If possible I would like to get a list started for monks for a dev to quickly skim through of our problems. Please other classes do not post here saying monks do not need assistance because we really do, if you would like assistance in your classes post in your own forums. So monk DPS has stagnated our utilities are barely useful for pulling and almost all of our abilities have been farmed out to others. I have compiled some quotes to keep points needing to be made short and sweet. Edited previous quote to take space down some. These were all taken from the monks bro thread, now to take something from monkley business. Source for these is nedrom. Concerns:-Strikethrough AA: Too many ranks of Strikethrough AA & Tactical Mastery AA, we currently have 11 ranks that are over the cap. The optimal cost path is to buy 6 ranks of 15 of Strikethrough and 3 ranks of 5 for Tactical Mastery. This will provide you with 100% if you have 35% worn strikethrough. The 11 ranks work out to be 69 AA. Can these AA ranks be refunded or changed to something else? -Slippery Attacks AA has been depreciated by the changes to Return Kick AA & Disciple's / Master's Aura Discipline which have turned off ripostes completely. The 5 ranks work out to be 15 AA. Can these AA ranks be refunded or changed to something else? -Six Step / Seven Step / Whorl of Fists line & Synergy Line of Disciplines: the six/seven step/whorl line of discs is a large attack using tiger claw. The synergy line is flying kick instead, with the bonus of a boost to flying kick damage that is a short term buff on the NPC. We keep getting upgrades to the Six/Seven step line of disciplines when noone uses it. This ability may have a higher base damage, but synergy, even outside of a raid, provides much larger DPS for all monks because it boosts all flying kicks, including the stunning kick AA. Synergy line is also boosted greatly by Cleave worn gear mods whereas the Six/Seven step pattern line is not. Since both abilities share the same timer, they both cannot be used. Essentially since inception the Synergy line is the preferred discipline for DPS and is also attainable at lower levels compared to the latter. It would be a great dps bonus for us to have these two abilities to not share the same timer, or to do something completely different with the discipline line to make it worth using. Also, Tiger Claw as a skill has not increased in many years, where, Flying Kick always increases as a skill each time we get a level boost, making it the preferred special attack. -DPS: too low to compete with other classes or to be required in groups or raids -Farming out of Hundred Hand Effects: "Originally Posted by tanecho What used to be a defining monk trait seems to be more and more common as time goes on. This has a dual effect of diluting the benefit/uniqueness to the monks, and also reduces the benefits of ADPS effects to us. Take Kolos' Fury for example. It's certainly a fantastic buff even without considering the hundred hand effect, but when you add it in, it becomes a much larger benefit to non-monks (and non-rogues as well, since they too have an innate proc hundred hands 15 at this point.) This adds insult to injury on our current DPS situation, especially during burns. It was one thing when berserkers had warcry, but now you have quick time, kolos, and probably other things that I do not know about." -H2H Weapon Drop Rates: many monks find that drop rates for our weapons at both the group and raid level are extremely low. Could this be looked into? Compared to for example, Rogue Only Daggers, which from our recording every expansion appears to drop more frequently than H2H which is actually used by two classes. And one last I would like to add is crane stance and astral projection are on the same timer. Not a huge deal but would like them moved to different timers because its a pain sometimes. Anything constructive please add, and hope none of these people quoted mind me using thier quotes to try and help devs get a picture of how badly were hurting.
I do not take offense, and this is a fairly complete list of all of our woes. Being a monk has been really rough since RoF launch. It wasn't great last expansion, but it wasn't dire either, and I realized many classes had it worse than we did. I really wish we had some form of reassurance that things will get better in the not so distant future.
Not trying to diminish what you are trying to do for monks, but one of your concerns listed here, about Slippery Attacks being made useless and pointless thanks to the Return Kick AA, is actually a valid concern for every dual wield capable melee class. Every melee class, not just Monk, has an AA that completely stops Ripostes, rendering Slippery Attacks a silly thing to have. Its not *just* a Monk issue, in other words.
I used to play with Sojuu for a long time. This person is truthful, very knowledgeable about EQ and only concerned with proper monk balance. Piestro, Elidroth, or Aristo If you are reading this thread, monks can use a boost as the original poster states
This is absolutely true, but that's more of an afterthought than an issue. I've been hearing from monks all over the place as far as server/player type (raider vs grouper, hardcore vs casual) over the last few weeks and none are happy and most are considering/actively working on a reroll if they haven't already jumped ship. This specific issue is something of a 'Hey maybe next time we should have an iceberg radar' while standing on the deck of the sinking titanic, if you'll excuse the over dramatization .
