Preview of Upcoming Changes to Combat Escape AA Abilities

Discussion in 'News and Announcements' started by Dzarn, Sep 30, 2019.

  1. Duder Augur


    All of this, summon companion needs work. Since pathing is so poor, in most raid scenarios, pets end up doing next to nothing. In a raid like Ralaifen, often I cant even use my bst bp click, or other abilities that require my pet be in range because hes off who knows where and I cant summon companion because of the fade component.
    PCSS likes this.
  2. Balthen Journeyman

    As another Bard, I approve of these changes (from the bard perspective). Sorry for the other classes, sounds like they are getting slid over the cheese grater.
    PCSS and code-zero like this.
  3. Xorsazis Augur


    There are two situations I ever used Howl of the Warlord:
    1. To drop agro from a train I started due to invis dropping.
    2. To drop agro after being rezzed during a raid to use Breather/Haitus.
    The first was more often before the great fade nerf. It was convenience rather than anything. I wasn't in danger, I just didn't want to deal with it, and could have zoned to accomplish the same thing.

    The second is the only reason I ever use it anymore, and honestly, I don't. It never works. If you would fix raids to not put me in combat as soon as I land from rez, you could nuke that useless ability into oblivion. Requiring 20% endurance (assuming max endurance since it wasn't specified which) gives me a zero reasons to use it. Ever. The timer is whatever since I don't use it now and even if it worked in raids, I wouldn't see myself needing it every 15 minutes, maybe as often as Haitus refreshes.

    The third reason I forgot I used it for was to fade during tank swaps so I wouldn't yank agro back by accident, but that's not even really a problem, was just a way to make it easier.

    So in short, fix raids so I don't rez in combat and you can do whatever you want to this ability.
    PCSS, Chatoyan and NameAlreadyInUse like this.
  4. Fian Augur

    One thing to consider is how this will affect healers. The bane of healers is mobs without a tank on them. Healers do AE aggro every time they cast a healing spell, and sometimes that means multiple mobs are making a beeline straight for the healer (think of your poor healer merc as an example who doesn't have fade abilities). If healers can fade less, then that means you are going to have more healer deaths in group and raid situations.

    Or maybe that is why you are doing the change?
    Dev: Players aren't dying enough, we need to make the game harder. Hey, let's make it harder for them to fade aggro! That will cause them to die more!
    Jordis likes this.
  5. NameAlreadyInUse #CactusGate

    Maybe it's finally time for the devs (and some players) to realize that the ability to engage mobs without being overrun, AKA playing the game, is not something that should be limited & gated behind a handful of classes. There is no other game that tells half or more of it's players that they can't play without the assistance of another player (or without multiboxing), while still allowing the other half to play by themselves whenever they wish.

    Grouping should be incentivized with increased rewards (faster killing, increased safety, etc.), but it should not be mandated for anybody. And solo play should not be artificially penalized with long cooldowns that force the player to just sit and wait. It's just not fun.

    I know some pullers have always thought they were special, but I play several "pulling" classes and I don't think they are special. Heck, I usually play an SK and don't need to do any special pulling at all: just grab everything and tank it. I'm just saying other classes are needlessly handicapped, and the game would be more fun with less useless downtime.
    PCSS, Chatoyan and Boze like this.
  6. Silver-Crow Augur

    Sooo, i'm getting the vibe that this isn't a popular change.

    It does make me laugh a bit though...

    When other classes get nerfed most don't give a monkeys, and the affected classes are effectively ignored, since they're just a fraction of the population (read melee and especially Bards at the last patch). When everyone gets nerfed it's all wailing and gnashing of teeth :mad:

    This is probably a positioning change to say that training is now fair game and to go train the hell out of those bot armies, who can no longer drop aggro.

    There... problem of bot armies solved, and yes it's all the TLP's fault again ;)

    :D :D:D:D:D:D
  7. Hadesborne Augur

    Understand that for the longest time, the three main pulling classes (Necro, Monk, Sk - arranged in the order in which they get a fade effect) were the ONLY classes that could do this. They added in rogues and bards and left it alone for over a decade. So there is your REAL alternative. How about they REMOVE the fade AAs from everyone except bards/rogues and then you will be back to having a difference in class playstyles. Some people just don't understand the extent to which they CAN be nerfed.
    Xanathol likes this.
  8. Angahran Augur

    Pantheon is vaporware, it's been 'being developed' for over a decade now ? maybe more ?
    Duder likes this.
  9. Zunnoab Augur

    Yet another baffling change.

