Raid Currency

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by McJumps, Sep 12, 2019.

  1. McJumps Augur

    Starting with Veil of Alaris each raid gives currency which may be used to purchase raid gear from a vendor. The intent being, I imagine, for players to be able to buy gear that might not be dropping due to RNG or, maybe they have hit some bad luck on bidding. On live there is usually about 12 months between one expansion and the next, but on TLP we have a maximum of 3 months with a level increase expansion.

    Would it be worth discussing doubling the amount of raid currency from 10 per raid to 20 per raid on TLP? (If this is even possible without affecting live servers) I think this would be fair considering having 1/4 of the time in a given era and would not be too large an increase in power before the next expansion launches considering some of the best items in T4 (i.e. weapons and Chest gear) are 400+ currency. At the current rate, with 8 T4 raids, it takes a minimum of 5 clears to obtain a premium piece of gear like this, assuming 100% raid attendance.

    Would appreciate other players take on this and maybe some feedback from the development team. Thanks!
    Trow, Baldur, Yeah and 7 others like this.
  2. Warpeace Augur

    I really don't see a reason why not besides someone else had to walk uphill both ways in the snow when it was current. Its also been mentioned multiple times how TLP servers with accelerated expansion unlocks are hampered by adhering to the original live drop rates and need, deserve increases to match.
    Skuz likes this.
  3. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    I’m of the opinion everything content wise on TLP servers should be accelerated to account for the 25% lifespan in each expansion compared to what Live players experienced starting in SoF, the beginning of the year long expansion schedule.

    EXP Rates should be at least doubled
    Named spawn rates should be at least doubled
    Raid currency and raid chest drops should be at least doubled
    Raid flagging should allow for a single clear of a tier to progress you to the next tier of raids

    Honestly, all of these should not be controversial for TLP changes on servers that go beyond SoF. Players stay on TLPs past SoF not for nostalgia but for the ability to see and beat the content they may have missed or skipped or never got to see. By accelerating the rate of EXP acquisition, hunter achievements, gear acquisition and raid progression this just allows players a better chance to see all the content and do everything before the next expansion launches and everyone moves on to that.
    Skuz, McJumps, Froger and 2 others like this.
  4. Oakenblade Augur

    I don’t think this is an unreasonable request
  5. SoandsoForumUser Journeyman

    I don't see myself ever playing on a TLP in these expansions, but solidarity for our brethren, seems like a good change.
    Pumpernickel, FluttyMan and Skuz like this.
  6. McJumps Augur

    Thanks for the feedback guys. I see that a dev changed the original title of the post, so maybe someone saw it, even if they didn't post a reply. Here's hoping we can get this changed before Rain of Fear, since there are only 3 T4 raids and not 8 like VoA. That means 6 or more clears of T4 to get a robe/chest as compared to 5 clears in VoA.
  7. Briano Journeyman

    This would be a welcomed change.
  8. Nolrog Augur

    I have been thinking about this off and on this weekend (especially when using the raid coins and while raiding). The OP makes a good point. This content was originally designed to last at least twice as long as it will on the TLPs (I can't remember if these are the 6-month or 1-year expansion cycles). It's not a bad to double the reward on all servers, not just TLP (this is older content, so it really shouldn't impact live servers too much.)
    Skuz likes this.
  9. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    Every expansion from SoF onward was part of the 12-month expansion cycle that Live servers are currently in. There may be a month shift here or there but largely these expansions were designed to entertain for a year.

    Every TLP currently active save for Selos, is proposed to go through these expansions in 25% the time, 3 months.

    They did make changes to raid progression which is seeing us be able to complete tiers about 50% faster which is a good solution to that issue.

    But I would still argue raid progression is only one piece of the TLP equation.

    EXP, Raid Drop Rates, Raid Currency and Named Spawn Rates are all factors as well.

    They should really consider applying:

    • 2x EXP modifier on all TLPs once they reach SoF
    • 2x Named spawn rate modifier on all TLPs once they reach SoF
    • Double the output of every raid Chest from SoF+ (we are talking about 10-20 NPC entities per expansion). — They already did this in Underfoot except for the Audience with Brell chest.
    • Double the amount of coins rewarded for every T2 VoA+ raid (we are talking about 10-15 raids per expansion)

    The first two points are already in place on Selos, which is good for a 1-month expansion server in early content. But its also appropriate for other slower (3month) servers that reach SoF+ content. I distinguish this point because this is where you start to get spreadsheet assigned group loot. IE if you want a caster earring from Tier X you have to camp Named A or B. Also another piece of content designed to entertain players starts in HoT+ where you get hunter achievements. This gearing and achievement seeking process in the group game was designed to occupy players, largely those that rely on a few boxes and Mercenaries not full groups of humans, up to a year. Also SoF+ is when you start to see 1000+ AAs getting unlocked every 3 months. Yet TLP servers see the content relevant 1/4th that timeframe, so doubling the rates of Named spawning and EXP would be beneficial.