I have been reading these posts about issues I want to maybe give a refined look at your class from a non monk position; 1) Since you are a DPS class why dont you mold your character to represent a dps class. - Use Heroic Str augs only one aug on magelo has actually set up a DPS setup. - Look for upgrades on the raid or group gear with highest heroic str looking at magelo what you have purchased. 2) Re-Evaluate your roll; every monk I have talked to in my time playing everquest has given me the response that we need survivability in order to do our rolls. As it stands in current raid content you do not need extra AC/Defensives. I Have been beaten on parses on short duration burns 40-60 seconds occasionally by monks as a rogue. No im not a Rogue my own dps isnt the issue. I strive to always be my best. I would love to see raw parse data and if as a class you guys had done everything you could do to improve your own dps Then ask for improvements in drastic nature. ex * Weapons; Augs, AA's. DoN Progression, Proper DPS Personal Tribute, Proper DPS Trophy Tribute (Trophy of the Tree & Trophy of the house) ** proper ADPS support in your group; Shaman, Beserker, Beastlord, Bard ** Vaxt
Heroic strength is insignificant. 350 hstr would add 35 damage to the end of each hit which might be at most a flat 300 dps increase. Can't be modded, etc. The attack power gain from the extra strength is also negligible. There are much much much better heroic stats to boost that also happen to come on better augs. I don't have much else to say since this is out of my area of knowledge. I do agree that monks do need a boost.
I have personally seen monks hit the 110-120 thousand damage range on burns Gladare any more dps and you would be beating rogues. When my top burns are in the 130-140 thousand range what more do you want. ** Monks have the fastest hits in the game ** You would get more of a benifit from having more heroic str then any other class. 10 hits per second is your average.
Yea I was trying to ignore his post in hopes it wouldnt start a debate and fill this thread with meaningless content. Would like the thread to stay on track of things to improve the monk class not of things that people spew out that they have no clue what they are talking about. That way we can focus on catching back up to where we need to be if the devs happen to read this thread, and hopefully take the information into account.
There's still new zones coming...I reckon we will see new weapons too, very soon (tm). Just saying, it might bring nice things like upgraded HtH weapons with higher ratios..
While not wrong, it is painfully misleading. The higher heroic strength count of any monk in the game is around 380 I believe. That is the equivalent of +38 to each attack. During burns, my average hit personally is around 3700, and decreases after the burn ends. So during a burn, as much heroic strength as anyone could possibly muster adds at most 1% damage. Non-burn, maybe 2. And that's against a case of 0 heroic strength, without trying a raiding monk will have over 250 these days. A 5% weapon upgrade for us isn't going to erase how far behind we are, especially when everyone gets that 5%. A paradigm shift is necessary at this point if we are to catch up and become more meaningful in terms of damage. If we are where we are intended to be, I would really like confirmation of that so I can reroll to another class. I do not feel the bonuses of the monk class outweigh the discrepancies in damage at this point in the game's life, and it would increase my enjoyment to be something else if this is the way we are intended to be balanced.
raid leaders don't put monks into dps groups because other classes dps better. far better. and have adps and/or buffs for the raid. it's not a hard choice to make. zerker or monk? rog or monk? bl or monk? ranger or monk? it's not a hard choice. what really kinks my tail is every dps knows this and acts like it's something monks are conjuring from the nether.
Let's break this down: Due to recent parses and the fact that HStr kinda sucks, HDex is better for both the DPS and the survivability end of things. HDex raises our normal dex, which adds to our crit chance. Monks have an abysmal crit chance and any addition to it helps us significantly more than one damage per hit. Have you spoken to a monk since like... SoF? Seriously, what? When? Our DPS barely went up from VoA. Yours went up significantly. You were beating us in VoA and the margin has widened. www.monkly-business.net + monkly serverwide channel. Go there and read anything in the last two months. There are all kinds of parses in both locations that show where we stand. Do monks in your guild beat rangers/beastlords on parses? Do they get DPS group spots over ranger/bst/rog/zerk? You have plenty of opinion yet no actual facts that we're stronger than we say we are.
Just wanted to weigh in on this. I have played a monk for the last 12 years as my main. I have never seen the monk class in as bad as shape as it is now. Most of our pulling abilities are now available to many other classes. Our DPS is third rate and needs to be addressed. Lately I have been asked to play my shaman in raids since my monks DPS is as great as other classes. Developers please review our class and let us know if you agree or disagree.
same here been playing a monk 8+ years as a main and have the most fun with the class. But in the past few years its becoming less and less fun watching us stagnate in dps/be passed by classes that shouldnt, have our defining abilities farmed out to others, and this expansion really was the breaking point for me. We need boosts, weve been left too far behind and for too long always hoping its going to get better.
I've heard the exact same thing as the two above me from more people than I care to count. The discussion on weather to roll a necro, mage or rogue started DURING the monk/rogue IRC AA chat and from my count the majority started necro and is now leaning mage. This is neither exaggeration nor dramatization, there are logs of the monk side-IRC channel floating around somewhere.
