Live Server Current Bard Best Uses Question

Context: Live server raiding

Question: What classes benefit most from adding a bard to their raid group? I'd love to see a list in numerical order of bard benefits this class the most to bard benefits this class the least based primarily upon DPS created during an average raid event. I know there are many variables but if such a list has been constructed by someone and you'd be willing to share it and explain the why's I'd love to read and learn more. Thank you.

Clerics! Clerics are not getting any boost of their dps with or without a bard. Do not put a bard in a group with a cleric with a hope to boost cleric's dps.

What classes? The dps classes that are most active. I could list you the classes that are in theoretical order, but if the players don't hit their buttons ... and also if the bard doesn't play/do the right things ... it doesn't matter. Raid makeup also matters ... if you don't have any rangers hitting auspice, the critical bonuses from a bard are probably more valuable to a caster group ... but it depends on how the caster groups are composed.

Any dps class benefits from a bard. You should have one in every dps group.

This is extremely hard to calculate. I think you underestimate just how many variables there truly are.

Realistically, bards probably can roughly be assumed to just help the dps classes the same %, so if you just looked at the dps class order on a good raid guild:s parse (or a few of them and connect the dots) you'd probably get your answer.

Bah 5 clerics and a bard theory is now dead? What madness is this? hahahah

You the list in theoretical order is what I'm looking for. I understand that if a sucky player isn't playing the class well then this is another issue.

I dunno. Was thinking about will a bard help a wizzy as much as it will a hybrid class? What about a wizzy vs a class that uses DoTs and has a pet? Seems like a bard will help some classes more than others. But I haven't done the calculations and since returning I've seen changes to how classes are played so was just looking for some viewpoints i guess.

And yup I understand the whole looking at top guild parses stuff. But I'd also be interested in a more basic view. Or to see what several well played bards in different types of guilds would have to say. For example, one guild may squash an event more quickly than another. Will the benefits derived from a bard differ as an event lasts longer? Simple things like mana concerns, abilities that can be used that don't stack with some bard things, etc.

Also, what is the best way to get my grubby hands on top guild parses? I don't really have many krono left since returning to game!

But bards (and any raid adps) don't work in vacuums. If you assume all the healers are clerics, and there are no rangers or beastlords, someone might be able to give you a list (but not me). I play a wizard on open raids and I'm generally more concerned about how many rangers we have for the evening and when auspice will be.

On the caster side, I think the "general" order is necro, enchanter, mage, wizard ... mainly because bards help dots more than dd ... and mage pets would benefit more than just straight dds (wizard). Shaman and druids (with their dots) would be high on the list as well, but usually healers tend to be in whatever groups they have to be in. I have no idea about the melee side these days and I'm not sure about casters vs melee if you don't have enough for all dps groups (I think the best necro group would go ahead of the best melee group, but that's just personal preference).

Top guild parses are an awful way to look at this issue. Top guilds generally have a bard in every dps group. Some of the people streaming/videoing current content raids will show an overall parse at the end (usually without much context), but they're there.

You want to be looking at the lower tier parses and deep dive into the groups that get bards vs the ones that don't. Best way to do that is to take part in whatever open raiding is on your server. Some of the class discords will post parses and go into deeper analysis as well.

Thank you Brick. I assumed DoT classes with pets were high on the list also. And yeah i do have a decent idea about this entire topic to be honest but am here to see what people who have more recent experience playing EQ than I do have to say on the issue.

My knowledge, like yours currently it seems, is quite limited on the melee side of things. Anyway appreciate your reply and happy hunting.

Bards in a raid tank group? I guess that does happen and bards do have songs for that role.
I haven't had a main bard in my raid group for years.

You'd want a bard in every raid group if there were enough around and those who are did the correct stuff in the correct order with the right timing But since bards aren't getting balanced less and less real ones remain...The rest depends on other players to coordinate the right stuff at the right time to max their own benefit from bards and/or in turn boost the bard's own dps

If I had a bard in my tank group, I'd just want them to sing their normal melee aDPS songs. None of that "tank" song nonsense.

That's what a boxed bard typically does. That melody tends to leave AC, aggro, healing, and endurance on the table.

More of that stuff is surely better than less, but how much is gained and at what cost has to be asked. The AC gained from bard songs is nice but not a game changer; the healing too. Tanking as an exercise is pretty binary - either the clerics can keep up, or they can't; the edge cases are rarely tested, and the reward for tanking harder is not much. As funny as it would be, enemies don't actually die of the frustration trying to kill us. So, the next step? if the AC songs and healing songs aren't necessary, then those songs could be additional (a)dps. Like Syylke_EMarr said.