Machine Wars 2019 (Mangler)

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Malj1nn, Apr 28, 2019.

  1. BlueberryWerewolf Augur

    The idea that we need to have botters permacamping spawns in order for there to be a market for Krono is patently absurd. That market would exist if all the botters were banned and it was only legitimate boxers doing the farming. There is no conspiracy incentive to allow botting to continue. The simplest solution is that it is legitimately one of limited resources available to police the problem.
  2. Elemenopi Augur


    The analogy doesnt fit, as the police cannot simply assume away any danger, and must investigate all reports of "gunpoint" situations. No ones life is in danger due to being outDPSed by Tron in EverQuest. :p

    All this blaming the community tells me is folks dont understand how to be efficient when investigating this kind of stuff. Its not brain science or rocket surgery.

    In other news, the company can keep a database of investigations in their CRM (I know which CRM they use as I worked for a different division of the same company that created the game, and the entire company uses the same CRM). Theres no need to investigate the same boxer for every petition. When 30 petitions come in for the same boxer on the same day, who was already investigated 6 hours ago and found to be legit, they can ignore 29 of those petitions.

    Its highly unlikely that in 6 hours the same boxer went from being at their keyboards on different PCs (1/character) to running automation software on one PC to control all characters. If they did, even investigating 1/week is fine. The fact that the same ones are operating after 6 weeks is whats being called into question here. This will only get worse (and even more blatantly obvious) once Kunark goes live on Mangler and seb is bot camped for the next 6 months.
    andross77 likes this.
  3. Atabishii Elder


    You would be absolutely terrible in a debate. Stick to your day job.
  4. Accipiter Augur


    Says the guy who used two paragraphs to say "The Boy Who Called Wolf".
  5. trevock Augur


    His point was sound. What are you even talking about?
  6. Elemenopi Augur


    And I still would defeat you due to you having no answer for what I just posted.
    The minute the personal remarks start replacing on topic points, the concession is accepted.

    Was anyone really assuming every single report against the same box crew needed to be individually investigated on its own in the first place? - to the point where this flood of reports was bottle necking the entire process? Thats whats causing the real bots to get away with it?

    Or do we just understand humans already know how to be more efficient than that? (per my previous post)
    oldkracow likes this.
  7. yerm Augur

    There are 3 options:

    1. The gms investigate all reports. This results in a massive backlogged waste of time due to tons of false reports for legit box situations.

    2. The gms stop investigating once someone is found a dud. This would mean someone who proves legit when investigated is now clesr to turn on automation and gms will think they already looked at him.

    3. Gms arbitrarily decide whether to investigate or not, sometimes ignoring tickets or going with 2 above and sometimes stopping back for a 2nd look. This seems to be the case at daybreak.


    For ANY customer service effort, at any company, anywhere, the best thing you can do to help get a desired result is to assist the CSR type with whatever is helpful. In everquest this means providing good information, not embellishing or especially going on a tirade, videos if possible, etc. It also means not spamming them with junk tickets that someone has to at least mark and close out if nothing else.

    Whether you like it, or like the guy arguing it, he's right: crying wolf DOES hurt the legitimate petitions. The lack of enforcement except with exceedingly accurate proof like IS the result of too much false reporting in the past; the gms are clearly a lot more worried about mistaken box banning than they are over mistaken train banning. Unless you buy into the bs conspiracies, the likely answer is that automation is harder to detect or easier to false id.
  8. Elemenopi Augur


    I agree with everything but your last paragraph. You can close as many tickets as you want in their CRM in 3 clicks. If you took 10 seconds to do this, you likely took a drink or two between clicks.

    Once someone is found to be legit or not the rest can be closed for the time being. This does not mean never investigating them ever again. It just shows the premise of the community being at fault for "over reporting" is largely by degree, over exaggerated (hyperbolic even), and therefore is not a sound premise.

