Pet Mitigation: Parses and Discussion

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Daegun, Apr 18, 2014.

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  1. Battleaxe Augur

    As long as we do not require more effort, take more risk, produce in ANY case inferior results, are mostly useless after dying for a much longer period than alternatives, have significantly less input into our own personal survival - are a constant source of disappointment because of restriction (looks sadly at the pillow with it's built in sword ornamentation in his main hand and his stack of bandages) while other classes dance in fields full of butterflies and rainbows.

    Let's remember - most Warriors are not sufficiently advanced or geared to be the best anything nor do they do raid content where at least the "unmatched ability to survive" promise is usually sometimes kept. They are in many cases merely disadvantaged fighters where the actual situation is and has been for years pets (and their fairly high DPS operators) > SK's > Paladins (knights because of combat self-healing) > Warriors.

    Unmatched ability to survive is raid Warriors only - a tiny minority.
    Tamber and sinderkad like this.
  2. Ravengloome Augur


    I am a knight and I agree,

    As far as tanking goes it should be Warrior >> Knights >>>>>>>>>>>> Everything else

    not

    Pet >>>> Warrior >> Knights >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everything else
  3. feiddan Augur


    No clue. The info was relayed to me - I'm just the messenger. Considering the frequency of 60k rounds, my guess is quite a bit.
  4. Engineer Augur

    Wrong.

    As far as tanking goes it should be Warrior >> Knights >>Ranger>>>>>>>>> Everything else
  5. Brogett Augur

    Well, I can pull and engage "a target" until it is dead as a lone player character... Even XP mobs (eg light blue trash in kaesora works well). It's simply a matter of degrees. I don't view myself as a solo class, despite the fact I can now solo some old content. I do view mage, necro, beastlord, wiz, etc as solo capable classes, but I find it hard to put my finger on exactly where the boundary is.

    IMO solo class implies gaining reasonable XP from soloing without having to resort to extra weak mobs to do it. That's more or less how it originated in EQ. Those who had to group to level up and those who could do it by themselves - XP was the determining factor.

    So where in all of this does it imply that the "solo classes" need to be able to solo nameds by themselves? Or even solo in the current expansion? Clearly they can and have been for ages, but it wouldn't really be *broken* if they could molo the current expansion instead of solo, and had to get a group for most of the nameds mobs? Or putting it another way, just because you've been able to solo end game stuff for ages it doesn't mean it was intended (I'm sure it didn't used to be this extreme) and nor does it mean it is sacred. Changing it wouldn't be the demise of the class, no more than the inability to solo a dark blue would be the demise of rogues; that's just pure hyberbole.
    Elricvonclief likes this.
  6. feiddan Augur


    Erm, why?
  7. Langya Augur

    Lets just bring about another hard mode expac and then we can all get murdered. Death is the great equalizer.
  8. Dre. Altoholic

    The devs have stated on multiple occasions that it is through pure happenstance that the combination of tools given to any class enables them to solo with a reasonable experience rate.

    The term "Solo classes" are arbitrary labels applied entirely by the community. Justifying abilities by claiming they are needed to solo is a special breed of ridiculousness.
    Elricvonclief likes this.
  9. Engineer Augur

    Uh, why not? Third warrior hybrid.

    If there's room in the heirarchy for merc tanks, there's certainly room for the 4th tank to rightfully take their place. Why are people so against ranger tanks?
    Elricvonclief likes this.
  10. Leerah Augur

    Roon is a hard hitter, easy for everyone to access unless they don't have all expansions.
  11. feiddan Augur


    This discussion was already covered in-depth much earlier in this thread.

    Rangers aren't tanks any more than rogues are. There are no warrior hybrids.

    Rangers don't have a rightful claim to be >>>>>>>> every other class - they've never had that.
  12. Tharrg Augur

    I think it should be Warrior>>>>>>>Knights>>>Pet>>>>everything else...

    currently I think its Pet>>>>>Warrior/Knight>>>everything else... ( I do not see a whole lot of difference in Knight Tanking vs Warrior Tanking that would indicate that warriors are somehow better. Its why so many do not play warriors....
  13. Serriah_Test Augur


    ^This
    Only plate wearers should be tanking with a high mitigation - except bards.
    Why bards weren't made as leather classes, I'll never know. Kind of ridiculous when you think about it. Let me just swing this guitar around my bulky plate chest... now let's play the flute with these clunky plate gauntlets.
    Voragath, Elricvonclief and Leerah like this.
  14. Langya Augur

    Bards pull and don't mitigate like monks.
  15. beryon Augur

    The devs do keep saying this, but it's never made any sense to me. The playerbase clearly considers soloability a huge factor in choosing classes, and it's definitely one of the reasons less and less people are playing warriors. (Note: nerfing pets won't help this. There've been a gazillion threads on ways to improve wars so I'm not going to go into that here.)
    Baramos likes this.
  16. Garshok Augur

    Unless the warrior class can demonstrate that there actually *is* something lacking in the warrior class, the developer's aren't going to listen - witness the lack of (positive) dev response to the warrior outcry over the NTTB nerf.

    While I can certainly understand the discomfort this thread is causing mages, I don't see this as a call for a pet nerf so much as a someone pointing out how lacking tank mitigation is in comparison to pets in order to get the devs to listen in regards to warrior fixes.
  17. feiddan Augur


    Bards were plate classes in the DIKU/Sojourn MUD, mainly for lore reasons.
  18. Garshok Augur

    Maybe because, unlike most other named,. Roon and Shoon are almost always up?

    Not to mention that the OP's purpose is to discuss mitigation of warriors (and other tanks) vs. pets, and a hard-hittin g mob like Roon helps demonstrate the extent of that mitigation. Doesn't seem to me so much like OP is asking for a pet nerf so much as laying a case for a possible relook at mitigation for tanks.

    So you have hinted more than once at this one, deep dark secret warriors supposedly have that they don't want to raise, because they know that all hell will break lose for their class if it comes up. [Kind of like some mages seem to think is happening here.]

    So spit it out. What is it? Or is this just some whispering campaign?
    Elricvonclief likes this.
  19. Ravengloome Augur


    Thats what they are trying to prove here.
  20. Ravengloome Augur


    I think your putting alittle to much Emphasis on Warrior tanking, If it were to play out the way your saying it should be, (I am assuming you like i used the amount of >>'s to denote deviation from the last class?) Knights wouldn't even be tanks lol.
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