WARRIOR Warriors are the masters of armed combat and defense, taking the point in battles and going head-to-head with the most dangerous creatures of Norrath. Warriors are a melee class with the ability to wear plate armor and wield all types of weapons. Warriors build their strength and stamina to unheard-of levels, making them far hardier than any other class. When combined with their heavy armor and excellent defensive skills, warriors are unmatched in their ability to survive the most brutal battles. Warriors train themselves in the skills of combat, mastering the use of all weapons and tactics. Warriors also learn to taunt their opponents, making themselves the focus of all their enemies' attacks, allowing the less-resilient members of their group to remain safe from harm. Sounds Great doesn't it? from- https://www.everquest.com/classes I play what is supposedly a top end group geared warrior. I have all current group gear and augs. I've been playing my toon steadily for almost 12 years now. Not boasting here, just showing that I do have experience playing this character. 33.2K AAs, 1,161 days played. I never sat in the Lobby or PoK waiting for buffs, so that's a lot of time actually playing this game...and a lot of time sitting on my a--. I chose my Class because it was the challenge that appealed to me...and it still does. I don't want a spell book, I don't want to be god like, but I do want to be able to survive whatever is thrown at me. I'm supposed to be hard to kill and I am... up to a point. I have a limited amount of useful defenses. They're for emergency use only due to long refresh timers and I must choose wisely because its all I've got. Here's my NTTB complaint: /rant on Example - The Descending Tower - Dead Hills Mission - Never had an issue doing this mission until now - Kill the 4 Captains script has become the intense hold my breath part of this mission. The fight with a (shielded) Captain at 75%, 45%,10% plus his reinforcement add is a long fight. a (shielded) Captain is hitting me for 10-17k - plus the reinforcement add = NOT A GOOD TIME FOR NTTB to Fade, but it does and there's no getting it back for another 2 minutes. Should rename it to TIME TO BLEED. Have to use Last Stand until NTTB is ready again. All defensive AAs have been used...the useful ones anyway. Holding my breath and waiting for a heal to land is about all I can do during the end of the fight.. Now as fun as this sounds...This isn't a named fight! Why am I being put through this kind of intensity for a heroic adventure mission? and...we have 3 more captains to go! I survive it all, not saying its a death fest or anything, but dang...why does it have to be so intense for a Warrior to survive a group mission when the other tanks can just breeze right through it All the Time? I experienced what it felt like to breeze through this mission several times a week and now I'm just disgusted. I'm a Group Geared Warrior and this Disc was a major help from Day 1 of this expansion. I wish I never bought it. It made me relax and think these mobs are not so difficult. That's another thing...Are these Captains going to be retuned? I can almost hear them snickering at me when I zone in..."Oh look...a Warrior has entered the zone, this ought to be fun" /rant off
Vote with your wallets people don't allow them to steamroll us like they have been for years. I had 2 gold accounts both expire in 2 days and I have cancelled them both. When they fix us I may consider coming back but for now I will go spend my time on other games. I hope enough of you do the same so we can all come back to this game we have devoted so many years to and enjoy it. I don't even care if they leave NTtB nerfed as is as long as they fix group warriors for good.
just raided without it tonight.. man never heard as many complaints as i had tonight. and now all the stacking issues with cleric buffs... Major Major over nurf I know one guy cancled 2 accounts out of rage for this change.
This nerf is horrible, (and i don't have a warrior alt) it's like giving a child an ice cream and then eating half of it in front of him after he tasted it and loved it.
I have 3 account and in 2 weeks they expire and will not be renewed till NTTB is fixed right or put back till a proper fix is found. Normally when a company find 99% of their customers say they did something wrong the company tries to fix it. Not Sony there would rather insult our intelligence and say we don't understand the meaning of sustained and the nerf was ok. Was thinking about going to EQ next but then I realized that they will just do the same thing there.
Agreed, at the moment I'm not buying the whole "let's shape the game together" EQ Next deal. This thread was started during the beta, has over 250 posts, and we have yet to see a dev (that's saying how distant actual changes are) ; so far we just got some crowd control spells thrown at us by Piestro (which WE all resisted by the way ). Show that you can listen to your playerbase beloved SOE, and act on it, then maybe we will trust you with your Next big thing.
So I guess I am confused how NTTB with the detrimental resistance removed, is somehow considered overpowered if its up for 5 minutes? Raid mobs hit for 40k. With NTTB they hit for 37k. That's really a rounding error in the grand scheme of things. Even in Last stand you are 20kish vs 17kish. Obviously the stacking issues with Vie (at least I assume) will be fixed, but I fail to see the developers side of the equation. Perhaps if you were to post the mathematics behind the decision it would help all of us understand the thinking. The biggest concern is outside of Final Stand on raids, this added reasonable survivability while tanking (while stacked with everything else). Now you are virtually dead once LS fades, especially on the new raids with bosses hitting for 100k+. In the group game, warriors are pretty useless all around. Id rather box a knight than play my main at this point. Hell geared monks tank better.
