Phinigel Flagging issues EoK to live

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Hendoh12, Jul 15, 2020.

  1. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I do think something needs to be done for Selo - and at least once it has been addressed in a sensible way it will mean any future TLP that used a Selo ruleset is sorted too, but looking forward I don't see them repeating the Selo Ruleset all that often (maybe not ever), a 2 month unlock server has not been tried yet though & maybe they'll see if that hits a better "sweet spot" for a fastest progression server, I think Selo was maybe a bit too fast to hold onto a bigger player-pool & burned out too many players in the process.
  2. HoodenShuklak Augur

    Selo was absolutely too fast for many people. I just heard it too many times to deny it.

    Unfortunately, some expacs were still too long.

    Fast or slow though, I'm believing more and more that tlp players really just want eq before level 70. Even if these later expacs were all fine tuned and optimal, the newest tlp launch would probably still cripple it.
  3. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I think there are plenty of players who would like to see the later expansions but getting them to all land on the same server at the same time is almost impossible, so every TLP is going to be faced with the kind of attrition that leaves the servers floundering later on in the expansion chain.

    I think that while TLP unlocking once per year certainly helped the game grow there does need to be thoughts on how to have healthier server populations, TLP complicate the server-merge process by being at different stages in the expansion unlock process.

    There have been some good suggestions from players all over the forum on how to help TLP servers weather the attrition though.

    Here are the ones I think may work out if they are used:

    1. Truebox switched off at some point - DoDH seems like a good point to do that & coincides with when the live game dropped the single client per PC restriction.

    2. More "Heroic Upgrade" options - I detailed this idea cultivated from multiple other threads of my
    own & other posters ideas -> here <-

    3. Free to Play enabled on TLP servers once they unlock Veils of Alaris (around when F2P launched on the live game).

    4. Offer low-population servers a Free server-transfer to a live server of their choosing.
    This in particular affects Euro players, as all TLP are much heavier in US players than EU ones, and only one EU live server exists, amy merge is almost certainly going to move the players from the TLP to a US server so the EU players are essentially stranded, having the option to transfer off to AB would give them a chance to continue on characters with often large investments in them.

    5. Low-population TLP merged into live servers sooner, at some point TLP cease to have any active raiding guilds clearing content in era, rather than allowing the server to languish merge it with a live server & it may bring some players back to it, some guilds may even see a revitalisation once on a live server despite them being significantly behind in expansions.
  4. Nolrog Augur

    Would that give people enough time to fully gear up before RoS? Fortunately, there is only one tier of raid armor, but you would still need to get around 450 armor drops to fully gear the raid force, which is about 225 clears (I think it's 2 per raid and there are 8 raids so I don't think you get there in 8 weeks even if you hit everything as soon as it comes off lock out and there were no keying for progression at all.)

    There's also the sheer number of AAs to work on. Something like 13,000, which is hard to do in 8 weeks, though we'll see what the AA rate is.
  5. Warrior007 Augur

    Not without extending it traditionally, no -- in comparison to how it was initially. Unless the script for currency was changed, but that would be a more extensive overhaul than simply changing the achievement. We have three great guilds on Phinigel, and I'm sure we'll all do just fine regardless of being 100% geared or 50% geared in progression. We'd prefer the former over the latter, there are more pressing concerns about the expansion.

    Best solution here is to change the achievement along with extending EoK to 3 months based on the depth of the expansion.

    Alternatively, a duplicate achievement can be made for (TLP) which reflects a speedier unlock to prevent toying with the existing scripts. From my understanding, these achievements are linked directly to progression/unlocks and would be a far simpler change. This would affect all future TLPs in a way that I'm sure everyone agrees is in the moderate spirit of progression.
    RainbowCane likes this.
  6. Ngreth Thergn Developer

    It's actually based on player "flags" (bits), referenced in multiple scripts we'd have to change.

    The achievement is only a visible display for the player's benefit. It would be MUCH slower for the game to reference the achievement and not the bits in the appropriate scripts.

    This, unfortunately, would be the messiest change suggested :/ I do see how it *seems* simpler, but... it isn't

    DO you mean to repeat the journey to 70? or Want it in general. If the second was true, Agnarr would be more popular.
    Skuz and Tweakfour17 like this.
  7. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Seems like we have reached something of an impasse.

    Extending EoK (and maybe TBL too) to 12 weeks works for Phinigel/Miragul & future 3 month unlock schedules so I really hope that can be done.
    This doesn't help Selo, and with the recent loss of some experienced devs the workload at the dev team is going to be even higher than the usual high until they finish recruiting & training new devs.

