So the whole TLP thing received one of the most in depth and player-involved posts to date: https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/...oming-poll-details.219588/page-6#post-3201579 What about those of use who play on real servers? Are all of our resources feeding the new TLP server? It'd be nice if we could get a *real* "On the horizon" thread for the actual game that's live now. It's really frustrating that all attention is being siphoned toward TLP. Could we get some polls in game on the live servers for some of the bazillion issues that come up? DBG has moved with incredible speed on getting this TLP server ironed out and ready for launch (it even gets a beta?!)... why can't we see some of that momentum in regards to Live servers?
This thought was more or less the impetus behind my apparently ill-named post: https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/index.php?threads/what-legitimate-demand-is-there-for-tlp.219493/ (With all the TLP posts on the forums, I mistakenly assumed that everyone, even those who don't TLP, knew what it meant. Mea culpa.) While I think for some reason the TLPers tend to be the vocal minority, man are they ever vocal. It skews the perception towards thinking that more people are interested in TLP than not... or not. I just really want to know the facts. Why is that so hard? The bottom line question really and truly should be, for DeyBreakGames at least--what percentage of accounts are interested in TLP? Because it really, really feels like an inordinate amount of attention is being paid to a tiny part of the EQ population.
This question should have been answered for DBG with their first TLP poll. I asked for those results to be posted so we would all know the answer, but so far that request has been ignored. Seeing the actual number of votes for each of the options would give us an idea of how many people actually want a TLP.
The truth is that their interest in TLP has nothing to do with their current playerbase; It's intended to bring back lapsed accounts. They are already getting your money, but they haven't got a dime from me since I let my 3 accounts lapse to silver (how long has it been since silver/gold was a thing?) I and many others will come back and re-sub for a progression server but I have no desire to slog through 105 levels and 16 (?) expansions, the last 9 or 10 of which I don't know or care about. I will probably stick around for a few years, admittedly with a month or two off here and there when I burn out. It's like a phone or cable company offering deals to new subscribers. Current customers aren't eligible for those deals because "We already have your money, **** off!"
Dzarn has been on the last several beta's....figured this was common knowledge, the content has become significantly less garbage.
TLP made them 4 years of subs worth of profits in 1 year. That's not a 'tiny portion' - people that came back bought and reactivated anywhere between 1 and 20 accounts and bought raf ontop of that mid kunark for hundreds of other accounts. '
They stated it pretty clearly how much of a smashing success was at fan faire. It was also the only thing that kept them above water/in the green. It was sold for a reason.
They've been quoted at incredibly popular (and thus profitable since every account has to pay) before - I'm not sure his weird math, not seen that one. But factually there were at least 4700 players that got to 40+ on Fippy and Vulak (the last EQPlayers numbers pulled were 3100ish for Fippy, 1600ish for Vulak for characters at least level 40 [which required a level of commitment there] during very early Kunark) - assuming there were zero people beyond that, that's between $50k ($10/mo from a long sub) and $75k ($15/mo from month to month) a month those two servers generated for them assuming there was NO ONE that didn't stick to lower level characters, and no one that kept EQPlayers updates off, etc. That's a bare minimum of at least one person's salary handled by a single server during it's heyday - and it's not factoring in Station Cash (which will always be skewed towards new characters buying more), sub-40's, etc. And it's been shown that now that the core framework is set up, most of the tweaks that the design needs aren't that difficult in development time. In short it's very low investment for what is likely their single most profitable server type to date. (Since the post-WoW slump)
How many of those numbers weren't already paying members with an established account? IE. The number of accounts that generated no new money because they were already there. I'm sure it's quite a bit. So, without that information all of the guesswork about how much or how many people it brought is moot. Popularity =/= revenue. EQ is popular (it wouldn't be having it's 16th anniv. otherwise). That doesn't mean it makes a lot of money. SOE/DBG does not disclose financials like that. They've said so in the past. Is there a direct quote suggesting that's true?
Well, it's anecdotal so has limited value - but for the people I interacted with on the server and spoke to on the topic, which did include a reasonable number of people (being a guild leader on one and officer in the other, with the wife being recruitment for both - probably at least 300 or so we interacted with to the level that we knew their recent play experience) and I can count on a single hand out of the hundreds I mention above that did not come back from not playing. To imply any massive number were sapped off of Live is likely incorrect - substantial is likely incorrect as well. Again we've been told that these servers were a resounding success for SOE in the past - so it's likely my anecdotal evidence parses close to reality.
