Pally Tanking

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by crazedhammer71, May 20, 2020.

  1. crazedhammer71 New Member

    I have never played a tank, always a DPS class or hybrid grp healer. I know Pallys start off slow with stuns, but is this a fun class to raid with? Any advice or experience is greatly appreciated.
  2. Xhartor Augur

    Generally speaking SK's are going to rated the highest of the tank classes on the "Fun to play" charts.
  3. Deathcomestoall Lorekeeper

    Pally in classic is pretty fun seeing how pallys own undead lol.
  4. Lejaun Augur

    The first question is are you really going to raid that much. A lot of people think they will, but not nearly as many do that think they are.

    I've never played a paladin in a raid, but in my experience in the past we often used SK's as the tanks if they were better suited to it than warriors or offtank if they weren't, and paladins to offtank/spotheal/cure.

    In group settings, I tend to play high DPS classes. I favor a good SK over any other tank for getting aggro quickly and keeping it on them so that I can go all out with the DPS. Paladins are good too, but I think SKs are better are yanking aggro to them and keeping it.
  5. Sithil Elder

    In classic Clr's are still lords of the undead. It isn't until AA's and Slay Undead do Pally's truly start to shine vs Undead.
  6. Sithil Elder

    First stun is Lvl 28. Early on you're going to use Flash of Light a lot for aggro, but be careful as this blinds the mob. If you get too far away from a blinded mob it turns and starts running until the blind wears off.
  7. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    Sooo.... a Pally?

    There's a fairly big lull when their pacify spells stop. (Luclin era) They are slow even against undead. Sure, Slay undead is amazing when it procs.. but it's just that, a proc. You can easily go through several mobs without getting a slay.

    They get so much "vs. undead" garbage yet the content never seems to lend itself to make use of it. There are small pockets here and there, or a mix of undead + live enemies, or the content becomes too low level too quickly.

    You get to rampage tank a lot... because you're low DPS and can self heal, and DA hammer (for a few xpacs at least). Eventually you get to cycle a couple of group heals + an AA group heal.

    You -might- be asked to MT Cazic in PoTime, though it will probably go to an SK.

    Warriors and SK's just outshine survivability for a long time. I'm not sure about the last few Xpacs.. but.. healing incoming damage doesn't come close to the DPS +lifetaps of the SK or DPS + mitigation abilities of warriors (plus their higher AC). I've pulled out a number of amazing feats, as a TLP pally... but it comes with a significant down time and a lot of luck with criticals.

    Never really had an issue with aggro, if you set up properly and aren't directly fighting another tank.

    They honestly feel squishier than the other tank classes. I don't know why... but 1800+ AC and 30k HP still gets obliterated faster than the others. (that's with almost full TBS gear, all 8 visible slots + most BiS from TBS and TSS and Pure Metal Powersource).

    On the other hand... Full on paladin presence is generally fairly low (For a lot of the reasons above) meaning you tend to always have a spot on a raid.

    In the group sector, you have to stack up DPS to compensate for your lack of DPS and lower survivability. In a well rounded group, each of the tanks are viable.... Just that they aren't always 100% interchangeable. The group needs to play to a given tank's powers and weaknesses.

    "Fun" is very subjective. Obviously, there are Paladins who really enjoy the class. If not, they wouldn't still be playing them at end game. Are they as "fun" as the others? That's just about the person behind the keys. SK's have always been fairly popular, due to their various abilities and ability to group/solo/raid without much hindrance. Warriors have always been popular because you basically need to be a warrior to main tank much of EQ's raid content.. in addition to that, a group-geared warrior vastly "out tanks" a similarly group-geared Pally/SK. (This is less evident when comparing raid-geared tanks in group content, due to the gear).

