361 - Shield of Notes
    Line 3: /alt activate 668 - Hymn of the Last Stand
    Line 4: /useitem 24 3 - Frightweave Breastplate of the Performer
    Line 5: /potionbelt activate 1 - Heal over time potion

    Line 1: /stopsong
    Line 2: /pause 10, /useitem 24 1 - Blade of Vesagran
    Line 3: /pause 5, /useitem 17 - Latent Etheric Breastplate of the Performer
    Line 4: /pause 10, /useitem 24 2 - Whisper-Wrought Plate Breastplate
    Line 5: /timer 1810, /g Bard Epic Activated!

    Melee DPS
    Line 1: /alt activate 3506 - Fierce Eye
    Line 2: /alt activate 3702 - Quick Time
    Line 3: /alt activate 1422 - Third Spire of the Minstrels
    Line 4: /alt activate 553 - Cacophony
    Line 5: /timer 6000

    Caster DPS
    Line 1: /alt activate 3506 - Fierce Eye
    Line 2: /alt activate 3702 - Quick Time
    Line 3: /alt activate 1421 - Second Spire of the minstrels
    Line 4: /alt activate 553 - Cacophony
    Line 5: /timer 6000

    Line 1: /alt activate 777 - Funeral Dirge
    Line 2: /rs Funeral Dirge on %t!
    Line 3: /alt activate 544 - Song of Stone
    Line 4: /alt activate 359 - Dance of Blades
    Line 5: /timer 7200, /disc thousand blades

    AE mez
    Line 1: /stopsong
    Line 2: /alt activate 8261 -
    Line 3: /pause 25, /cast 7 - Wave of Quietude
    Line 4: /alt activate 244 - Lure of the Siren's Song
    Line 5: /timer 1200

    Line 1: /stop song
    Line 2: /alt activate 3704 - Selo's Sonata
    Line 3: /alt activate 231 - Shauri's Sonorous Clouding
    Line 4: /timer 90, /doability 3 - Track
    Line 5: -Empty-

    The rest of my hotkeys are the usual bard ones like a Fade hotkey and a mez key. I have a key with just /stopsong in it. I also have a key that does harmony of tone and Requim of time. Bellow and sonic displacement are on thier own key as well for pulling purposes. I have a few hotkeys linked to the same key as well but nothing of too much import.

    Now my song lineups depend on what group I get placed in. Melee DPS, Caster DPS, or Tank group.

    My Melody1 when A tune stuck in your head isn't on, is the same spell gem rotation as before:
    /stop song
    /doability 3 - Track for me
    /melody 1 2 3 4 1 5 2 3 1 4 5 2 1 4 3 5 12 - spell gem 12 is Motlak's lively Crescendo

    My Melody2 When A tune stuck in your head is active
    /stop song
    /doability 3
    /alt activate 8261
    /melody 1 2 3 4 5 1 2 6 3 4 1 5 6 2 12 - spell gem 12 is Motlak's lively Crescendo

    Caster DPS - Aura of Salarra
    Aria of Va`Ker
    Arcane Hymm
    Pulse of Salarra
    Kaficus' Song of Suffering-(if Mages)-Siavonn's Psalm of Potency(If Necros)
    Gosik's Aria
    (Fatesong of Protan)

    Melee Dps - Aura of Va`ker
    Aria of Va`Ker
    Arcane Hymm
    Kaficus' Song of Suffering
    War March of Protan
    Doben's Spry Sonata (Gosik's Aria if rangers in group, Fatesong of Protan if Beastlords)
    (Gosik's Aria if rangers in group, Fatesong of Protan if Beastlords, Chorus of Salarra if neither)

    Tank lineup - Aura of Va`ker
    Pulse of Salarra
    Doben's Spry Sonata
    Dirge of Dreams
    Kaficus` Spiteful Lyric
    Ruaabri's Reckless Renewal
    (Psalm of the Forsaken)
  10. Sirene_Fippy Augur

    This spell:

    [35937/7526] Salvo of Many Rk. III
    Classes: MAG/97
    Skill: Evocation
    Mana: 1622
    Target: Line of Sight
    Range: 300'
    Resist: Fire
    Reflectable: Yes
    Casting: 0.75s, Recast: 9s, Timer: 6, Rest: 1.5s
    1: Decrease Current HP by 3543 (If At Least 1 Pet On Hatelist)
    2: Decrease Current HP by 3897 (If At Least 3 Pets On Hatelist)
    3: Decrease Current HP by 4780 (If At Least 6 Pets On Hatelist)
    4: Decrease Current HP by 7439 (If At Least 10 Pets On Hatelist)
    5: Decrease Current HP by 10787 (If At Least 15 Pets On Hatelist)

    If 14 pets are on the mob, this spell isn't worth casting. However, if there are 15 pets (i.e. 2 bards used LP + 3 mage pets) it becomes the best mage spell in the game. LP is such a fast reuse, and the pets last for so long, it's really a big help in allowing mages to use salvo.