Okay, I'll take your word for it and assume that is true. I am also confident to say many people maintain characters on Live and TLP simultaneously as well though. So, nothing was sapped from Live; no new revenue was generated in some cases. I am sure some new subs were brought in. I guess money is money and they assume the people already subscribed will keep forking over cash. That will only last so long though when it becomes abundantly obvious your company's focus is not on the actual game but some alternate twilight zone universe of one server. While I think the TLP people are a lil over the top (and why in the world do they get their own forum but tradeskills and other stuff that are an integral part of ALL EQ not?)... I don't have an actual problem with it. What I have a problem with is the current display of attention being given solely to TLP. Live servers got this measly post with lackluster information. Sorry, anniversary content announcements do not serve as a huge supplement to the going-ons of the game and future developments. Wooooo... we're getting a POK click in the marketplace (even though they JUST added one via Anniversary task). That still isn't in the marketplace btw. In the past we've been told POLLS ARE BAD YOU CAN'T HAVE THEM and now we get all of these polls with such in-depth details posted that it's a complete paradigm shift... that only occurred with the TLP announcement. What kindof message does that send? Perception is everything. Anyhow, April is almost over so how about an actual meaningful May/June Horizon post? Please leave out marketplace items as one of your major highlights btw- that don't impress me much - que Shania.
A lot of people don't realize sony pioneered the whole F2P model that is currently running the MMO genre. EQ2 did it first, the game was slated to close down unless it was a huge success. It was and it's still going because of that. The same people that figured how to keep EQ2 in the green discovered a model to turn one server into a more profitable venture than anything else. They will continue TLP servers long after this one, they may even close live servers and stay exclusively on a TLP model as long as it operates in the green.
What a horrific thought. I'd still think they'd at least keep one or two live servers around (after a ton of mergers) if they continued to churn out TLPs. For every person that likes TLP, there is one who doesn't. Would a TLP only world maintain a large enough base to cover future expenses?
I'd just like to comment to those that don't understand the draw or the business model of a progression server. There are two groups that gravitate to progression, at opposite ends of the time commitment scale. 1) People that liked casual EQ back in classic expansions. I'll let that expire after PoP/Luclin. 2) People that will roll on ANY NEW server to race to the finish and get server firsts. There might even be a third group called Kuk Clan who apparently has all of the Vulak TLP server to himself. I've been playing since 1999 and my highest character isn't yet level 95. My interest dwindles as things get more instanced, more "missions", more dailies. In my opinion, this kind of content is how Blizzard ruined Warcraft, which was tremendous fun in vanilla/old days. I'm all access but that will likely lapse since the 95-100+ game has no attraction to me. The only thing keeping me and my friends playing (subscribing) is a level 50 group we're still playing on live. There is no way that will persist past 75 - I'll never do SoD progression again or anything past that. So a progression server? Yeah that sounds good to us. We get to play the best parts of EQ, quit when it gets past PoP. EQ gets us subscribing for another 2-3 years. Live servers just make the level 1-60 game advance far too quickly to stop and smell the roses. There is no reason at all to play the classic game on live since it can be done in a day/hours if you don't make efforts to slow it down. The best part for DBG is that they never have to make any new content to roll new progression servers... forever. From a business perspective, I think that looks very, very attractive.
I was reading on my news feed while grabbing dinner just now that WoW is starting to dabble with some TLPish concepts now on their PTR even.
I saw some high profile WoW player tweet Blizzard asking for Vanilla servers, BC servers, etc (similar to the private servers available in that community). That was pretty recent, wonder if it was in response or just a crazy coincidence.
There are rumors about no new expansions / content being planned for Eq1. I'm not a troll nor are the people i heared it from trolls, and i also don't believe it for now. But the silence isn't good and some comments would be nice, clearly some people are worried. Why? Because we know that Eq would live on, on classic / progression servers...it's not an impossible thought that new expansions won't happen anymore with a very reduced staff. Also it's already confirmed Eq2 cuts expansions. If it's all hot air...great, please make a statement or something against these rumors.
