Next TLP server PVP Sullon Zek ruleset.

Sounds like a good way to just piss off the live/pve crowd, unless there are no pve benefits to dgoing to these zones.

EQ pvp is broken, and you can't really introduce something like this and have players enjoy it without fixing and balancing it. Which is nigh impossible, because among other things it would require eliminating map hacks.

The following is why the casual / mid level player quits EQ PvP servers:

1) Lack of Raid Gear -> Gear is a major factor in the balance of EQ's PvP, the power gap becomes too large. Without instances one no-life guild monopolizes all raid targets/gear and creates an absurd advantage over the rest of the server.

AoC's solve this. Guilds would still compete over the open world encounters to secure extra gear and gain that bit of an advantage, but guilds unable to compete on a raid level would still be able to run their instances and obtain gear to stay within the realm of competing over small scale targets / dungeons. This is the number one reason why people quit. After an expansion or two of the same guild monopolizing raid targets the power gap is too large to compete even if you manage to secure the numbers and the talent.

2) Corpse Camping -> No longer a thing, you spawn with your gear.

3) Out of Range Healing -> This would have to be addressed. If there's a level range on a PvP server, healing someone out of your range should flag you into that PvP range. No low level "immy healers."

4) Plug Pulling / Zone Dancing -> Would need to be addressed. Bandaid fix is to have any character that disconnected while zoning still spawn on the other side of the zone as a killable linkdead target. (At release this is what happened). Other way is to require X amount of seconds of being out of combat before you can zone. This would prevent zone dancing for hours as well.

5) Bind Camping -> Would need to be addressed. Bandaid fix is to allow someone that takes a PvP death to chose to spawn at their bind or their origin. (Although both spots could be camped)

6) Map Hacks -> It would definitely have a negative impact on a PvP server if it's as common as everyone makes it out to be. I don't know the specifics here.

No idea how much dev time it would take to implement the above. I'd wager there's enough people out there to have a successful and populated server though, as long as it's done right.

On the other hand if they launched an EQ PvP TLP with immy healing, corpse camping, bind camping, no instances, plug pulling, and map hacks it'd fail pretty quickly. I'd still play it until it died though

I'm really the one that should be asking that question LUL. Like why is it so hard for people to accept that Phinny is dead. It's very obvious too a non-biased person like myself, but apparently not to those that desperately want to play until it catches up with live.

WaitingforMoreEQ: Hey guys, there are no people living in <insert city name here>.

*looks up current population of the city and sees there are plenty of people living there still*

Conspiracy theorist making up things without providing facts.

Ya'll honestly need help man. The amount of over simply posting a factual statement regarding Phinny low and declining population is unreal.

Where was the factual statement? I'm having trouble finding it.

As you may have already noted in my response, I was suggesting things like limited cross-teaming and so on. I wasn't saying that desirable content should be behind a PvP wall.

Even if it was (as certain PvP-specific loot has been on Zek), I doubt it would appeal much to blue players. The big PvP-purchased item on Zek was pumices with decreased cast times, for instance. Not a huge advantage in PvE.

As for map hacks--this isn't a huge deal. If map hacks were the only element of third party programs that worked on Zek, I would resub in a heartbeat. You just need to assume when another player comes into a zone that PvP is incoming. That was true even before the proliferation of third party programs, this just takes it from an 80 percent likelihood to a 100 percent likelihood, and makes it happen in 30 seconds instead of 5 minutes.

Warp, speedhacks, see SoS, and incredibly sticky /follow functionality have always been the gamebreaking parts of third party programs in PvP. PvP is supposed to be cat and mouse affair, and movement mechanics give classes with less burst DPS a fighting chance. That's totally erased if someone can warp on top of your head, and stick to you with bard speed until you're dead.

Sorry, I played EQ pvp before stick was a regularly occuring thing, but map hacks made a huge difference as far back as 2000. The problem is, if you just throw up your hands in resignation and say that they can't get rid of them so everyone should just assume that PVP is incoming, you massively disadvantage those who are unwilling to cheat. As long as you do that, EQ PVP will not be viable.

Not so. You speak for the blue server experience, sure, where cheat use--especially passive map use--can tilt competition for content in an enormously favorable way for one guild. Looking for roaming and rare spawns, etc.

From a PvP perspective, there's no disadvantage to not having a map against someone who has it, or at least the disadvantage is very minor. PvP players do /who every 10-15 seconds anyway, and when there's someone in the zone with you, you either prep for PvP or you leave. The difference between prepping for PvP with someone who is tracking you on the map and someone who isn't is the difference between waiting for them to check the various camps and having them on you right away. Even on a server without any map hacks, PvP is coming for you 95 percent of the time someone else is in the zone. It's just a matter of how fast.

The exception to this is something like the Discord server, where the mechanics give anyone using map hacks a huge advantage, and that's taking us all the way back past the em cue days into the sho EQ days, which are long gone.

Once someone is in combat with you, the map ceases to provide an advantage. Their ability to maintain target on you even if you stealth, their ability to stick, and to warp back onto you if you shadow step, lyre leap, rocket boots, etc., and their ability to catch anybody if they run (with bard speed cheats) breaks the encounter.

So you can say the map is the problem, and that you've been around EQ long enough to know, but all that shows is that you've played blue most if not all of that time, and the issue you're bringing up as a reason not to have more red servers is a problem just as bad--if not worse--on blue servers.

Nope. I played exclusively on the zeks from 1999 to 2004.

Uh huh.

Yup, people can hate on this as much as they want. But I know about 20 people who would come play pvp if they opened a server for it and I'm just one person.

I'd def play SZ pvp tlp. Sullon zek was the most fun I ever had on eq.

I know so many that would come back to eq for SZ pvp. You don't want our money daybreak? lol

If we have a PvP server there should be a reward for slaying a player e.g. 1 item and their platinum.

There should be a dice roll for the 6th slot bag too become a "PC loot table' where you get bag slot 1 as rare and bag slot 6 or whatever as common (dice roll) also you get 1/10th of their platinum. Have open trading FV rules I don't care what expansion it goes up to but there should be some sort of hunter NPC for hunting down players, not sure on level spread for slaying but I think 7 level killing spread on PvP.

This is my dream server.

P.S. Raid queuing also.

We definitely need a cool PvP server. I'm sick of no one playing on Agnarr and hiding away on Coirnav.