That's not obvious at all. One can "waste" all or part of several abilities because of when you use them and what you use them with. Not everything stacks. Not everything that doesn't stack has each better effect replace the lesser effect until the conflict fades. Further not all non-raid groups have Enchanters. The effects on NTtB isn't inherently a waste of space. I certainly agree this should be looked at, but understand that the outcome will not necessarily be the most beneficial outcome possible. It will be as close to what was intended as possible. http://www.elitegamerslounge.com/home/progress/index.php?expansion=CotFT1b Gamewide the Woots drowned out the tears by progression raid guilds by a substantial margin. (Before anyone says "a minority of raid guilds you might check the T1A progression chart. with NTtB in it's original state not everyone listed made good progress).
would like to make it clear .. warriors are not stupid ... so feeding us a bunch of crap is not going to fool us into thinking its all good .. give us the real reason and real numbers as to why we have been pushed back to the bottom of the pack for tanking again .. and BB plz stop talking .. your just making every other warrior mad
It's "you're" and the guild progression chart is numbers sir. http://www.elitegamerslounge.com/home/progress/index.php?expansion=CotFT1b Gamewide the Woots drowned out the tears by progression raid guilds by a substantial margin. The changes to NTtB did not create a progression or even a sit out all Warriors let knights do everything train wreck. Where Warriors were thumped by what I'd think were overly hard hitting mobs they'd have been thumped pre NTtB changes as well. I agree Warriors and devs aren't stupid. They can tell hand wringing from actual outcomes. Are most of us taken aback on how well having VERY Warrior-like defensive abilities PLUS combat self-healing knights do vs. what we thought were "our mobs"? You bet. But many have been just as taken aback by seeing SK's PLing at kill rates Warriors can not duplicate. However with many influential Warriors being max level/max AA'd - too bad for non-raid Warriors who aren't /tosses non-raid Warriors under the bus. Swarming is baaad (if Warriors do it)...mmmmkay?
You know BB if you don't know how to swarm (just as well as an sk in a zone 5 levels lower then them ) then I don't know what to tell you on that . Our riposte will kill mobs almost as fast . NttB was not a swarm ability pulling 20 - 40 mobs with it up would of made it disappear in less then a minute. Considering every mob you would be capable of swarming would always hit for less then nttb absorbs it would take a charge every swing. We should not be balanced to stop us from swarming who the heck cares about swarming? Do you do it ? Do you know 100 warriors on your server that do it and inflate krono ? I know sks and beserkers and mages that use the abilities they have to do that. But I would laugh at any warrior trying because it is a waste of effort. I use a monk to get my toons up to the level that is needed to put them in a group that pls every single day on my server and I use a mage before that and a cleric ds set up. People that powerlevel usually burn out very fast and then they are gone let them burn themselves out. And worry about fixing the problems at hand not nerfing every good ability we get because your skeered we can DW or swarm with it. And besides even on your server I was able to make 5 million platinum in less then a month farming tradable tier 1 armor and making armor templates ,bags ,and powersources. It can be done anywhere no matter what server you are on. And that was without even having a dedicated group . Even on FV I do not sell raid gear . Even without selling currency I have made 100 million in a month here. If that is what you want to do it is easy even without powerleveling. Learn how to be better and let others have fun however they want. It is not up for anyone else to dictate how others spend their time in this game that includes you.
Btw I died on both raids we defeated as soon as nttb and last stand dropped the very next round on neriak and the very next single hit from the commander so yay for nerfs.
Decided to pet tank and range dps all of chelsith 1 for fun. Its much much easier than trying to tank on my warrior. Seriously i have full raid gear and with 3 mercs im dying...thats not tuning thats stupidity.
The problem is the huge difference in damage received with nttb and without, especially with a boxed healer. Why not lowering the power of the rune and make it sustainable?
Define "full raid gear". I was boxing/farming this mission pretty much every time the lockouts were up with T1/T2 ROF raid gear and had no issue at all tanking it with merc healers, this was long before NTTB was introduced. I understand the frustration, really, but making things up to garner attention won't get us anywhere. I had more typed out but it didn't make sense.
One thing we really need to do here is turn away from the "feelings" based frustration posting and breath for a few minutes. Those are the kinds of posts that will inevitably drag us down even further and we certainly don't want that.
The fact of the matter is this: NTTB was put in game originally to help level the playing field (or give warriors the tanking advantage) that they should have both in group and raid content, over their knight counterparts. Before this devolves into a knight vs war competition, let me say that from day 1 in EQ, warriors were designed to be the heaviest tanks.. Our gear always had a few more hp, and a few more AC over knights. Fast forward to the present. Due to how hard mobs hit these days, even if knights have 90% of a wars hps (I think this is a low estimate however, and the totals are closer, with wars still edging knights by a few k, though mainly from AA, not from gear), even if I as a war have a 10k hp advantage over a knight, when a mob hits for 20, 30, up to 70k in current raids, 10k doesnt mean a damned thing...I lose half my health in a single hit, I basically sit with my thumb in my hoping a cleric or two heal me before I get smoked. If I'm a knight however, I have taps, or self heals that have a pretty good chance to get me back up high enough that another round wont finish me off, if heals are slow. Yes, I know we as wars have flash of anger, but the reuse on that is huge compared to the reuse of taps and heals. NTTB ensured, even if only slightly, that we didnt get pounded THAT hard to begin with, so that in a quad round, we'd take on average 14-15k less damage than a knight, all the time (5 min duration, 5 min reuse). The high hit count ensured that in 5 minutes the rune wouldnt drop versus a single mob in a raid tanking setting, or several mobs 1 or 2 at a time in a group setting. This made up slightly for our inability to patch ourselves up before the next round. We still cant self heal (nor do I feel we should... so dont bother spouting your canned garbage battlepaladin), but this AA gave us a guaranteed safety net to buy time before the next heal landed. It in no way allowed us to swarm, as the rune would wear off long before the train died. Now, with the nerf, despite being the best geared warrior in game as of this posting, I am out tanked by knights in equal gear when NTTB drops. The devs have painted warriors into such a corner already, and when we get a distinguishing ability, its immediately downgraded to the point where its near useless. You may as well remove it entirely at this point, because the second it drops vs raid content, the war is probably going to die... kind of a crappy existence.