    The third point was already done in Underfoot. I can’t speak to the effort involved in this but on its face we are talking about a very limited number of entries in the database. Each expansion from SoF+ only has about 10-20 raid events with unique chests/boss corpses that drop loot. The turn around for doing it in Underfoot seemed quick to an outside observer but perhaps a dev can share insight as to how tedious this was for them to change. If this is something they could consider, I’d encourage them to look into doing it in RoF next as the next TLP to unlock an SoF+ expansion is Phinigel in 2 months with RoF. Then backfill SoF/SoD/HoT before working on CotF and onward.

    The fourth point would be a new thing. But again seems like it’s a simple value change. To my knowledge all raids VoA T2 onward rewards a flat 10 coins. Each expansion only has about 10-15 Raids where coins are awarded. But again with our code who knows if this is true.

    The reason these things aren’t already on Live servers is they want some balance in raid, EXP, and gear progression so that players aren’t all finishing up the content in the expansion in a month and then quitting a few months later after farm mode has gotten stale. This is a legitimate concern when we are talking about 12-month expansion cycles. However this isn’t one that TLP servers share. With something new always on the horizon 3 months down the line there’s no one burning out in 1 month and quitting. There may be people already done with all their AAs and achievements in VoA, but they’re going to stick around for 2 months raiding weekly to get gear and then be ready for the next expansion launch.
    Mithra, Skuz and Gnomore like this.
  10. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Raid currency and the items on vendors has always been considered a bonus so I don't think you will ever see them increasing it in response to the time constraints on the TLP servers. This would be like asking for them to increase the number of drops from everything in order to gear up in time for the next expansion in the shortened time on the server.
  11. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    Which they already did in Underfoot. They should just push that change across all off the year long expansions, SoF+.
  12. Gnomore New Member

    I think these would be welcomed changes across the board. I am also wondering if the non level increase xpacs post SoF should be a 3 month cycle as well with as many AA's, progression and achievements that there are to obtain. It feels like 2 months will not be long enough for expansions like CoTF, EoK, etc.
  13. Theka Elder

    Another way to combat the currency constraint would be if they cant double the currency then half the vendor prices. They could make it so that every time an expansion launches the previous expansions vendors sell at half price, hell they are just looking to make some coins and move wares and traffic has been reduced :)
  14. McJumps Augur

    I think what they did for Underfoot was a good idea. Double the amount of loot from raid chests. This would negate the need for extra raid currency in my opinion. Although doubling both loot and currency would not hurt during the 8 week expansions like CotF. Having only 8 weeks to gear up for TDS, which has some pretty difficult events, is going to be sketchy.

    It is a bonus when you have an expansion lasting 12 months, but as it stands on TLP, people are going to need to use raid currency to even have a hope of gearing out completely before the next expansion launch. Raids at this point assume that most people attempting them are geared appropriately (i.e. top tier gear from the last expansion). As it stands we will eventually hit a point where an expansion launches and no one can beat the end game content at launch due to lack of gear. This will cause people to have to farm gear from lower tiers of the current expansion to be able to be able to do the higher tiers, and while this is not an issue on live where they have a year before another expansion, its going to catch up with us on a TLP.

    I'm not sure why you think asking for them to increase drops so that this doesn't happen is such a ludicrous idea. The intent of the TLP servers is to PROGRESS. If a lack of gear impedes that progression then I think it needs to be examined. Phinigel still has to make it through VoA, RoF, CotF, TDS, EoK, RoS, TBL and two future expansions before we are current with live. I don't want a lack of gear and the inability to complete content in era to cause a drop in population making it impossible to get there.
  15. Kujoe Journeyman

    Increasing raid currency (for expansions which drop them) and raid keys/flags/back flags will assist those individuals looking to start on an advanced server (such as phinny), return to an advanced server, roll a new alt, or even roll a new main. AA experience and regular experience should also be pro-rated for the servers accelerated time line, for the same reasons as above. Trying to squeeze a 1 year expansion of exp/AA/keying/etc. into 2 or 3 months is not a problem in early expansion life cycles, but when keying/flagging requires multiple clears of lower tiers to advance, and AA counts are in the 1000's, it is time to pro-rate the gating mechanisms of the expansion to be in line with the expansion's accelerated life style.
    Briano likes this.
  16. Skuz Augur

    I believe this is entirely reasonable.

