Need before greed?!

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by HoodenShuklak, May 23, 2017.

  1. AgentofChange Augur


    Strawberry post, I stopped there. Literally no one cares.
    Galleyan likes this.
  2. Lankie Augur

    Letting all group members roll on an item = loot whoring
    Demanding an expensive item because its an upgrade = Fair and totally not greedy.

    Logic is gone.

    Have fun soloing if thats how you play.
    yerm likes this.
  3. Strawberry Augur

    I frankly don't know who you are, you just registered recently

    If my post is that upsetting to you, ignore the post, I'm not forcing you to read them.
  4. Carns Lorekeeper

    No, seriously, you need to stop. Most of us began to see we were getting bamboozled by HighKeep... when the same clerics showed up every single day in need of the wis shield after winning it the day before.
  5. Strawberry Augur

    Then don't invite those clerics anymore or tell them that what they're doing isn't fair. That's not a reason to throw Need before Greed overboard or to just start loot whoring everything that drops.
  6. crag79 Augur

    PUG groups should always be need rolls unless you are just there for the xp and don't care about money. Guild groups should be NBG because these are the people you are going to be working with for the next x number of year hopefully, and you are building a relationship with them.

    As a caster on the last 2 TLP's I always went into a LGUK group with giving the knowledge that I won't roll on the first few FBSS just so that the melee have a chance, but at some point I need to make some cash and if we are having good luck with the RNG, I am going to get in on it.
  7. Grelf Journeyman

    I've got no problem giving an upgrade to someone who needs it.

    I'm playing the game for fun, not RMTing. If I were RMTing, I'd have the attitude of all of the other RMTs in this thread.
  8. Lankie Augur

    Letting all group members roll = RMT. Confirmed


    Can we get a list of everyone that likes NBG so I can ignore them on day 1?
  9. Strawberry Augur

    Ok, so now we're getting to the actual issue.

    Accounts of people saying they had bad experiences in groups, where everyone was taking shields / gems / FBSS by rolling need, so they themselves found themselves forced to use Need on items to make money.

    That's something entirely different from what was said before, the idea that Need before Greed doesn't exist in EQ, or even ever existed, which is flat out wrong.

    So the problem is that a small number of people started to roll Need on everything and now others feel they have to do this too.
  10. Gemini Syringes Augur

    How long as has Phinny been up? I've leveled 4 different characters up and literally had not a single loot issue, ever. 100% default NBG loot settings. It's quite simple to see in rolls who needed and who greeded. If someone need a greed item, you call them out in chat and it's over or you kick them. Where are you people even from? Those of you with loot drama--loot in the mirror.
  11. Rauven Augur


    This discussion comes up everytime a server comes up. What happens is you get some touchy feely players who think everyone should adhere to some sort of contrived community standard. The reality of the fact is each group is different.

    Most times, groups will simply greed on everything, and need stuff they need for their class/role. That honestly happens. But occasionally a group forms with an intention of giving someone a piece of loot that might break that mold. These players I ID'd in the first paragraph see that either because it was explained to them or just see it as it happens and throw a fit.

    Or worse.. it happens because something was misunderstood and some random mage in the group needs on a turn in belt when everyone else thought it was greed. So he gets one CB belt and instead of having the GL inform him to switch to greed or everyone just clicks need from then on.. they make a forum post about it.

    The whole damn issue can be resolved in game with some simple stuff:

    1. Ask the group leader what the loot rules are.
    2. Switch groups if you don't like the loot rules.
    3. If no groups have loot rules you like, start your own.

    But that requires effort and personal responsibility. Its much easier and fits nicer in their little visions of the world if they just make a forum post and hope everyone 'sees the error of their ways' and conforms. It doesn't work that way though. It is a MMO, and you do need to communicate with the people you are grouping with. And god forbid.. you do have to compromise once in a while.

    But like I said before: The loot rules are whatever the group leader decides.

    That's just how it is. There's no other loot system. There's no consensus. There's no 'gentlemans agreement'. There's no precedence from 1999. There's only what the group leader decides. Someone takes charge and the others follow. That's how it works. That's how its going to be.
    Eaglestiker likes this.
  12. Strawberry Augur

    You're going to have to take others in the group into account at some point. This idea of loot whoring everything by setting everything to need without taking other group members into account, is not going to work well if you plan to remain on a server for a long time.

