Longer expansion times

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Killians, May 21, 2020.

  1. Iyacc Augur

    It depends what kind of player you are. If you are a destination type player then 2 to 3 months is plenty to level up, get some gear, do all the raids more times than you really want and be ready for the next expac.

    If you're the enjoy the trip type player then sure you would enjoy having twice as long because you want to go hang out in various zones and do stuff just because, not level up and get into the multi group stuff. These types of players feel like they get left behind because the first set of players is mostly going to hunt where they can get the most out of their time online even if it's 40hours a week and not 2 or 3 hours a week.

    The 2 to 3 hours a week hitchhiker players will take a ride from anyone and don't care where they are going or how long it takes to get there. These are the players that may not even log in this month and might be level 25 for 6 weeks while they try and do their own quest armor instead of just camping something better or trading for it. They may have 4 characters that don't have enough xp combined to make level 50 in one before Kunark drops.

    There's lots of different playstyles and everyone thinks theirs is the correct way. Whether we agree with the bean counters research, someone gets to decide how each new TLP is going to work and most likely it's someone who has an eye on the profit column. It's not someone who cares which group gets their way or even what the way is. Hell, they may not even actually play EQ or know the difference BUT they do think that it's going to give them the best chance at making money and staying in business. Trust me when I say that if they ever decide they can make more money without new TLPs, you people will have to find a new game or stay on a server somewhere instead of jumping ship every year or so to the new location.
    Killians likes this.
  2. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    The silent majority?

    You mean the 300,000 who no longer play EQ right? How do you plan to bring them back to the game so that they can join you on this slow server?
  3. Killians Journeyman

    I honestly fully agree with you on this. Myself, I'm one that falls inbetween of those. Then again, I like to enjoy the game as far a camping and making new alts and going full content for the time it specifies. I get back camping and such, but if you have a bit more time in era, it's less you have to do. I don't know, that's why i like the discussion more than anything, and again, just putting how i feel about it. Even 1 extra month on the expansions. Thank you though for a great comment man!
  4. TheChosenOne Augur

    we should have 1 year between expansions, just like it was starting in 1999!
    Killians likes this.
  5. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    You already can, it is called playing on a live server.

    If DPG opened a TLP with 12 month unlocks it would be dead on arrival.
    Gremin likes this.
  6. Lejaun Augur

    No it wouldn't. There would be a ton of complaining on the forums, but the server would still be packed for the first two months.
  7. Protagonist Tank


    Packed with the nostalgiabaiters who were convinced THIS was the server where they'd finally do it right, finally actually get that "old time feeling" of EQ again, finally not get distracted by 5 different alts - none of which ever make it past level 30, finally not blame kronos or boxers or bots or rude players or any of a thousand other tiny frustrations that all add up to the realization that you can never go home again and trying to hang your joy on a memory is a stupid hobby to start with. Yes sir, that one year expansion rate will be the server where you're finally one of the best.

    In short - packed with the same people every TLP is always packed with for one, maybe two subscription cycles before they fall away again, because they don't actually want to play EQ. They just want to remember playing EQ.
  8. Gremin Augur

    For me its more about hanging with old friends and making nes ones along the way. Even with 6 month lockouts on Lockjaw, I can tell you a great number of my friendx in DHS ragefird had a blast and ard still having a blast there under Gesiah's leadership.
  9. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    If it was the only TLP launched in 2021 it would have some on it just because they don't want to play on Aradune/Rizlona beyond PoP, then it would die once 2022's TLP opens.

    All the complaining would be the casuals & seasonals moaning about how their guilds have callously & selfishly abandoned them after they took a tiny break of "only" a few months (6-9) and that now the new TLP has opened it is stealing everyone away right as they are about to get into Kunark, and how their nostalgia trip has been ruined by those didn't wait for them to come back.
  10. Balderdash Lorekeeper

    Ragefire has the 2nd highest TLP population after 5 years. After 5 years!! Ragefire also had the longest unlocks of any TLP ever launched and it is still progressing without the benefit of AOCs, easier keying and more loot drops. Ragefire had to compete with at least 6 other TLP’s opening up during its run and it has outlasted them all except Mangler which is only 1 year old.

    The fastest unlock servers, Combine/Vulak and Selos were both dead by GoD aside for 1 or 2 niche guilds and they were both dead after a year. Phinny for the most part was done when the expansions dropped from 3 months to 2 months. Had it not been for dramatic changes to raid keying and raid drops and automatic unlocks Phinny wouldn’t have kept even the population that they did.

    Longer unlocks lead to server longevity. People can take breaks for work, for vacations for life and still be able to come back and not be too far behind. People can take time to work on tradeskills without being the “guild designate” who gets all the tradeskills drops. People can raid 3 nights a week and keep up without having to be 5 night a week raiders. A server can’t move at the speed of the fastest players or the slower players but the success of Ragefire despite all odds is proof that the sweet spot is about 4 months per expansion without altering in anyway the overall gameplay and design.
  11. Balderdash Lorekeeper

    If all you want is faster unlocks, why aren’t you playing on Selos? That is clearly a server that was designed for you.
  12. Balderdash Lorekeeper

    On a 3 month unlock in an expansion like SoF for guilds that don’t raid 5 nights a week it will take 1 month to level up and get flagged for Meldreth ( no split raiding, no raiding on lockout schedule) it will then take a month to get flagged for crystalos and then 1 month to farm Crystalos (4 trips through). After 2 months of raiding MMM and 1 month of Crystallos the average guild member in that guild would only have about 5 or 6 item slots filled before SoD launched. 3 months isn’t enough time to keep a healthy server population. 4 months puts those same raiders with 11 or 12 slots on average filled with SoF raid gear which is enough to take on SoD and eventually Underfoot.
  13. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Wrong conclusion, I can see why you came to it but you are still wrong.

