Prison Server Mega Thread

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Benito, Apr 11, 2022.

  1. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    MooseUhLeany likes this.
  2. Bardy McFly Augur

    See my thread regarding Live version of Rizlona! :D:rolleyes:
  3. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Benito's Assessment

    The Problem:

    Automators are concerned with wealth and power acquisition without competition from other players (rolling on items or splitting platinum) and the limitations of real world factors (fatigue, time management, social obligations). For instance, a botter wants multiple sets of Type 5 augments for his crew but seeks to acquire it at a steady pace (no other players, overcome RNG by long duration play).

    Automation and other software (mods) grants advantages to gameplay not offered to general players.

    Negative externalities from automation and other software includes the following:

    1. Camp and mob monopolization. The ability for automated players (whether they are on the computer or not) to remain on camps for dozens of hours or even days disrupts gameplay for rule-abiding players.

    2. Skewed market effects. Botters, through 3rd party software, unjustly acquire popular items, chase items, and platinum through cheats. For chase items (Blood-Soaked), botters overcome the strain of RNG by increasing the volume of mobs they can kill. This gives them advantages not offered to rule-abiding players. Botters also stockpile the wealth to hoard heritage and LoN crate illusions or Blood-Soaked items. This takes rule-abiding players out of the market.

    Again, some may believe that they are in the right and that they are "not hurting anyone." But society is governed by the rule of law and equal application of justice. We have rules against noise and toxic pollution (negative externalities/tragedy of the commons) for good reasons even through the perpetrators may themselves feel to be within their rights. There is a famous legal quote: "Your rights end where my rights begin."

    We can conclude that botting and other forms of cheating are detrimental to the game's health.


    The Solution:

    Prison Server.

    Botters should be forced to a prison server if Daybreak decides to normalize automation and other cheat software. Anyone caught automating or cheating on Live thereafter would be permanently banned.

    The prison server would have:
    • Their own patcher.
    • Staggered expansion release schedule (behind Live).
    • Staggered raid NPC access (behind Live).
    • Krono would not be transferable outside of the server.
    • No character transfers off.
    • Limited Customer Service.
    • A /testcopy-like function could allow players to transfer on.
    Botters would not be able to affect markets or take up CS time. Staggered release would prevent the drama of "firsts" and rankings. These penalties are also statements that Daybreak does not endorse cheating but would funnel automators to their own server. The carrot for rule-abiding players would be current content.
    Foxseven likes this.
  4. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Press like for any proposals. Please keep responses constructive and on merits.
  5. Bardy McFly Augur

    You'll never get buy-in with staggering content. There's also no official leaderboard, so it's easy enough to simply discount any "firsts" from the "jail server" if anyone cares that much.

    They also probably can't legally block Krono from that server. That would be up to the lawyers. This would require a new RMT currency.

    Both would require significant extra effort for minimal difference.

    Personally I don't care about the Krono transfer as I don't have any skin in the game since I only buy them. Just pointing it out.
    Waring_McMarrin likes this.
  6. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    The alternative is a permanent ban.

    The fact that you have decided not to chargeback your accounts (despite earlier claims) shows that the threat of bans works.
  7. Kindertime Journeyman

    Just suspend them all for 7 days, at least, on May 2nd. Message sent and Problem solved.
  8. Bardy McFly Augur

    It was never an idle threat. I just thought through it more.


    My decision not to do the chargeback was to see how this plays out. Suspension = I let my subs fall off with the hope that, per current discussions, a box-friendly Live server comes along in the future that I can come back and transfer my toons to. I'm already 116 now, anyway, so feel I have now actually used the content I purchased in some manner and after further thought don't think a chargeback would be appropriate in that regard.
  9. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Honestly I would rather see them enforce the rules instead of giving the cheat makers a server where they can improve their programs with no fear.
    Arkanny, Chikkin and Khat_Nip like this.
  10. Bardy McFly Augur

    The cheat makers would just make a new free account on Live. That point is moot.
  11. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Should Daybreak start to more aggressively ban? I feel like they are trying to find a compromise but they are caught in a hard place (don't want to ban). I think a prison server (on its own patcher) could be a constructive solution.

    The cheat software developers are already seeking to improve their programs on Live. Someone posted a screenshot of a developer saying that he was looking for ways to get around it (i.e. make the software more evasive).
  12. Bardy McFly Augur

    Call it what you want, but we're in agreement on the types of players and giving them a home.
  13. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    I support the current regime of suspensions and bans.

    However, the fact that Daybreak is allowing 3rd party software discussion has me thinking that they are seeking feedback.

    There can be some concessions (a prison server) with penalties (content staggered from Live, Krono restricted to the server).
  14. Bardy McFly Augur

    I agree and commend them for hearing us out. I've been in some hot topic discussions in the past and they've been pretty good about letting things play out as long as people remain civil.
  15. Smokezz The Bane Crew

    LOL, are you serious? You complain about others making new threads and you just did it yet again. If there is ever going to be a thread about concept and policies how about letting the company that makes the game do it. You don't work for them.
  16. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    You're right. I probably should get paid for my feedback. (Prathun listened and implemented my idea of a character delete name confirmation prompt). I work pro bono. LOL.
    Bardy McFly likes this.
  17. Bardy McFly Augur

    I've had a number of my free ideas come to fruition over the years too. :cool::rolleyes:
  18. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    And Daybreak should make it easier for them by signaling that they tolerate cheaters by not banning them?

    You seem to be pushing for a way to let cheaters stay in game a lot.
    Smokezz likes this.
  19. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    How so? The current 7 day suspension seems to be a "slap on the wrist." It sounds like you'd much prefer the effects of 7 day suspensions over either the permanent relocation of botters or permanent bans.
  20. Bardy McFly Augur

    As much as we hate to admit it, the number of players that have received suspensions is a pretty significant number of accounts/players, and having that revenue simply go away doesn't help anyone, not even single-account players. This is a big reason that DPG has looked the other way for so long, maybe more so out of flat necessity in previous years.

    I've been trying to help solution out a viable plan that appeases everyone (box players, single account players, DPG). I'm open to any suggestions short of continuously suspending or just banning and willingly sending off that many paying accounts.

    Also keep in mind that many of these accounts are much more than a monthly subscription. Many buy one or more of the monthly perks, the annual expansion packs, XP potions, vanity items from the shop, and Kronos to spend on gearing out extra boxes. The revenue loss is much more than just a subscription per account.