Lockjaw Rotation Updated - 8/15/15

I am saying you already have a rule in place that can be used in a similar fashion.

Yes, an issue could arise where someone for whatever reason is locking something down. It is happening everywhere, yet for some reason it is not happening now in Sky. Could it be simply because there is a threat or potential to be banned or suspended? If you are locking down content and are not supposed to, yet no one is getting banned, why is this scenario not playing out, right now?

Logically the argument makes no sense.

Then again if no one is being banned, why are there not disruptions and such already happening. You all keep proposing things that might happen and which could be happening now, yet are not, as to reasons why this would not work.

It is not a waste of time and might actually add some additional fun back into the game.

It's not happening in Sky right now because it's rotated and there would be ramifications for breaking the rotation. If an unguilded person were repeatedly clearing island 2 without permission, I would anticipate that the issue would get escalated to CS and I anticipate they would get suspended for it.
If 1-4 were to become perpetually FFA, someone locking down island 2 wouldn't be violating the rotation at all, so there could be no ramifications. Just like other places being locked down currently.

Again your argument makes no sense. Currently if someone wanted to lock down sky 1-4, they would either be banned or in the rotation. Since I only see guilds in the rotation, I can assume that either people have been banned or there is no one trying to lock down the content.

The rotation rules would change and state something along the lines of sky 1-4 will be open and ffa with a pnp policy enforced by the player base. Since it is actually the threat of suspension and banning that keeps people from breaking the rotation and not the rotation itself, these tools can be adapted to the new policy.

So... FFA, but not really FFA? What would this "pnp" for 1-4 look like?

It would be free for all but we can come up w/ specific rules such as no trash spawn is rotated in any way. Isle bosses could be first to engage, your defending guild does not want to lose their isle one boss to me, get in there and engage it first and kill it. Or maybe we end up working together instead of me being forced by your decree.

As far as someone exploiting, monoplizing etc, I think that is better left to a case by case basis, discuss it, decide if it is proper or not. From there decide on a punishment that is backed by DBG, then approach the offending party, or better yet let DBG do it. If they chose to follow the pnp no disruption, then great, if not, ban or whatever next time they are caught.

This is not difficult, only requires a small amount of additional policing by everyone involved and rightfully opens up this content to everyone.

DBG has said that they will not enforce any "first-to-engage" rules, so that couldn't be used in a way that could be policed.

The rotation guilds have been informed that any violations of the rotation that are escalated to DBG CS will be met with blanket suspensions (which happened last week, even if the suspensions did get removed after 4 hours). So "let DBG do it" is not a viable option except as a last resort.

You need to have some sort of rules in place that say "here's what is permitted, and here is what is not permitted." Rotation makes it easy: you can do Sky on your day, others cannot. If you remove the rotation aspect, then you have to clearly codify what is permitted and what is not.

Again this would be a server enforced code, first to engage pnp of some sort.

The actual line for ban/suspension would not be as cut and dried as your day or not. It would have to be made on a case by case basis which then would determine what is and what will not be enforced/bannable.

This is exactly why I disagree with the proposition. With the rotation being in order from a lot of work, and being enforced by DBG; it is absolutely not right that a guild who untag members, have the ability to block any particular guild from progressing. That guild gets 1 day in maybe 10-14 days to kill it's rotation mob/zone and it wouldn't be hard to completely screw them over when their turn came up. The fact that they are under DBG enforcement to not attempt another guild's rotation day, would be the most unfair aspect of anything ever considered on these servers. At least you have the option to join a guild while this guild would be essentially handcuffed from raiding completely.

How would the community enforce first-to-engage? Especially since I can't imagine that would have DBG support at all, since it already doesn't.

The comment was made and jest, and yes some people could potentially try and block others from content. You have solutions to it already in place, however it is not the rotation that keeps people at bay, it is the punishment itself.

If guild a is continually unguilding its members chasing the ffa and then guilding them, they could be banned or suspended for doing such when caught.

It could be a factor that gets them banned if it could be proven. DGB could say sure we agree but we are not doing the policing. You make the case and prove that they violated the policy, we will ban them. That sort of thing, which is what you have now. If someone goes on your day and it can be proven, they get banned.

There may be more instances of issues to determine what is and what is not going to be enforced by dbg, which will ultimately determine if this will work. We will not know until we try. Hell, they might not support it at all, however I think there is more of a chance if people actually see that it is more fair for everyone and actually ask for something like this.

This is why I think a proposal such as this should be included in a server wide poll as to how this content should be managed, after all it affect everyone.

You're trying to loophole around

Even if you're saying it's a server community standard, DBG will not enforce it.

Zhutuak aka Croak, put it to rest already

There is also no pnp but we have a forced rotation...

Croak and I have talked, he has put his time in trying for an open raid day. I told him I did not think that was good enough and he agreed, that one day was not enough for the rest of the server.

I will not comment on any more of our conversation as I do not want to misrepresent him. I do not think he hated the idea though.

There's still a pnp. See section 1.1 of the Rules of Conduct: https://help.daybreakgames.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/16211/kw/play nice/p/1

The forced rotation was DBG's solution to an overall lack of access.

So we are seeing the same issue rear its head, just on a smaller scale. All I am proposing is an extension and redefining of the rotation to allow more access for more people. It does not take a guild to become qualified, loot key pieces, quest pieces or boss drops, people should not be pigeon holed into that requirement to enjoy content that can be killed by one group.

Everquest Rules of Conduct

As I said before Zhutuak, put it to rest. It is against forum rules for you to continually spam 2 different threads to try and get your point noticed.

And FYI (Four Your Information) aka means (Also Known As) Meaning Zhutuak is Croak, so yes I am sure you spoke to yourself.