    I could get 100 tickets a day on the same player/bot and investigate that same entity twice a month, and close all other tickets down on the same entity in less time than it takes to face-palm after reading these posts about how the community is somehow at fault for reporting rules violations. I could even include a text in each ticket thanking the customer for reporting the issue, letting them know it is being investigated, and still be under 10 seconds for the entire operation. Ahhh the magic of CRM software. But its not magic, just mid 1980's era word processing with a slightly more modern UI. :p
  9. Valyn New Member

    We could also go extra conspiracy theory and state that all botters are actually created by DBG who is trying to recoup all the Krono so they don't have to continue carrying the liability that a product like a Krono creates and the havoc it could reap on paid subs. Hence the reason they are so loathe to crack down on the obvious.
  10. code-zero Augur

    You've never done 30 seconds worth of customer service work in your entire life, have you?
  11. BlueberryWerewolf Augur


    Krono isn't a liability in this sense, though. The revenue is already received and the service provided once redeemed is intangible.
  12. Elemenopi Augur


    Ive managed multiple departments, as well as directed the managers of multiple departments.

    Not sure what that has to do with this issue though, but I will say this: The minute you guys quote me and make personal remarks instead of posting anything that addresses/refutes what I stated, you might as well have typed out a concession to the argument.
  13. Elemenopi Augur


    Right, but people getting rid of it before it is cashed in for its playtime would be the conspiracy. The theory would be that people would then pay to play...

    I vote aliens

    and donuts.
  14. Killer Rabbits New Member

    False. It is a liability. If daybreak records 100% of every krono sale as revenue, they are cooking the **** out of their books for their investors and creditors.

    Who would want to loan them money or buy their company if they owe months upon months of services that have already been recorded as received?
  15. BlueberryWerewolf Augur


    They don't actually owe the service.

    If they shut down servers tomorrow, the revenue from Krono is not guaranteed to be refunded.
  16. yerm Augur

    You allowed your cs depts to close out tickets in under 10 seconds? Based on some kind of arbitrary judgment of same character = duplicate?

    No way in hell. At MINIMUM the representative would need to put in a notation of which ticket is being favored instead, or cite the prior work, or forward it up (to someone like you) with the authority to close without any review. In reality they probably need at least a few minutes to CYA each ticket closure with a related investigation copied in.

    Like, being serious, your claim was so fundamentally absurd that I have to echo the "personal attack" of have you ever even done CS work. I don't believe whatever supervising you did came close to hands on tickets in any fashion - or you're exaggerating to an extreme.

    I may make fun of DBG but even I won't accuse their CS folks of the kind of ridiculously lax and arbitrary process you describe.
    code-zero likes this.
  17. Elemenopi Augur

    Especially in cases when something has already been determined.
    AKA - read the post first, then address it.

    Its called merging. Makes data aggregation much easier, sometimes by orders of magnitude.

    Common CRM knowledge - function does not even require scripting knowledge like some back end functions do.


    No, you said it due to having zero answer for the logic I laid down. In typical fashion you quoted the post and addressed nothing in it.

    The theory crafting that all petitions need to be combed through from head to toe and this is what is log jamming their ability to do anything about bot farmers has no basis in reality, and was likely posited by someone, and believed by others, who actually do fit the description you posted, of never having done any CS. If you had, youd know that my description of what can be (and is) done with a CRM is pretty common knowledge to anyone who had. It is also common knowledge that even in such cases where an initial response is warranted, most if not all investigations do not receive further response alerting the petitioner of what action is taken or if their data held up or not.
  18. cnmega New Member

    I heard 18 bots got banned today on HG hill. Maybe Paul next
  19. Elemenopi Augur

    Human decisions are removed from strategic cash camping. While the human sleeps, it begins to monopolize camps at a geometric rate. It becomes self-aware at 3:00 PM, Eastern time, March 16. In a panic, single character players try to pull the plug...
  20. Risiko Augur

    You realize this means that we are all going to get trained repeatedly this weekend while the banned botters power level up their next crew of botters during the bonus experience.

    Unrest and LowerGuk are going to be full of people screaming about the power levelers pulling the whole zone to level the next set of bots, and by Monday, there will be a new set of bots in Rathe Mountains.

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