When is NTTB going to stack once again with Vie? We were told this issue was being looked into. Thank you.
I believe we were told in the original thread that sorry, nope, we're stuck with it as is for the foreseeable future. I'll try to dig up the post and edit it in here.
From the 5 Devs chat: WarriorSheena: Aristo, what direction do you plan on taking the warrior class in? What should our niche be and have you looked into cleric spell conflict issues with No Time to Bleed? EQ-Aristo: As always, we're looking at ways to make sure that Warriors are capable tanks in the most situations, while retaining the unique styles of play for all three tank classes. We're aware the current implementaion of No Time To Bleed does have a conflict with some other abilities, and it might change in the future, but right now this implementation is the only way it works without unintended other immunities. http://eqresource.com/board/index.php?topic=2125 I think they gave up caring about it
Ah yes, that's the reference I was remembering. It's basically a big "meh" of indifference to the warrior concerns about this. Considering how responsive they were to the SKs around the same time with the swarming nerf, it still rankles. They got the nerf tailored for least impact, and we got told to like it or lump it. Care to guess why I am cynical about the effectiveness of any upcoming further "fixes" to warrior issues?
I am waiting for an anniversary item that is an all/all Lich Sting or I would even take a Brells. Once again it bolsters my belief that all Dev's play Mages and SK's.
Two points you have to look at with the swarming issue SK's brought hard evidence to the devs to mitigate the how it effected our class. The only war I have seen doing that recently was Deagun. The second is our abilities had been in the game for a very very long time and were class defining, where NTTB while really nice was only around for a short time before they "fixed" their error. Comparing the 2 is not really productive for a war to do.
First, we did in fact bring hard evidence of the problems with the nerf, like the stacking issues with Vie, and the choppy damage taken which makes healing us trickier. Second, NTtB was seen as a fix to a problem which warriors have been pointing out for literally years, which had been continuously ignored before that, and which has gone back to being ignored: our severe inferiority as group tanks due to our lack of an analog to SK and paladin self healing. Being able to passively take less damage than everyone else is quite literally the sole purpose of the warrior class. So I will agree that NTtB was new. I do not agree that it was not class defining; it was before, and ironically remains so now even in its new half-crippled and much less useful incarnation. Finally, the issue is not whether the abilities are comparable between SKs and warriors. The issue is that when the players complained about a major nerf, on the one hand, there was a good and productive discussion between SKs and devs about how to mitigate the changes, on the other hand there was warriors getting told to suck it up, never mind that the issue we're "fixing" were brought up in Beta, never mind that it doesn't give warriors anything nearly as game breaking as swarming, and then warriors were told that needing more healing was a feature not a problem because it meant the healers weren't going to get bored. In short, warriors were told to shut up and soldier, and SKs got a meaningful conversation about their role in game and playstyle. The former is a case study in exactly what not to do for PR and CS, and the latter was one of the best examples of players getting their concerns meaningfully addressed I have ever seen in the entire lifetime of the game. Literally happening back-to-back. Do you perhaps now grasp why I am still not at all happy with the devs and community relations people?
I'm sorry I did forget about that vie stacking, I also agree that there should have maybe been a bit more discussion on that part. They did say they would look into it, and that is about as good as can be expected. The other reason SK's got their talk in was because how big the nerf was and how many classes it effected, they acknowledged that and opened up discussions. To the Devs the NTTB was a Fix not a Nerf, you have to look at it from their perspective. As far as class defining abilities it takes years to make something that way, such as War FS and SK lifeleach and pally splash. NTTB wasn't out long enough to be considered one. To make it so, the class has to be molded around it, Wars are not molded around NTTB yet, that may change in the future, but as of now they are not. You will know when it is because you will get the, I'm sorry you cannot have XYZ because of NTTB, SK's were held back for years because of our epic and the abilities it gave.
As you can see upthread, they recanted on saying they would fix it. "Sorry, too bad for you, deal with it" seems to be the attitude now. And I think perhaps you misunderstand what I mean when I say NTtB is class-defining. It was class defining in that it allowed us to once again operate according to the original definition of the class, and now in it's half-broken state it once again is emblematic of the half-broken state of warrior tanking. I would very much like to be more than 3 minutes of tanking against an edge-case raid boss. Right now, I am soundly trounced on every other front, and have been for a very long time. It's getting extremely tiresome, and it has led to many warriors less patient than I am giving up and changing class out of frustration.
