Phinny's Current Era and Dps Classes Status?

Just curious what Era Phinny is currently in now and if Monks are still on average the top dps class? I hear that at some point they drop off and get overtaken by Berserkers and Wizards at some point in EQ's timeline.

Phinny is in PoR (the last expac of the level 70 era), going into TSS in about a month and a half.

DPS Ranks are basically Monks=Zerkers>Rogues>Rangers>Wizards/Necros>Mages/Beastlords. Monks generally still beat berserkers but it's close enough that it can go either way on a lot of fights. Really long fights Rogues can beat out zerkers but there aren't that many of those.

Omitting tank/priest classes since an Intensity Harmtouch is basically an IWIN Button on some short encounters.

Thanks, I tried a berserker but I just can't get into slower 2 handed weapon thing, get too much enjoyment out of that blender dual wield feeling.

Monks=Zerkers>Rogues>Beastlords>Rangers>Wizards/Necros>Mages

Minor edit

If you average across encounter length and with/without disciplines I'd probably put the tiers as:
1. (1.6 to >2kdps): Monks, Zerkers, Rogues
2. (1.2 to 1.6kdps) Beastlords, Rangers
3. (1.1 to 1.4kdps) Wizards, Necros, Mages

The silks can bounce around the most due to resists, otherwise I think this is pretty standard. Those are not actual maxes, just examples based on what I remember, and how I'd guess the classes sit if you averaged a bunch of encounters together. Seen monks push 4k.

I guess that makes sense why it seems like most guilds that I see are closed on recruiting most mele dps but seem to be in medium or high demand on caster dps. Everyone wants to play a mele.

It's definitely Monk > Berserker > Rogue but it's extremely close. A monk using all abilities is going to win any duration fight.

Sullon Zek, Mistress of Rage in 69s, 4010k @58110 | Rogue 355k@5150 | Monk 338k@4901

This is monk without 7th or he would be much higher.

You're somehow ignoring all adds and just burning Sullon in 69 seconds? Pulled her to zone in or something?

That's the standard strat but maybe we can make some changes. How about leashing her to her spawn point and death touches for anyone on hatelist outside of 400' range?

I look forward to this being in the May patch after everyone stops farming her.

But these DPS rankings further drive home how stupid it is to let every Melee have an extra +52% hit damage AA on TLPs. There may actually be some balance between Wiz/Necro/Mage vs Monk/Berserker/Rogue if they were correctly tied to the era they were released in.

Cheese is tasty, but too much of it is bad for you!

Actually, I never knew you could do the encounter that way. I think we need at least two dozen more threads about this, and Phinny to be well into Buried Sea expansion though for it to get fixed.

If this change doesn't get fixed for Coirnav then i just don't cant even.

I would love to know what your rogue is doing to pull those kinds of numbers, I peak out around 2.9-3.5k on hard burns. Only thing I can think of is I don't have 7th, but if 7th is the difference between 3k and 5k that's a little crazy.
Obviously it's hard to compare circumstances for a lot of reasons but there's a huge scarcity of accurate rogue information for pushing TLP dps

Likely an ADPS issue.

Bard - Epic, Overhaste, Storm Blade, War March
Shaman - Epic, Ancestral Aid, Panther
Berserker - Bloodlust Aura, Cry Havoc, MGB Ancient Cry of Chaos
Ranger - MGB Auspice
Rogue - Epic proc
Monk - Fist of Wu (Rogues may be at 100% DW, I forget when that happens for each class though.)
Druid - 4 -ATK Debuffs
Enchanter - Cripple

Etc. I'm sure there are a few stacking conflicts in there. But basically if you aren't in a group with a Shaman, Bard and Berserker, your DPS will drop down further.

