Monk Improvement Thread 2023-2024

Discussion in 'Melee' started by Lisard, Jan 23, 2023.

  1. Buds Augur

    I like how you say Monks plural lol. I don't think I have seen a monk in years, honestly. I don't ever see any monk gear for sale on FV either. That class used to be awesome. It's just a ridiculous amount of key presses now, for so so dps. Seriously need a big upgrade.
    Lisard likes this.
  2. Snazster Elder

    I’d settle for pulling being a core requirement for raiding again but that’s unlikely.

    Failing that, I will point out the riposte nerf several years back was a double or triple nerf on monks.

    Monks depend on riposte for defense. A big chunk of that is gone when they can no longer riposte ripostes.

    Monks make a LOT of physical attacks at short range, giving mobs many more chances to riposte on monks, ripostes that the monks can no longer riposte.

    Also, not being able to riposte as many attacks as they used to be able to riposte had an adverse effect on dps. The fact that mobs cannot riposte ripostes does not nearly make up for this.

    So that one nerf, that most classes never even noticed, caused us to be subjected to more attacks, to avoid a smaller percentage of those attacks, and to inflict less dps, relative to our raid contributions before that.
  3. Szilent Augur

    no defense was lost in the nerf to Riposte, it was a nerf to dps only, and effected raids not at all
  4. DaciksBB Augur

    you still use the plural form of something that there is 0 of, like 0 monks

    considering the fact that it is suicide for melee to attack mobs from the front, which is where the only place that they can be riposted, what would this fix? plus stuff has so much strikethrough these days that you'd probably get a strikethrough on the mob's attack that you riposted
  5. Xianzu_Monk_Tunare Augur

    If people thing Monks are a ridiculous amount of key presses, then they don't have things set up right.

    You cannot honestly say that no defense was lost, because riposting a riposte is a defense. It might have been minimal, but it was definitely non-zero. Otherwise I agree.
  6. Kaliko Augur

    Not really considering a lot of our discis are extremely long reuse. Zerkers were more, idk about current stage and rogues are least. Hybrids have a ton too.
  7. Sokon Augur

    Main things I'd like to see addressed sometime:

    Crane(heron) stance and five point palm damage is low for reuse time. These should be down to 1 minute reuse or have damage 10x+ of current.

    Throwing damage/AA: 29 expansions and never anything for throwing other than distant strike. Considering we have 4 precision strikes(and wasp if you ever use that line over synergy); a class AA for throwing damage or Twin throw or something could be useful for us. I don't like the idea of combining the line as all that stuff can fire off one mash bar. More precision strikes every 2 expansions? Awesome.

    Other class large damage abilities for undercon mobs: decap, headshot, massive strike or whatever the rogues one is called... We don't really have one. Possible fix? Make both of our strike and flying kick resonant AA be able to trigger the Technique of Master Wu line or another AA similar to Master Wu but for resonant procs. Meaning if you get a resonant proc it would proc a number of resonant strikes/kicks therafter. Perhaps 1-3 of them or so to start with more ranks in future expansions.

    Tiger Claw, Eagle Strike, etc strikes rework on damage. Flying kick suffers from this as well on the regular kicks but if you look at the damage of the regular strike hits vs their crits the difference is nowhere near a 2 hand hit/crit ratio. This is due to all the + damage to minimum hits which does not get multiplied by the crit %. Perhaps it should be.

    When I 2hb regular hit for 20 k damage but can lucky crit for over 80 k damage? That's 4x from lowest to highest. With regular strikes(not resonant) however the range is only from like 13 k to 20 k on a regular hit to a lucky crit. Sometimes lucky crits can also only be 13-14k damage. Strikes are nowhere near a 4x range because a majority of the damage CANNOT CRIT. Which has made us suck more over time.

    Also Brithrax % increase probably doesn't multiply the +damage either. Then you have two finger wasp and intimidation, mob taking more damage but does it multiply the + damage? I'm unsure of this one but either way... Strike lucky crits should do way more damage(like every other lucky crit in the game)!

    Fix? Perhaps change the plus to minimum damage lines for kicks, strikes and melee lines to completely rework the line to be + to base damage so it can be multiplied by crits. Or plus % to total damage. Kick Mastery/*Punch Mastery*

    I think this expansion was the first time we got 0 new ranks of anything in the archetype(tab between general and class). i thought that was pretty odd.