    An example of "doing this right" was recently done by Ngreth for the RoF unlock schedule.

    Live servers required 9600 shards handed in to unlock Tier 3 & 4

    Phinigel was on a pretty good tear with it's 4guild+stragglers at 6400 shards handed in but we as a community had lobbied for the expansion to not be staggered at all, or at least for the requirements to be lowered.

    So what Ngreth did was look at how many shards were required on a live server & then adjust it basically for the amount of time each server had a speed-up factor on TLP.

    So now moving forward TLP on 6 month unlocks get a hand in shards requirement of 4800 (9600 /2), 3 month unlock servers require 2400 (9600/4) and one month unlock servers require 800 (9600/12).

    So there is already at least some precedent for taking a second look at how the timescale on TLP should be managed, raid currency is the easiest factor to adjust for TLP though I do understand this may be a global system & it might not be possible to adjust for individual servers right now I think this is something that absolutely should be done.

    Even if an increase directly proportionate to the unlock schedule is not done, something like 0% extra currency on 6 month unlock servers, 100% extra currency on 3 month unlock servers & 300% on one month servers is a pretty decent compromise given those huge disparities between pace of unlock & currency availability.

    So then you would have:
    6 month TLP: unlock speed x 2.0 currency speed x 1.0
    3 month TLP: unlock speed x 4.0 currency x 2.0
    1 month TLP: unlock speed x 12.0 Currency x 3.0 (add in x 0.5 raid timer unlocks & you have currency availability at x 6.0).

    If we wanted to have TRUE proportional currency availability directly comparable to live it would look like the following (not what I am asking for just here to show simple number equivalency).

    6 month TLP: unlock speed x 2.0 currency speed x 2.0
    3 month TLP: unlock speed x 4.0 currency x 4.0
    1 month TLP: unlock speed x 12.0 Currency x 6.0 (add in x 0.5 raid timer unlocks & you have currency availability at x 12.0).

    Reasonable? I think the logic speaks for itself.
    Darkhain and Mithra like this.
  17. Machen Augur

    While I like the idea of some enhanced unlock speeds, you don't need the full proportional unlock and currency speeds you suggest.

    Live expansions were not designed to take a year to beat + gear. The devs well knew that most players would be done with the content in far less time than that. For the most part, live guilds SoD onwards that were able to beat current content in era were not still raiding current content every week 11 months after the expansion launched.

    You really do not ever need 12x anything that live got, or 6x currency. Even on a server like Selo with 1 month per expansion.
  18. Skuz Augur

    Reading comprehension appears to be something you lack at times.

    Perhaps selectively taking things out of context wasn't deliberate, but that's how it looks.

  19. McJumps Augur

    I'm glad someone else brought this up again. Especially considering starting in Call of the Forsaken, which Phinigel is about to hit, some of the items are ONLY available to be purchased through a vendor with raid currency, they do NOT drop from raids. Staff of Glaring Divinity comes to mind, which is a Best in Slot weapon for monks.

    We are also in the era of Chase items. Items that will continue to be valued/used for the long-term instead of just for a few months. With these Items costing almost double what other items in the same tier cost, given the short amount of time TLPs are in each expansion, it will be impossible to accrue the needed amount of currency to obtain some of these items.

    I would ask the devs to at least CONSIDER implementing something for TLP similar to what they did for the Shards Landing portal. If not changing the amount of currency given for each raid event because the code effects all servers, then change the price of items on the currency vendors for TLPs.
    Skuz likes this.
  20. Skuz Augur

    This is a totally bogus argument, regardless of whether they "designed" it that way or not in your personal opinion, live servers HAD a full 12 months in era to work with, not less, they didn't get expansion release dates based on how fast guild beat the raids, ever.

    If expansions were NOT intended to last 12 months they would not have been releasing them 12 months apart, it makes absolutely no difference that some guilds were beating them faster or not, so yeah, like I said, bogus argument because you are actually saying that TLP players should not be afforded the same opportunities as live ones were on the basis of a personal opinion no more.

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