    I can see why guilds would want to ban swarm pets, as they aren't great DPS, but pets no longer cause any push so this should only be a # char models on screen issue. I wonder if they could add an option to hide non-afk pets (since we have hide AFK pets now).
  11. Zentara Augur

    If your rangers are keeping an auspice rotation up and running, is the bard epic really doing much for a melee dps group in a raid burn...Best auspice is 200% accuracy, while bard 2.0 is just 140%?
  12. Reviled Elder

    Sirene, what is your Melee DPS lineup? I'm typically in my guilds biggest dps parsing group, Brd, Shm, Zerker, Rogue, Rogue, XX. I wasn't aware of the proc issue with rogues, and played SoSuffering in my line up. My lineup is usually:


    I always have the DPS aura up, so i never really sweated the 2-3 seconds Aria would drop in my melody /melody 1 2 3 4 5. Is the END gain from Cresendo worth doing for this group?
  13. Silv Augur

    I just did an overhaul of our 'ADPS chain' during raids and wanted to add to this a little. I'll note this is just how *we* do it and is by no means perfect and may not necessarily work for everyone. It requires communication beforehand and people in your group really paying attention. The duration is how long each "phase" lasts (and not all of the components in a phase) so the next step shouldn't start till after it's over:

    (0). Fierce Eye + Vesagran + Bard 3rd (~1min duration) - If the Enchanter is waiting a slight bit before popping the mega-burn ADPS this is a good startup because it will all be refreshed by the time I suggest using it again.

    1. Illusions of Grandeur + Ench 3rd Spire (2 min duration) - No, the damage mods do not stack but the +Chance to critical does. Pushing caster DPS closer to 100% crit with a 250% damage mod outweighs the loss of having 3rd spire separate. Plus, 3rd spire will refresh well before IOG so you can usually get it in again at the end of the rotation.

    2. Group Spirit of the Black Wolf + Bard Epic (3 min duration) - Again, the 2nd highest damage mod (wolf) with added chance to crit hit.

    3. Fierce Eye + Bard 3rd Spire (1-2 min duration) - crit change, damage mod, and +damage.

    This isn't completely Bard specific but it may help. Most importantly, don't pop FE while IOG is running. Your Enchanter will have a B-fit about it. For Glyphs, self, and other damage mods, I leave that up to the Wiz/Mage/Necro to decide provided they know what is coming when (e.g. Spires, Fire Core, Mana Charge, Glyph, the million Wiz AA).

    I don't know specifically what our Bards run in a caster group in general though, I'd have to ask.

    Our Bards do use the pet thing to help Mages with Salvo though. We banned most other swarm pets aside from that.
    RPoo likes this.
  14. RPoo Augur

    I wish I could highlight the part about not popping FE while IOG is running, and not using arcane hymn in a group with a chanter.
  15. Behelit Augur

    Do you mean Bard 2nd spire? their 3rd spire doesnt effect DD damage.

    Also is this lineup assuming low/no rangers on raid? Because with Auspice running there isnt a need to stack Third Spire of Enchantment with IoG, casters will be at or near 100% crit rate from those two alone. allowing you to save Ench 3rd spire for later.

    I'd think you'd want two lineups depending on the situation. If you're going for max dps than IoG->GBW->GoC->FE->7th->Ench 3rd spire as Sirene posted. If you're trying to have crit dmg mods running for as long as possible however you'd want to run IoG->FE->GBW->FE->GoC->FE->GBW->FE->Ench 3rd->GoC->FE->IoG->FE->GBW->FE.... ad nauseam. basically you if you stagger it carefully a caster group with 1 bard, 1 druid, and 1 enchanter can have constant crit-dmg mod running in one form or another.
  16. Sirene_Fippy Augur

    A while ago I parsed accuracy % mods, and decided they stacked. The bard 2.0 added ~4% accuracy, and the SK epic (40% accuracy) added ~1.5%. I am going to parse it again, because I don't think my parse was long enough.

    One of the things about stacking bard 2.0/FE is the reuse time is so fast, and they last so long, we may as well use them even if (for instance) you only get the + DD/DoT crit chance on it.