It's mostly the fight's duration combined with 7th and backstab luck. On longer fights even 3k dps is difficult:

Ayonae Ro in 288s, 13282k @46117 | Berserker 817k@2837 | Rogue 814k@2825 | Rogue 773k@2686 | Monk 748k@2596

Ayonae Ro in 333s, 13278k @39873 | Berserker 906k@2722 | Rogue 851k@2556 | Monk 850k@2553 | Rogue 765k@2296

Sanguimanus the Redfang in 195s, 7888k @40453 | Monk 576k@2954 | Rogue 564k@2892 | Rogue 538k@2760 | Monk 533k@2733 | Berserker 510k@2616

That's fair enough I suppose, I usually run with full aDPS and have acceptable enough gear and it was a bit of sticker shock seeing such a dps gap even on a short fight. Still missing a few nickels and dimes but I can identify some likely culprits (panther uptime from box shamans, no ldon poison click, subpar offhand, only at 67hdex since we never get rogue drops...)

Thinking about maximizing dps... anyone have any Hstr vs. Hdex stacked parse comparisons for TLP? Found some decent info for Live, but wondering how it scales here where your Hstats are not guaranteed-max yet. I ask because there's some crazy people I've noticed on magelo... https://eq.magelo.com/ranking?g=0&s=65&f=c16_0_0#s=13
and I can't imagine a world where the marginal gains of Hstr on TLP outpace basics like surviving the encounter (e.g., 35 shielding / spell shielding).

I'm not sure that anyone has the time or gear to extensively parse at the pace TLPs progress. Realistically, the best answer is that neither of them matter all that much in the amounts we can get now. 100hstr on that rogue is about 10 flat damage that's never multiplied and 100 attack (71% of a Champion buff). Hdex value comes from crits/procs which are very hard to estimate and at our available values probably less than 1% either way. In that kind of direct comparison hstr should pull ahead, but it's probably not even 5% of difference assuming all other conditions are the same. The answer to which to stack should just be "get as much of either on any given piece as you can."

Fully expecting it to be done for Agnarr...

This strat was first used on 5-26-06 by the 9th guild to defeat Sullon Zek. It was my idea because we didn't have the crazy support-heavy setup that the other top guilds in this era had. The fight was observed by the guy who designed it (who was the Ast Lead Dev - Maddoc/Jason Mash), because I'd invited him to after our first run the night before when we tested it and had realized it was possible. Figured he'd enjoy watching us.

Basically, he didn't intend for her to be beaten that way, but said he wasn't going to change her because he appreciated alternative approaches after I'd explained that our guild couldn't just throw the 10 wars & clrs other guilds had at it. Of course, DPS has increased a bit since then, and it's now the preferred strategy from what I've heard.

Sullon had some issues pathing back then - basically if you pulled her too far (we tried the basement for example) her, and her adds, would just warp on top of you and then warp back to their spawn, and just sort of keep doing that. This is why we fought her down the stairs but still close enough to the room that her adds would path normally. We just had an AE TL up (for the viral landing on a person to use) and had knights intercept the adds while we burned.

Ironically, there's extra npcs in that zone that he put there that are supposta help you somehow (the non-agro guys on a mid-level floor). Not sure anyone I know of ever found them/figured them out - he mentioned them offhand to me once, and I never got the chance to check it out.

I have done a fair amount of very long parses on this in the arena on the test server, checking str and dex at various points between 0 and about 60. With Hstr, the flat +1/10str bonus is clear in the min/max hit, but it takes hours and hours before that amount becomes statistically significant to your overall dps. (E.g. if you take two separate 30 minute chunks from a single parse, you'll probably see a larger difference in average hit and dps just from rng than you see between an 8 hour parse with 9 str amd another one with 39.) This isnt all that surprising, the dmg bonus from str is something you can just calculate. I usually land about 6-7 hits per second as a monk. Adding, say, 30 str would give me an extra 18-21 dps, which is about 1% of my basic auto attack number.
I did not see any difference at all in crit rates with dex, which i tested up to 62. Proc rates go up very clearly as you max combat effects, but after 33 dex there is no increase at all. Also, its unclear whats going on with the atk boost from strength. The ac values of the dummies are weird, so its hard to test atk. So perhaps the Hstr is doing more against actual mobs than it is in my lab. Im not going to spend my dkp on Str gear based on that possibility though...
One thing was very clear: from 1 to 38, dex gives you a big dps boost from the accuracy mod. I went from around 65% at 0 to 74% at 150 accuracy, and dps scales up with it by more than 12-15%.