    New ranks of good stuff is nice however when you start adding a few percent on top of 150% multiple already it starts being less and less increase. We know we are going to get additional ranks of stuff already there so I'd like to see us advocate on getting entirely new AA lines. We do have one of the lowest AA counts in the game, good point to argue for entirely new lines and increase our total AA count(for example several lines for throwing, resonant kicks/strikes triggering/chaining Wu)
  8. Sokon Augur

    Not sure if this was quoted from elsewhere but this is not an issue and wouldn't be for another 7-9 expansions or so(assuming new precision strikes are the only added new mash keys)
    Remember they give a buff, so we would always need to have atleast 2 of them so the throwing damage is ever receiving that buff unless we got a significant timer reduction.

    One hotbar has 12 slots. yes...

    quick math:
    Says 13.
    12+4(5?) = 16.
    Kick and strikes can be on auto: -2 = 11
    One social hotkey can include doabilities(intimidation and disarm if you use that) with 2 other line items as well, quote doesn't include disarm: -3 = 8
    Should be 4-5 spaces available on your mash hotbar still
    The proper setup is a social with 4 items, then another hotbar loaded with the rest.
    If one key is set to activate the social on a main hotbar and every space on the mash bar is set to be activated by the same key that gives us 16.
    Not on game right now and forget if socials are 4 or 5 line items, anyways usage ability to activate monk mash is currently only at 11/16, 12/16 if you include disarm.

    in my mash I currently have the above 11 items listed + disarm + staff of viral flux. One instant clicky additionally will also fire off the mash bar setup as described above. Viral flux is nice, minor debuff 300 range instant reuse/cast pulling tool and sometimes when I am just moloing i will swap it with epic 1.0, you know, when I have no buffs and need that 12 ac! lolol
  9. Lisard Augur

    This is more in regards to narrative of button consolidation that they were aiming for a few years back when they consolidated all our utility then immediately started replacing it with button's such as the precision line. its true you can have endless buttons key bound but really shouldnt have more then a hotbar of buttons that need to be constantly on cooldown when it comes to a smash bar when it can be neatly consolidated especially on the precision line where we have no support for throwing in terms of Focus or AA. 1 precision is all you need (30 second reuse + 36s Throwing buff) as its pretty much 100% uptime after the intitial press. we dont need 2, 3, 4, 5, 10 precision strikes. just scale it appropriately.
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  10. Lisard Augur

    would love to see a healthy increase in the Damage % on 'Improved Crane Stance' AA currently at 120 its only 27%, seeing it jump to 75% and just leaving its reuse alone would prob make a impact.

    FPP i would love to see drop down to a 1 minute reuse ability since its dmg is so tiny in comparison its like 100k low end and only 1.3m dmg on a the high end depending on the target and its primarily our "aggro" tool in most occasions outside of raid burns.
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  11. DaciksBB Augur

    ensuring that Crane is used under discs would be even more important, that would be a good change
    Lisard likes this.
  12. Sokon Augur

    it's the number of hits expiring it; using one handers, using heel or speedfocus ae melee/multiple mobs.
    During parses, which is the dps we really look at or compete against others on with heel and speed being our 2 best and possibly a majority of the entire event
    they could simply remove the hits number aspect which also makes it expire if some kind of consolidation was done.
    Pehaps a moot point if you are mashing everything at once essentially is the same thing as all 4 buffs are replacing one another, i slightly offset one on raids and then usually when I am groupng for hours on end clearing named etc the abilities over time are spread out a bit by a few seconds and sustaining always having the buff.
    Would have to check on a combat dummy but i'm pretty sure we exceed the number of hits frequently enough
  13. Sokon Augur

    Any opinion on +damage being a problem for critical/regular hits ratios and us deserving entirely new AA lines as we are one of(or are) the lowest total AA count class now?

    I've particapated in many of these over the years, first when they were on monkly business and after that. Every year there was always the attitude of not to ask for x because it would effect our dps AAs, so many ideas weren't included and mentioned to the devs.

    Here we are 23 years into that and are one of the lowest AA counts because of it. Even the sole agenda of always only asking for dps increases didn't pan out either.

    Every idea that is "monkly" shoulda been on a list and now we got stuff like Shuriken of the Tranquil is still the best throwing item in the game for us lol. Not that anyone would have ever farmed for use but it's kind of funny
    Lisard likes this.