Please remove truebox limit from Aradune.

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Viceversa, Jul 28, 2022.

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  1. I'm Not A Robot Lorekeeper

    All the rule is doing now is stopping new players like myself from joining your server late and trying to get caught up with mercs still unavailable. Getting a 7-day suspension my first week on your server just trying to level up in completely barren empty wasteland of zones was a great deterrent to run me off.
    McJumps and Ravanta Suffer like this.
  2. Rhythar Augur

    The #1 benefit of a boxing limit is community. A boxing limit encourages you to play with other people instead of paying for more accounts that you control

    Another benefit of the boxing limit is immersion. Seeing a bunch of characters all intersecting with each other while following the lead box really kills the vibe.

    A boxing limit also enforces a balance and fairness between players. It's not fair that one player (a 6-boxer) can kill a raid boss by themselves while another player (a 1-boxer) cannot.
  3. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Community is the benefit when players are boxing because they are looking to fill a group and can't? Or they are playing on an odd schedule that makes grouping hard?

    As for your balance claim there are classes that can solo those things and other classes that need assistance for that and get with the help of boxed toons.
    Koshk likes this.
  4. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    You listed a few your opinions as to the benefits. What I asked for in my post, if you would like to go back and re-read it, was any negative effects this would have on the server.

    Most if not all of the people who box that I know on the server will GLADLY drop a box to allow me into the group as long as I can fill the same role as the box. Maybe if you would engage more with people on the server and become a larger part of the community, this would be more readily apparent to you.

    Immersion can be broken by many things and is really subjective. Its not something that is the same for everyone. Your personal feelings should not need to be encouraged by a server-wide rule.

    Some guilds on the server are doing split raids and killing 4 Beltons a night. Other guilds do not have the resources (lack of tanks or healers) to do this. Does this mean we should limit the amount of split raids any given guild should be able to do to make it more "fair"?

    You also neglected to answer my other post wherein I asked you if you feel the rule is "almost never being enforced" (your words) how it would be different if it were removed. I have a feeling the reason you replied to this post instead of that one was that you didn't really have an answer to that question.
    Koshk likes this.
  5. Rhythar Augur

    I've posted about the negative effects of boxing many times, including in this thread.

    I did not neglect to reply to your other post. My reply was deleted.
  6. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    I see that, and I apologize. It seems several of our posts have been deleted, for whatever reason. I am still curious, however how non-enforcement of a rule and how removal of that rule would be different in any practical sense. If the rule is not being enforced, how is that any different from there being no rule to begin with?
  7. Rhythar Augur

    I think there would be more boxing on Aradune if the rule were officially changed or removed. I think more boxing would be worse.
  8. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    I have to disagree with this statement. The people who have a desire to box more than one additional character are already doing so due to the lack of enforcement. At this point, anyone who has any interest in 3 or 6-boxing is already doing it. The only real change here would be people not being suspended because they were reported for doing something they were not actually doing. The malicious reports that are going around would no longer have teeth.

    The removal of the 2-box limit would not encourage anyone who is not currently 3-boxing or more to do so. I have no desire to ever box more than one additional character, and I will continue to only play one character until they relax truebox that will allow me to play 2 characters on one machine. Even if Truebox were removed completely (I do not want this) I would never box more than one additional character and I feel most people are not going to be influenced by the removal of the 2-box limit. You would have almost exactly the same amount of boxes running around as you do now.
  9. Captain Video Augur

    The dead horse has respawned and been beaten to death again.
    Koshk likes this.
  10. Rhythar Augur

    Have you no faith in humanity? Neither do I. So, yes, most people who want to 3+ box are probably already cheating, and modifying the 2-box limit may not result in a drastic change. However, if there's going to be any change, small or large, I think it should be towards better 2-box enforcement.
  11. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    Now that we have come to some agreement that there would be little to no change, and we also both understand that you will be leaving the server once SoD launches because of mercs, why then are you so against a change (that might not happen until SoD anyhow) that could possibly benefit the server once we reach some of the later eras in which you will no longer be a part of the server?