    I don't like the continued regression of the design in comparison to ~5-7 years ago. Somewhere around then, things started sliding backwards after years of improvement.

    Wildly increased costs and wildly increased reuse timers (a complete regression of the REDUCED reuse timers before this backwards trend started) do not make the game more enjoyable. This is ludicrous. The game was not better before the series of improvements, which seem to be rolled back more and more, were made.

    The player base, from what I can see, looks upon upcoming changes with a wry humor. "What will the devs ruin, or outright remove, next?"

    This is an extraordinary perception problem, and stuff like this contributes to that view. For me personally, I do not at all appreciate the constant new restrictions and increased timers lately. (See: Dissonant Chord's outrageous TEN TIMES LONGER reuse change.)

    I very highly recommend that this be reconsidered, and I personally have an extremely negative view of what I see as regressive design rolling back years of progress. I apologize if that is harsh, and nothing personal is intended, but I believe I should be honest about how I feel about what has become a backward trend in the design of the game.
    PCSS, Teylana and Travestii like this.
  10. Hadesborne Augur

    Welcome to the plight of the pet class. Recast another. It's like I am taking crazy pills.
    PCSS likes this.
  11. Hadesborne Augur

    There SHOULD be consequences for poor play.
  12. Angahran Augur

    Just a guess but maybe they are nerfing fade abilities into oblivion now so when they offer slightly better fade abilities in the new expansion they think people will be like, "wow, we're getting new abilities", instead of "yay, we're getting back something that is still worse than it was before they nerfed it."

    And I see this thread is a 'preview' so there's not even the suggestion that there is any discussion involved. it's "we are doing this, deal with it.".
  13. Ryino Elder

    Because summon companion doesn’t work if the pet is on the hate list of a raid boss. So you need to fade before you can summon your pet. Before the last fade revamp the pet fade was part of the summon companion ability which made more sense.
    PCSS likes this.
  14. Hadesborne Augur

    Lets also just make everyone be able to heal themselves instantly to full with potions purchaseable from vendors. Lets give everyone max AC and the ability to melee well and run fast and cast nukes and stack dots and shroud of stealth everywhere, AND FLY. Then we can just ELIMINATE the need for separate classes. You, sir, are on to something here.
    Oakenblade and sojero like this.
  15. RainbowCane Elder

  16. Havanap Elder

    20% of mana...

    So if I go out of my way to get high mana on my character, fade costs more? That's ridiculous, if it has to have a mana cost make it a fixed mana cost.
    PCSS likes this.
  17. Squrriel Journeyman

    I agree that fade is an incredibly powerful ability which should have limitations on it to reduce the potential for abuse. However, If the intention of a fade ability is to allow a player to escape combat in a potentially deadly fight, what is the purpose of having a ridiculously high resource cost that would prevent it from being able to be used.

    Rangers are easily one of the most mana challenged classes in the game, we have no mana recovery abilities, there is a good chance by the time I need to fade ill be oom. Unless as Kurage noted, the intention is for it use current mana % as opposed to max, but I suspect that is not what you mean.

    I also second Kurage's comments on our harmony line, please make our harmony line useful again. Raise the effective level cap to 2 or maybe 3 levels above us so we can actually use this spell. At the moment, it cannot be used except in very rare circumstances in current content.
    PCSS likes this.
  18. Tarvas Augur

    Put me on the side that has no issues with this since I don't view these as hate reduction or pulling tools, but as "oh ...." buttons. If I am constantly finding myself in "oh ...." moments then I should probably reevaluate what I am doing.
  19. Transporter Lorekeeper

    Will always be nerfs because skilled players wow peons and they'll come on here and cry because they don't know how to. Then there are arrogant skilled players that will boast and say I shouldn't be able to blah blah blah. The struggle will never end lol keep the Haters alive
  20. Ibadan Kun'Tirel Augur


    I don't like the changes, but I love the communication.
    PCSS, Brohg, Warpeace and 5 others like this.

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