    Paladin in Original + Kunark + Velious could do a whole lot on their own. Original had plenty of Undead areas spanning different levels. Kunark was more of a mix-and-match, but Pacify worked like a charm. Velious really saw things turn more bleak for paladins, but the inflation wasn't so huge to be an issue. Luclin brought in the DA hammer, almost a (if not definite) requirement for Ssra raiding and some VT. Many more undeads to pick from, though not normally the most popular areas. PoP really had you in Valor or CoD, for undead, but there wasn't anything you couldn't handle (if you gained access via progression). One of the most popular LDoN areas was a pally haven (BB, as well as Guk). GoD was garbage and hurt a lot. OoW wasn't far behind. Then DoN... but along came DoDH, that gave a pretty good end-zone for pallies, as well as RoI to get your undead on. But most people didn't care much for RoI and opted for instanced missions (mostly zone rares) and Dreadspire. PoR was kinda pooty. TSS has a few undead areas and Frostcrypt. But Frostcrypt will end you quick without a puller (can't mez) unless you can manage pulls to 3 mobs or less. (this varies a bit as you gain TSS raid gear or the out of era crafted gear that DPG was duped into adding before SoF). TBS is mind-numbing. And now, in SoF, we have Hills of Shade (which is not popular, compared to MMM, Crystallos, Mech Guard, etc..)

    I really dislike the "but muh slay undead" argument when it comes to paladins. It isn't -that- useful. It doesn't hit every mob for 20k or something. It is nice when it goes off. It is nicer when it goes off a bunch. There just isn't the same level of content available for it to be a viable "thing" to base an argument in favor of a paladin.

    Now, that's just up through SoF. There won't be a whole lot of change for a few expansions. Increased proc rates on various abilities will help some. I'm not going to try to get into that level, as it has been years since I played anything beyond HoT/Alaris era. Heck, I'm not even an "expert" in the eras we've cleared on TLP's. I have played all 3 tanks. If I had to pick a tank, it would be a warrior. If I wanted versatility, I'd pick an SK. No matter how you cut it, Paladin would be at the bottom of my list. I've yet to come across any combo of skills, spells, and/or abilities that wow'd me about the class especially post Kunark.

    But everyone likes their own thing. I had an absolute blast in original and kunark. As mudflation became more and more of a thing... stats and AC hit caps.. I just slowly saw myself becoming less and less of tank I formerly was. I didn't notice it so much on live, as you're basically "at the caps" for your level instantly.

    Anyways.. I'm rambling on. That's just one person's experience. Take it with a grain of salt. Most people will probably say SK for "fun" and WAR for being a main raid tank. I can't see a whole lot of people rushing over to encourage rolling a paladin though.
    kjempff, Batbener and Sanyon like this.
  8. Mrjon3s Augur

    So raid geared Paladins Velious+ become unkillable vs regular group content. During raid trash clearing you are a tank and for bosses you rampage tank. Not many people main Paladins so most guilds are looking for them which means you can usually pick up weapons pretty easily as long as they don't let in a million Sk's.
  9. Terranos Elder

    Paladins are a good class, they are solid group tanks, better than warriors pre aggro weapons. Slightly worse than SKs but not so much that you'd get turned down for groups, they have some ok raid utility in classic which increases a bit with each xpac.

    In Luclin and beyond they get pretty damn good and fun.

    If you want to play a class for the long haul instead of swapping from one FoTM class to another through the expacs then you will do fine as a Paladin as long as you learn how to make best use of the tools you are given.

    Necros would like a word with you, they may get the nukes a few levels after Clerics but they can charm which more than makes up for it.
    Sithil likes this.
  10. HoodenShuklak Augur

    Depends how you define fun... I remember watching a Pally stream a classic raid and they literally sat with the clerics and threw up patch heals. Their DPS is bad and if there is nothing to offtank it's going to be hard to call them fun early on IMO.

    Going forward, they become (very good) rampage tanks, but most of that is spent divine aura'd which means you're not doing damage, nor casting...

    In groups they're very powerful, with a great toolkit including rez, which is huge in early EQ. A lot of classic is undead-centric too if you want to pursue that route. But on raids, I just don't see many people calling paladin one of the funner classes.
  11. Wulfhere Augur

    All 3 tanks play similarly from levels 1 to 15. Play each to say level 20 or 25 and then decide on your main. That's not a big time investment and will give you a feel for each tank class.

