I don't know if this is actually what you meant but if it is it's exactly what I'm arguing against. I don't think all three should have all the same abilities, why have three different classes if they did. One should mitigate damage better, one should dps better and one should have more utility than the others. They should all be able to tank current content and serve a clear purpose in groups. We're definitely nowhere near that now and probably never will be.
francisco, didn't you take up paladining fairly recently? I hope you understand this as an honest question, and not an attack since it's not meant as one, but here goes regardless - if you have such a strong appreciation for the Shadowknight tool set in the idiom of your usual play, why not be a Shadowknight? I'm not even suggesting you swap characters, really. You maybe/probably have a good answer as to why you won't. But that good reason, whatever it is, should stand to illustrate that there's some balance already found between the classes.
I guess a lot of the complaints were centered around ae agro, is this a raid thing? I seldom use any ae abilities because usually just pull one at a time. Might get an occasional add in Droga but for most other zones hasn't seemed to be a problem.
You still lose a slot if they aren't tanking. And if they are tanking and healing you aren't being very efficient in how you pull, or aren't maxing out what the group can do. Is it possible to heal/stun through singles? Sure. Is it faster to pull everything and kill it with expedience? Absolutely.
They can tank and heal at the same time. I've watched it many times with group geared pallys (and with raid geared pallys it was more impressive). Maybe a better group could have done things better, but a pally can tank and heal at the same time. Yes, I'm talking all by himself, possibly with a ranger ready to throw a fast heal if it looks ugly.
Don't even try to act like a paladin self healing through singles with a group is half as efficient as pulling 5 to 10 at a time burning through everything with a real healer. Play with better paladins. Hah
I've seen paladins pulling 2 and 3 at a time with a dps merc. Never found a group pulling 5 to 10 in any of the new content, but I'm group geared and stick to group content. Must be a different game for raiders.
Group geared tanks with a real healer can pull and beat 10 mobs. I did it a couple nights ago when a mob warped in Droga onto twitter and tweeted out #tucoshere to all his followers.
I have no idea what raiders do, I am in EOK T2/T1 group gear, hell some slots are still crap from the vendor in TBM.
We're getting off track here but I think the point was (1) a Paladin can function as a group healer, be it as tank or not (SK can't do that part) and (2) their healing is actually a heck of a lot better. All of that to refute the claim one person made that Paladins heals are meaningless, which they certainly are not.
pretty much any class with healing abilities can crit heal any tank in the game for full life with one heal so this point is mute. doesnt matter if you heal yourself/group for 200k or 500k its still going to completely fill your health bar lol
As a warrior I must be doing something wrong or Paladins are WAY tougher than us. I can do 2 no problem 3 in a pinch, 4 if I burn quite a bit of discs, but there is no way I can do 10. Fully EoK tier two geared.
And if a Pally is pulling 10 mobs and keeping them off of the rest of his group I'd assume his AE Agro is pretty good. Am I wrong?
You caught that as well? In multiple threads its paladins cant get aggro over a single mob because of how bad their aggro is never mind how god awful their AE aggro is. Then here its if your not tanking 5 - 10 mobs at a time your being inefficient and find better paladins. Paladins could use some aggro love so they dont have to work that much more compared to the other tanks. But they hold aggro just fine and the rest of this whiney nonsense is from the same 2-3 people who claim the sky is falling with how bad paladins are but its far from the truth in both group and raid.
The tank DPS upgrade with AA is nice, because it allowed me for the first time since a long time to do some progression in the current expansion when I was not finding a group. With 0 DPS, tanks are forced to either box, or wait lfg because they are unable to kill stuff on their own in the current expansion. Especially true for warriors who are the worst soloers of the 3 tank classes. Before this DPS upgrade, in raiding guilds, groups had no reason to get a tank, because you could use a raid geared melee DPS to tank group content, and with a tank bringing bad DPS, why bother getting one ? This still happens today, but this time the tank can do some things on his own in waiting of a spot.
