Pally Balance?

Pally is not my main class, and therefore maybe my opinion is void, but are Pallies balanced with the other tanks? Most I talk to don't think so, and feel like the advantages(splash, DA hammer) are either nerfed, or given to the other tanks as well. What do you guys think?

Lol

No, it's not balanced. I think they should give Hostility higher scaling for ac mod than warriors, and a chance on hit to turn anything into an undead.

If it makes you as mad as you already are that'd be great

I'd be mad too if I chose bard as my main. Maybe they should let you guys give us infinate mana or something

Paladins are mostly fine. Our real issues:

1) Tanking the hardest content we die way too fast (SKs get their purple ability so they just live over and over through everything that kills us for its duration, so in this ONE instance SKs are better off) - but this is less a knight/paladin issue than an issue about warriors having some broken stuff that when used together makes them nearly invincible, then the devs balancing around that - NOTE: TBM is not as bad as TDS was, but the balance potential is there until the problem is fixed

2) We need better activated dps overall (our passive dps, i.e., afk swinging is fine honestly), something we have to manage but we should be doing more against single targets - but this is more of a bone to solo/groupers because even doubling our dps would mean nothing in raids - I think we need to see about a 50% boost in our "burn" dps via something that does NOT stack with valorous rage, so something we click after its down for 2-3 minute+ duration burns, and which averages out to about a 30% overall boost to live mob dps over a 20 minute duration when using discs once

3) I would *like* more "wow" factor to our undead dps, not so much the overall dps boosting a lot as much as some rare BAM! hits. We used to have the biggest single damage hits in the game when we slayed, now our biggest are about 15% of several other classes stuff. Personally, I'd like a super slay type deal that went off on 1% of slays or something that multiplied the slay by 5. Overall dps gains would be minimum but it would be FUN. Plus, you can't give us much substantial over time dps gains versus undead right now because there is a lot of undead content in the current expansion.

4) Minor issue that affects other classes but we keep getting "new" abilities that we can't use (or are only used by people playing less than optimally), because they are spells. On paper, we have 3x as much versatility as we do in practice, because in order to mem all these long recast minor use abilities, you'd have to neuter the spells you should be using. So what's the point? Would like to see us get REAL "new" spells worth using OR move some of those to activated via AA or discs.

5) Minor issue, but I feel like our group healing hasn't kept up with the game, but again this may be because we just can't afford to mem two group heals anymore due to spell slot restrictions, and because we run out of mana faster, but I think our group heal should be increased about 30% base heal value without much mana increase.

Paladins are mostly fine. Their real issue is that they have tank partiy in group content and are desired in raids as a tank AND as a healer/curer.

Instead of a TankMage with a sword who wears a landshark helmet with laserbeam eyes that sets fire to the battle field...

...they have some of the biggest heals in the game (a group heal after a Clerics DArb and their Lay on Hands), heals good enough that for years they added to Named Mob Soloing threads on their websites (I don't recall there ever being one on TSW, the Warrior site), a res that's virtually indistinguishable from a cleric res, a res stick if they aren't lazy, cures that are so good they occasionally are given a curer role in some raids, deflection, other defensive abilities that should have been unique to Warriors but were shared because they whined about 1 group event in GoD ("Connor, many of the things knights are asking for are Warrior Specific"...etc.)

(draws breath) special attacks that don't last just 30 seconds but all day long if they are fighting undead. BattleCleric (Some Clerics claim they are teh BattleCleric. I've seen parses).

Most people agree it's SK, Paladin,..........................................gee a Warrior?: How about using a merc instead?.......nm I'm a Mage I can solo this with my pet.

Paladins are one of the classes with their primary (tank), secondary (healer/curer), and tertiary (situational DPS) roles that work best together. They've very very little to complain about. Certainly not "sharing" across classes as they've successfully ganked almost 100% of the Warrior Class Description.

Battleaxe posts are my least favorite posts.

I don't agree with you , and here is why

Pal Wanted for raiding same with War , I don't know of a raid where you need a SK , but if there is one I am forgetting please let me know ...

As for Mage solo she does not do it just using pet ,must heal pet, place runes on pet, dmg mob, a lot is going on when Mage solo , now if you ment molo that is whole new game , but then anyone can molo cant they ? Just some do it faster and better then others ...And as for Merc tank vs Real player tank are you serious ? Merc is not even close too player Tank, many mission you need a tank, pet or merc wont cut it ...

Yi Min

Paladin posts suggesting Defensive should be removed from the game or shared were my least favorite posts especially as Defensive was most effective vs. high DI (dangerous by definition) mobs.

Just be grateful I didn't quote the "Connor, most of the things..." post in its entirety. It's QUITE an indictment.

Maybe make a bard DoT worth casting?

Adding a small chance of a mega slay undead that would be similar to assassinate/decap/headshot is an awesome idea and honestly there shouldn't be a soul opposed to this.

Fixed that for you.

Lol only battleaxe would bring his hatred for the Magician class into a thread titled Pally Balance...

1. I believe that the word you intended is "formerly", not "formally". Fixed that for you.
2. I like all OP classes that can perform the role of a narrowly focused class plus do a number of other things well.
3. You conveniently ignore my main points:
a. Paladins are rather elegantly constructed and are also in good shape in both group and raid content.
b. Given a long Paladin campaign for defensive-like abilities to the point of actually rejecting SOE's initial solution to some overtuned content in GoD:
"We will not be adding defensive discs or abilities to the knight classes. We will be tuning the content so that it is a challenge for everyone and excludes no one."
in a successful bid to acquire a Warrior ability that should not have been shared Paladins can hardly complain about sharing.

I still find myself tipping over occasionally.

PAL good in groups and raids, mediocre soloers
SHD good in groups and soloing, somewhat limited in raiding
WAR good in groups and raids, poor at soloing

Most credible Paladin issues I see posted are with regard to mana problems or specific aggro issues. Knights sometimes take issue with raid boss tanking being semi-exclusive to Warriors, though this impacts only a very slim minority of players. All tanks have a common issue that we require more gear/effort to perform our main role than other classes.

Overall Paladins are pretty well-off. Probably in a better position than most classes. Maybe the best-off of the tanks.

Where would I even start if I wanted to. Generally I feel that a person should maintain some decorum when posting on an internet message board, but LOLOLOLOL!

Please stop quoting in all together. One message from a dev who isn't even with the game anymore means less than nothing. The game has changed so much the quote may as well been about WoW for all the good it does today. GoD was released in 2004. It's been 12 years. I think that's a sufficient amount of time to say that the game has evolved into something more.

If Paladins didn't get any defensive abilities in today's game, they would be getting steamrolled.

And do you have all these old quotes, polls, and all the other things you repeat endlessly saved on a word doc? Or have you just repeated so much to yourself that you've now memorized them?

He probably has screen shots of every conversation he ever had with a Dev. Maybe he is going to use those quotes to write an Everquest Bible?

The one thing where i see us not performing is DPS, while slay undead is great it has not improved on its own as an AA but basically leaving it all to the type and dmg level of weapon, while mob count (undead) has been lowered not to mention any raid target that’s undead (?) their HP has increased astronomically to the point that 100k slay its prob 3% of mobs HP even the new aa nuke it’s so not worth it, that when doing group content I keep forgetting to use it because of the long recast and the amount of dmg it does.

While we are not meant to solo, dmg vs live mob its in the toilet, new stun consumes to much mana so not use, I for one would love to see some AA that brings back the joy we had while doing undead mobs.