    In Classic, rangers (having taunt skill) are a "light tank" and can be played that way. In those terms of holding aggro in the 1 to 60 level range: paladin (best), ranger, SK, warrior (worst).
  12. Bailen Augur

    I like Pallys the best. Pallys can wear the plate armor and heal themselves.
  13. FranktheBank Augur

    Are you starting on Aradune? Here is what to expect;
    • You will be a meme of a class for a long time outside of a few situations;
      • LoH
      • DA Hammer rampage tanking (Luclin)
      • Decent group heals
      • Stunning a few raid level mobs (again, mostly luclin)
      • Pacifying
    • In PoP, you get the best root in the game, which is I still use (in AA form) now at lvl 90.
    • If you make it to TSS, you can exp in Frostcrypt where you are actually a great dps class as well as tank.
    • If you make it to Underfoot, you become the most amazing raid healer/curer and a baller class.
    Delphwind, Zinth and Terranos like this.
  14. Pallie New Member

    I dont why bust on pallies. Sure in classic they some issues, but Kunark and beyond they are great asset to groups and raids. They can get instant aggro with stuns and flash of light or root if they need too. They dont have as much dps as an SK but as a tank your not there to DPS anyway.

    They can:

    1. Heals and HoTs
    2. Crowd Control with awesome roots.
    3. Raise the Dead
    4. Cure poison and Diease
    5. Group heal in combat
    6. Remove Curse
    7. Off tank or main tank in raids
    6. Group HP and Raid HP buff
    7. Resistance Buffs
    8. Can pacify up to 55th lvl mobs
    9. DA shield
    10. Lay on Hands
    11. Cleric HP and AC buffs

    1. DA Shield
    2. Off tank or Main Tank
    3. FD pull
    4. Life Tap
    5. Self-buffs
    6. Higher DPS than a Pallie.
    7. Harm Touch
    8. Snare

    I sorry but a pallie has way more to offer a group or raid than an SK. I don't not understand why people only look at DPS when comparing Pallies to SKs. I would pick a pallie over an SK any day.
    Zinth and Bailen like this.
  15. Jaime Lannister Augur

    Unless they nerfed it, you could likely serve as one of the most vital raid classes on boss fights your guild doesn't quite have the numbers/healers for!

    You get to LoH the Tank. Taunt. Die. Get Rezzed. > Repeat ! Sometimes you can do this cycle for an entire fight !


    You going to tell me this doesn't look FUN!?

    Paladins aren't as bad as people make them sound. Also, you get blind early on that's a low mana easy aggro spell, you just have to be careful and make sure you stand on top of the target so it doesn't run away.

    Paladins can be amazing group tanks with strong utility, and they get better with each expansion. Loved playing Paladin in Velious/Luclin/PoP tbh.
    Batbener likes this.
  16. Xhartor Augur

    Sk list kind of seems incomplete:
    Aggro buffs
    Cure disease
    Some resist buffs.
    Ac and attack taps.
    AC and Attack group buffs
    Self invis

    You did group up a bunch of SK utility as Self buffs, but you split up the utility spells for paladins.
  17. Pallie New Member

    Yeh, but SKs stuff is mostly "self only "stuff or procs. Pallies have more stuff that directly benefits the group or raid.
  18. Protagonist Tank

    LoH doesn't refresh on death anymore, if that's what you mean.

    Nevermind, I'm mistaken. It does refresh.
  19. RandomStrategy Augur

    #1 Argument for Paladins:

    Few others play them so you are not fighting 15 other players gear/epic/class specific loot.

    Up to Velious on Agnarr I had 17 SKs in my guild. Paladins? 4.
  20. Sithil Elder

    HVelious we had 3, Luclin we were down to 2, then PoP we were back to 3 after picking up 1 more from merging another guild into us. During that same time I think our sk numbers were around the same, but War's were in and out. Probably 10-12 different during those 3 expansions.