    Getting Selo a keying fix for EoK would've been a definite win, but looks unlikely to get it in time, pity.
  8. Poem New Member

    For Phinny and Crew! Extend EoK (and maybe TBL) :)
    SirNaves and Skuz like this.
  9. Heartland Augur

    Don't extend EoK - there's plenty of time to catch up in RoS and later expansions for completionists.
  10. Warrior007 Augur

    Thanks for the details.

    What about two separate individual raid scripts that are duplicated across 5 total raids (2 T1 raids, 3 T2 raids)? This would expedite tier progression to be more in line with prior expansions.

    More specifically --
    T1 Script, generate an additional key/collectable after event completion.
    The T1 key/collectable is the following, along with the two raids that reward it:
    T2 Script: generate an additional key/collectable after event completion.
    The T2 key/collectable is the following, along with the three raids that reward it:
  11. Nolrog Augur

    It has nothing to do with being a completionist. You don't seem to understand the issue, or you are just trolling. I will assume the former. . . .

    RoS raid gear requires EoK raid gear in order to upgrade. If you count up the number of raids with the keys needed there isn't enough events to fully gear the raid, even if you hit everything as soon as it is off lock out, which I am not sure will happen.
    Skuz likes this.
  12. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    Again, the most simple solution is to just make all TLP servers start at base 4x factor Key and Currency multiplier.

    This increase would solve the flagging issue for both the 3month and 1month servers. It would also help solve the issue with EoK/RoS armor combination scheme with additional currency available to be spent on visible armor.

    I didn't really understand why they chose to do a time locked scale factor for keys/currency, since on almost all TLPs you stay in the current expansion. There isn't a bunch of back-expansion raiding on live except for achievements or very specific clickies/augs.

    Starting at 4x multiplier just makes sense on TLPs that see the content for 3-2 months, compared to 12 months on live (a factor of 4 times longer).
  13. That0neguy Augur

    I'm not sure you understand the issue either. You don't need a full raid in BIS gear in era to progress. If this argument to the dev's was "hey we wont have enough gear" they wouldn't have even bothered responding.

    Like Dima said on the gear, we will manage on all servers. You would be surprised how much you can actually get done in bad gear. It may make it harder, but it's not the end of the world nor will it make it un beatable.
  14. Heartland Augur

    Just because I don't share the same train of thought as you doesn't mean I don't understand your issue or trolling.

    Not everyone wants the server to drag out just so you can farm more gear in era or cap 100% in AA. There are people who just want to see the content. You don't need best in slot on everything to ensure you can move to the next expansion, and all the guilds have shown so far that you can beat content without having everything farmed.
    Unless you are saying you can not beat content without having the best of everything? If that's the case maybe we should go back to a voting system for expansion unlocks.
  15. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    So you aren't trolling but you are d**k swinging?

    At least we can clearly see what your perspective is.
    SirNaves likes this.
  16. Nolrog Augur

    If you don't get the EoK gear, you cannot get the RoS gear which means you are raiding 110 content in some 105 gear 3 expansions behind while not being able to use some of the armor that drops. Nothing to do with needing BIS to progress as I say below.

    It has nothing to do with having the best of everything. It is giving people the proper incentive and reward for beating the raids. If EoK gear wasn't required, then it wouldn't be an issue at all. But since it is, we have this issue. Can you beat the RoS content in TBM gear (not EoK gear, you will be raiding in some TBM gear)? Because that's what some people will have, if they didn't get their EoK piece. Were the raids tuned assuming you didn't have a full set of EoK gear? My guess is that they weren't. . . . .

    But this is an artificial disincentive to people carrying on if they didn't get their EoK gear or if they were gone for some time and wanted to come back they can't jump in and catch up.
    Skuz likes this.
  17. Tweakfour17 Augur

    So, if you need the previous expac's raid gear to use the current raid gear and the options are either increase flags (so you can farm more, faster) or increase expac length (so you can farm more, longer)....Could you not put an item in on a vendor that serves the same function as the previous raid's drop? So you can progress at the speed they want but not need last expacs gear to use this expacs..
  18. Auesheet Lorekeeper

    I think this has been brought up before and would be a nice change if it were purchasable with plat.
  19. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Yep, similar to what was used for replacing T1/T2 armors in T3 combines in earlier expansions.

  20. Nexxo New Member

    Sorry to disagree, but wether you are right for most the early expansions, as we are getting closer to live, raid difficulty is also increasing. I'd be curious to see how you would perform in crap gear in EoK and further expansions. As a tank, you HAVE to be using current gear. Of course if you play a caster or dps and don't care about how you perform, you can care less :)
    In EoK, most raid mobs start to have 100% strikethrough, along with really big nukes/abilities. Some encounters in RoS and TBL have been roadblocks to many guilds on live either because the encounters are designed around 54 mans full raids, or because of some mechanics that are designed for tanks using full current expansion gear. These raids are not designed for tourists ;)