    Most commonly (same as yours):
    Kaficus' Song of Suffering
    War March
    Arcane Hymn
    - Overhaste Aura

    With more hybrids, I might play regen and regen aura instead of Dobens if it's a long fight, or Fatesong (rangers use 50/50 fire/cold I believe, BST use mostly cold). If I'm with all rangers, and they're bowing, I will drop Song of Suffering for something else.

    It may still be worth playing, it depends how many rogues the raid has (and if they are using their TZ/VZ poison). It's something that probably needs to be parsed. The idea is, you can only make one melee proc per swing, so if all those swings are being taken up by SHM/BRD procs it is possible their DPS is lowered considering their posions aren't going off as often. Then again, it might be better for said rogue to temporarily buffblock Kaficus instead.

    I'm not sure it's modded (it probably is) and I can't test it right now but the current rk 3 crescendo should be 74 * 4.2 = 310 endurance = 44 endurance per tick, compared to 67 (Pulse), 41 (Chorus), 17 (Aura of Salarra). The heal portion is ~ a 7k group heal. In a typical melee group for me, we lose Doben's for ~ 10 seconds and get a bunch of regen out of it, which is a good trade imo. As far as this being enough regen to actually matter, I don't really know. I'm sure it's worth using in ToR, and is worth using if someone dies, at least (and the horn clicky!).

    Most of the effects on FE/IoG don't "stack," but do the buffs physically overwrite each other? I'm just wondering why an enc would be upset about it. FE (1:47 duration, 4:00 reuse) also adds a bunch of other stuff (including spell info for clarity):

    [38603] Illusions of Grandeur
    2: Increase Chance to Critical DoT by 10%
    3: Increase Critical DoT Damage by 110% of Base Damage
    5: Increase Chance to Critical Nuke by 10% and Increase Critical Nuke Damage by 250% of Base Damage

    [12519] Fierce Eye Effect
    2: Increase Chance to Critical DoT by 10%
    3: Increase Chance to Critical HoT by 10%
    4: Increase Chance to Critical Heal by 10%
    5: Increase Chance to Critical Nuke by 10% and Increase Critical Nuke Damage by 110% of Base Damage
    8: Increase Hit Damage by 10%
    9: Increase Proc Rate by 300%
    11: Increase Critical Hit Damage by 10% of Base Damage

    Thanks for sharing your disc strats, I find things like this really interesting, and it's a lot more difficult to figure out on your own.
  17. Silv Augur

    Er, maybe it is second spire, sorry.

    Our rangers usually save Auspice for mid/later in fights but then again, we don't have many usually so that's another difference. Like I said, it's how it works for us but without knowing specific makeup of an entire guild nothing will be a perfect fit. So in my situation stacking 3rd with IOG yields a better result. Increasing the crit rate on IOG (with the higher damage mod) is better than 3rd alone for us when you take into account glyphs and personal abilities/clickies that can fill any gaps between the setup.
  18. Silv Augur

    Sirene - Casting FE once IOG is running will drop IOG from everyone in the group. I've seen it countless times. It was more frustrating when the IOG recast was 18 minutes versus the 4 on FE. That is why it would be upsetting (given the superior duration and damage mod). So, you couldn't even stack the increased crit chance of IOG and FE because you can't run both.

    Edit: And sorry for two posts in a row... my quote/edit on the last post was screwing up in my browser for some reason.
  19. Zahrym Augur

    IoG should never be used on a main burn anyway...there are better effects. For all four caster dps.

    A typical group for a beastlord is bard/sham/zerk/rog/beast +1 the last one I prefer as a ranger, but can be anything really.

    In a perfect world your chanters either use issuance of MR or single target MR on your hybrids (beast/ranger) which means in group you drop hymn and sing cold focus. Singing cold focus is several thousand sustained DPS for both a ranger and beastlord.

    A perfect bard hits epic on cooldown in sync with shaman (when we can use it for the full duration or a short burn) & hits everything immediately on engaging on a 'big burn' to allow for the biggest period of overlap on buffs for everyone else. A perfect bard also knows how to use everything including things like Tune stuck in your head etc. in the proper situations. Don't ever let Aria fall etc. Also don't forget Dance of Blades is a very effective debuff, not just a dps disc. Best bard I've seen burn was like 72k? or something this expansion, however things like TZ/VZ proc'ing DoB early (super malo) can get them slowed asap.
  20. Zahrym Augur

    If your rangers aren't doing 2 auspice per combat engage they aren't doing it properly. If the fight lasts the 8-10 minutes or whatever the CD is now you can tranquil one then MGB one the second it's back up. 3 rangers can keep auspice up for 10+ minutes.

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