Please let us vote on TLP Instancing

I know...

Don't get me wrong, I prefer June 1st myself - just around tons of women that will either "nerd glasses" June 1st as not summer, or start rubbing their athame or pentacle before making the "not summer" comment, heh.

[Also plenty of guys I know do it too, but not close to 100% like it is in women]

On this gear saturation argument, specifically as it relates to the economy, a question - how much of the loot is actually droppable? How much in Classic, Kunark, Velious, Luclin? I look at samplings of raid mobs on Allakhazam and see what *I* see, but interested to hear what other opinions there are.

Outside of the Classic and Kunark dragons it's very low, once Velious rolls around it's almost zero. (and literally zero for Luclin + PoP to my knowledge)

stuff from lodi for example isn't nodrop.

gear saturation is a mostly made-up thing. it would only be an issue if town quested newbie armor stays in and we get stuck in classic for half a year or something. if we ended up with the miracle of instanced old world bosses, those bosses would probably only drop NODROP versions of their loot anyway.

we probably won't though. i'd worry about rampant hacking/duping/exploiting waaay before i ever worried about loot saturation.

Ah. So instancing would have very little effect on the economy outside of Cloak of Flames....(not that no drop is needed, FV showed us all that raid gear barely ever gets sold).

Well, that argument can be defeated with one simple tweak - don't instance Naggy/Vox, instance fear/hate/sky in Classic. Don't instance any Kunark dragons, but instance other raid zones (and, wherein a dragon spawns in a zone that has other raid mobs, don't spawn the dragon in the instance). Once it hits Velious, and certainly Luclin, the argument dies of natural causes anyway.

This way, the "competitives" can keep their bragging rights by locking down all the Cloak of Flames, but everyone else is still able to get geared up and not find themselves in a situation where the next expansion is about to hit and they aren't armored enough to even try mobs there.

Come to think of it, SOE-Daybreak came close to this conclusion before, when they banished level 52s and above from Naggy/Vox. They decided that if Fear/Hate/Sky started getting one-grouped, that was OK, because only the dragons needed protected. Instancing may not have been the discussion at the time, but there are definitely parallels.

It gives them Cloak of Flames and epic drops. If they have the ability to block people, they will.

I hadn't thought about epics, but still, wouldn't it at least be a major victory to get fear/hate/sky instanced so that people can get armored?

Besides...Fear is sufficiently risky for an in-era group that if you win there you probably did earn it....

I don't trust the good faith of people after witnessing the last round. Why fix only part of the problem? The more that I read the arguments against instancing, the less sympathy I have for that position. They will try to get away with anything that they can.

My counter point to the example of cloak if flames is that why shouldn't i have the chance to get one too?
If i put together a group and its capable... there should be nothing gear wise in the game that should not be available if u can down the mob. Placating the ubers with anything that they can lock others out of just doesn't sound right?

I agree, but a simple majority doesn't seem to be enough to get Daybreak to realize we need instancing. If sacrificing CoFs to the "ubers" would placate some of them and allow us to present a more overwhelming pro-instancing front to Daybreak, then it's worth it I think.

Hmmm

It would not placate the ones that claim it ruins their immersion or it is not classic enough. Even long lockout timers and high raid sign-up requirements did not help there. So why give even more away? Not instancing the Dragons merely ensures that the RMT people still make a large amount of money out of epic drops from them.

Hey - new non-instancing solution I've mused (although wouldn't keep hackers from screwing with people - so still not ideal) - anyone that raids ANY raid mob gets a flag for the next week that banishes them if they're within 200' of a raid mob.

Solves monopolization flat. Would still be just as competitive.

Would reward boxers a little, but they'd need a ton of boxes.

I still think instancing is a better idea - but it would solve anti-instancer supposed wants [they claim they don't want to monopolize, remember?] while making camping out spawn after spawn pointless since a given raid force could only do a short handful of targets.

That would work only with drastically increased spawn rates?

With some tweaking, that might work. Otherwise if a raid kills Fright in Fear, they'd get banished when they hit Dread (technically, based on what you said). I'd like to think that a single raid could clear Fear out if they're able to, it's not allowing them to clear it out every single week every time Fear is up that we should avoid.

This. I know a guy who goes, "But - but instancing's not classic!" Then gloats about how he's going to get rich monopolizing all the mobs ("How much do you think I should charge for the mage epic pieces/a fungi tunic?" "I don't do wait lists [for camps], hehe!")

In Velious many Giant items are droppable, including the AoW loot table. Very little by the time you get to ToV though.

Even Dain stuff mostly isn't - but yea late Velious is really when it goes to basically nil.

Not instancing Naggy/Vox does nothing for the guilds who might want to run them once or twice. I don't want to see any of the content off limits. This is a PvE game, so give us some E.

That is a good point. Either make the game PvP or remove the indirect PvP. Nothing is more frustrating than other players working against you but you can't make it official.

A big fear for EQN with rally calls and the rumor that players will likely be siding on different sides of them. Since rally calls will be HUGE in that game, it doesn't seem right that you can't fight directly. (Not trying to make this an EQN topic, just reinforcing that indirect PvP is frustrating )