    It's far more beneficial to build up a group of friends and to help each other get the gear you need, than it is to just think about yourself. That upgrade you give to another player in group, is the basis for a friendship, and you yourself benefit from having good geared players as friends.
  13. Galleyan Augur


    There isn't much that I agree with Strawberry on... but this one I can get behind.
  14. Tevez Augur

    Interesting thread, I've always played need before greed in groups and everyone seemed to follow that rule without being told on TLPs unless it is a guild group and we're getting someone an item.

    However, starting on Agnarr I plan to begin informing anyone who's joining the group what the loot rules are so there's no confusion and if they arn't happy with it they dont need to join. I will also asks groups before I join them what the loot rules are in case im not a fan of them.

    I dont think there's any right or wrong with need before greed or everyone needing on everything provided people are told before they group to prevent drama.

    Just my two cents.
    Jarith likes this.
  15. Kahna Augur


    I have been on Phinny from the start, and have had zero problems with having everything on need. It's how my guild runs, just need all the money drops, and need on cash loot drops. So it's my default in pugs too. Never been booted for it, had a few people whine but I told them I was too lazy to change it all over to greed for a random pug then change it all back later for raids. They just switched to needing too. There was literally zero drama.

    Everyone needs plat, so everyone needs everything dropable that can be sold for plat. Easypeasy lemon squeezy. The wizard needs money for spells and gear just as much as the monk needs haste. Considering that even for gear dependant classes gear upgrades are minor it really is just easier to need everything. I won't necessarily leave a group that enforces need before greed, but I will roll my eyes and complain in guild chat about newbs who expect me to sit here and heal them with no chance at getting something nice myself. Is it frustrating when the melee gets that healer item, maybe a little, but they can make just as much use of it as I can. End of story.
  16. daffie999 Augur

    NBG is outdated and should really only be used among friends. It started in classic because there was a very minimal marketplace. Item values were also not known at the time like they are now.

    With that said, you clarify loot rules each time someone new enters a group.
  17. Amoeba Augur

    All groups I am in have to be NBG. Pick up or otherwise. Usually I play a tank, so i can many times force the issue. And NEED is only for the toon currently in group... no 'need for my alt'.

    But once need is fulfilled, then greed away. I rarely ever leave a group right after getting my 'need'. I like to see everyone get what they need and a good stash of stuff to sell or give to their alts etc.

    But if I am a PAL, and a PAL only item drops I been trying to get, and purposely joined group to get, and it is given to a ranger to sell, that sort of stuff is unacceptable.

    Hmm, maybe I should play a healer this go around and be like 'I get my stuff and you get heals. No stuff for me, no heals for you!'. lol
  18. HoodenShuklak Augur

    Interesting take... As others have said then, do you expect a cleric to heal at the FBSS camp until all the melees filled their need? Eventually one would drop, then that melee gets replaced by another melee, and fairly soon the cleric (unless he was exceptionally un-greedy) would end up inviting casters only so that he didn't appear to "greedy" :) and yet he would be at a camp with a bunch of robes just to skirt some "need or greed" politics.

    I'm not trying to RMT this stuff and I don't like lootwhoring, but I'd be damned if I was in a group for 3 hours waiting until everyone got their "needs" filled and yet, here we go we just invited some more "needy" folks and they're moving right to the front of the line!

    (Gosh this is really starting to sound like capitalism vs socialism... lol)
  19. oldkracow 9999 Is the Krono Account Limit

    Easy solution, ask before you join if you don't like it get the next group.

    I always choose greed groups. No reason for the warrior in my group to pass on an SMR he can sell to get an FBSS and vice versa.

    If you are in high demand as a class it's easy to turn down folks who want you in a group but don't want to compensate your time with a random roll of the dice.
    Jarith likes this.
  20. Amoeba Augur


    Nah, generally group remembers where their bread is buttered. Many times, being as I like to play tank, if the healer gets shafted somehow, I volunteer to go help them with an item they need, or allow healers to roll on an item for themselves if the camp is a big camp that doesn't drop anything they need.

    In the end, it is all about being as 'fair' and workable as possible. Nobody goes without in my groups. If I join a FBSS camp late and one drops soon after I join, I have no qualms passing to allow the healer a win after they been there for 9 hours or what not.

    Basically this is what I avoid: I farm 9 hours for item X I need. wizard comes in, and item drops on his first kill, he wins roll to sell it and immediately leaves group.

    Damn, I might have to either be a tank or healer to keep people in line...