    I agree that the enforcement of this rule has been botched. Not enforcing it whatsoever for 2 years was a huge mistake and it is one of the main reasons why I am 100% for it being removed or relaxed at this point. It makes no sense to allow people to circumvent the rule for 2 years and then attempt (poorly) to enforce the rule now, especially when so many people are being suspended that have not even broken said rule.

    I think we have a much better chance in getting the 2-box rule removed or relaxed than we do of hoping the enforcement of this rule gets better or more precise. For it to get better, I would assume it would mean dedicating more time and/or resources to the server on DPGs already stressed budget. I am not hopeful in that regard. Whereas removal or relaxation of the rule would only require DPG to do what they did for the first 2 years of this server and would take up no additional resources or time.
  12. Dalno(Th) Excess Character

    Damn, cold world, my post got reported and deleted for something. Here's the cliff notes:

    I'm late to the party (Sorry Jalar) but as somebody who has been playing and leading a raid guild on Aradune since launch the hard box limit needs to go. The rule is being used as a tool to troll people by maliciously reporting players who are 19 times out of 20 not bothering anyone in mostly empty zones with boxes at oddball hours and has failed its intention.
  13. Rhythar Augur

    "I'm not bothering anyone" is not an excuse for cheating.
  14. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    The intention of this rule was so that people could not dominate camps/zones in earlier content when it might disrupt other players trying to utilize said camps and zones. If the rule is no longer being used or enforced to prevent disruption, then it should not be a rule any longer.
  15. Rhythar Augur

    In my opinion, more boxing ultimately causes more harm than good on all servers (except Rizlona). As to why I'm fighting so hard against it, it's because Aradune is the only sanctuary from bigger boxers and because I hate cheaters.
  16. Rhythar Augur

    Was that the intention? I thought it was to cater to a particular audience. Really, I don't know.
  17. Captain Video Augur

    That was most certainly >NOT< the intention of the rule. It was done in response to numerous player requests for a no-box server, and the 2-box limit was far as they were willing to go. Disruptions can occur on any server with any ruleset; all you need is enough players competing for scarce resources. Three perfectly legal 2-box teams can form a group of six and disrupt; I personally saw this happen many times. A guild can dispatch a group of arbitrary size to disrupt, made up entirely of 1-box players, and I saw that happen many times. In addition, THERE ARE NO CAMPS. The PnP policy is dead, it says so in the TOS. It is perfectly legal for a group from my guild to DPS race your team for a loot drop. The 2-box rule changed none of that.

    There were some who naively believed the rule would eliminate Kronolord activity on the server, and that was never going to happen; the company isn't about to bite one of the hands that feeds it.
    Koshk and Stymie like this.
  18. Dalno(Th) Excess Character

    Damn bro, you strait blogging on here huh, This your 50th reply saying the same thing? 3boxing isn't cheating, Using programs to automate gameplay is cheating. You're devoting so much energy into something, What's your character name on Aradune? How long have you played? Has the enforcement of boxing rules led to you having more groups readily available?

    I hate to break it to you but all those problems are game design problems inherent to EQ.
  19. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    You posted what you feel the negatives of boxing are and not everyone agrees with you on that.
  20. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    Even if we cannot agree on the original intent of the rule, if it was not enforced for almost 2 years, wouldn't it be fair to say that those who felt they were negatively impacted by its non-enforcement have left the server at this point? And if those people remain, doesn't that imply that whatever the original purpose of the rule was not really a huge issue to begin with?

    You say the 2-box rule didn't change any of the things you mentioned, so what did it change? If there is essentially no difference between not enforcing the rule and removing it, why would you care if they remove it? Were you on these forums fighting as hard for enforcement of the rule when everyone knew it was not being enforced as you are fighting for it to be kept as a rule? Or do you just like to debate and need a platform to do so?

    What exactly motivates you to lobby so aggressively against this change? Does it really come down to the idea that "Rules MUST remain the same, no matter what"? I could better understand your adversarial stance if you could provide an argument that included ways in which changing this rule would effect your experience in game. But seeing as how there was, for all intents and purposes, no such rule for the first 2 years of the server, I find it hard to believe you have such an argument.
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