    Ragefire lasted as long as it has for 2 very important reasons.

    1. It does not have Truebox:
    When you have no Truebox you can far more easily be truly self-sufficient & help others far more easily as a boxer, this is a key & fundamental part of why Live servers even still exist today. You don't need multiple PC;'s to box & support yourself.

    2. There were no other non-Truebox TLP, (until Rizlona opens).
    Ragefire was the only box-friendly TLP server, that exclusivity is a key part of its longevity, there was nowhere else for 1xPC boxers to go besides Live servers.

    Those reasons are why I think Aradune will start out as the bigger server population, but Rizlona will far outlast it, and it is why Ragefire survived so long despite losing well over half of its players to Phinigel & why it has fared better than Phinigel over the same span of real-time. But it is important to note that while Ragefire is still in Seeds of Destruction Phinigel is far beyond that, how many guilds will Ragefire have in TDS?
    This is a better & more appropriate question to make comparisons based on.

    Longer unlock schedules may have played a small part in Ragefire's longevity for a few players but the other points above were far more important.
  14. Zinth Augur

    those two servers only died because they launched PHINNY which had AoC's... had they give AoC's to RF/LJ those would have been alive today as well
  15. Balderdash Lorekeeper

    Why do people keep saying that Ragefire/Lockjaw died? They never died and in fact still have a very vibrant population with 6 full raiding guilds. They have a higher population after 5 years than any other TLP server. It has been a tremendous environment to play and interact with other people. The 4 month unlocks have been almost ideal for completing quests’, tradeskills and raiding at a responsible level. Many may have preferred shorter periods for some of the expansions such as PoR and TBS but for me and some others those expansions enabled us to catch up on some of the things we fell behind on. Hell, we were doing pickup Anquish raids to gear for alts and some mains as well as orbs for those that still needed epics all the way through TBS.
    How you look at unlocks is based on how you like to play and the like minded individuals that are available to play the way you like. If you are on a server that has 80 hour a week players that just want to beat an expansion and move on to the next and you just want to play 20 hours a week and raid once or twice a week then you are likely on the wrong server. I have been fortunate that on my long 4+ year run on Fippy server which with the time to beat the expansion plus the voting period lead to basically 4 months per expansion and the same the last 5 years on Ragefire that there have been more than enough like minded individuals that i have been able to enjoy the game to the fullest. Unless Rizlona server poaches a bunch from Ragefire I am certain that I will be playing and raiding with many others on Ragefire by this time again next year.

    I personally would never play on a server seriously that had 2 or 3 month unlocks. It’s not enough time per expansion to accomplish the things I want to do.
  16. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    It's an assumption, much like the assumption that all TLP die after PoP, and new assumptions get made constantly.

    People are not usually sceptical enough and often don't engage topics while applying critical thinking skills, I think everyone has the ability to do so they just don't feel the need to apply them often.

    I try to avoid making assumptions myself, but it is disturbingly easy to fall victim to them, nobody is immune as we are all somewhat conditioned to accepting the things other people say as being truthful or well thought though.
    Being sceptical requires a considerable amount of vigilance against oneself making assumptions & taking other people's assumptions at face value, that's a level of vigilance most people don't care for unless they are personally very aware of the disconnect between the facts & what gets assumed.

    Back on topic though.
    Server rulesets will gain an audience, you can't really make any fair comparisons between servers that hold very different rules because they will attract & hold very different audiences.

    Let's take your Ragefire vs Phingel comparison, you made that based on how long the servers were running for in real time, you didn't compare how many guilds were active during each expansion, also you got 2 guilds from Lockjaw in the recent merge so up until that you only had 4 guilds.

    A more accurate representation of server health is how many guilds were active in each expansion. Sadly EverQuest doesn't bother tracking Guild Raid Progress and any raid progression is tracked by player-made websites, which are never reliable.
  17. TheChosenOne Augur

    2 year unlocks then!
  18. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    [IMG]
  19. Febb Augur

    6 months is way too long to spend in an expansion. 4 months is the max I would stay subbed for.
  20. Kittany Augur

    I think this thread can be summed up by two types of people. Those who want to 'beat the game' and those who want to 'enjoy the game'.

    Personal opinion of course, the 'beat the game' type of people are simply looking to speedrun the classic expansions. Most don't seem to care about much else because they've done it so many times that they could probably do it blindfolded. So it makes sense that these type of players would want the faster unlocks.

    The 'enjoy the game' people are usually those looking for the classic experience. Those of whom I met are all the more happy to take their time, explore, take the road less traveled etc. Many do join raid guilds, but some do not. These are the players that are the primary lifeblood of the TLP's in the first couple of months but will quickly burn out due to the 'beat the game' type of players continually pushing for new content.

    Which is why I don't quiet understand the TLP crowd nowadays. Ya'll want a new TLP, but also seem to want all the latest content. Isn't that what live is for?
    TheChosenOne, Zinth, Killians and 2 others like this.