How to Incentivize Grouping or Accelerate Solo Catch-ups?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Nobildus, May 19, 2021.

  1. Windance Augur

    On live most of the returning players want to raid. For many that means a heroic 85 toon (or something similar) getting boosted to 115 and 10k AA after the auto grants.

    I'd rather see DB add a 'heroic booster' that pushes the 85 - 110 ( or what ever max level - 5) and pocket the money directly, rather then encouraging AFK XP farming.
    Skuz likes this.
  2. Iven Augur

    If it is about ketchup (catching up) there has to be a new expansion like The Serpents Spine with a starting zone like Crescent Reach where PCs can start fully equipped at level 100 without the need to buy a heroic toon. It still should be possible to start at level 1 but the level 100 option should be marked as recommended. As heroic toons are a good money source for DB there has to be an optional lvl 100 or 110 heroic feature which provides better equipment and a full set of huge bags. The level 85 heroic feature should then be removed. The new expansion should be located in a classic theme and region somewhere on Antonica just like TSS but it could be also a new island or continent. It might also be necessary to build a new tutorial.
  3. Yinla Ye Ol' Dragon

    NIce idea, but I don't agree with removing level 85 heroics, these still have their place.

    I'm still hoping for an expansion on Drinal, the god could grant a level increase to 110 with quests for additional training. :) Along with maybe a couple of new race/class combos :)
    Skuz likes this.
  4. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Removing Heroic Upgrade options is the wrong direction to go in.

    Adding options would be far better, so keep the L85, add L100, L70, L51 that way TLP also benefit by having more catch up options as they age too.

    Price the 100 at what the 85 is now and reduce the pricing backwards for the lower level upgrades.
  5. jiri_ Augur

    Eh, I kind of think that if his idea were implemented, with the option to start at 1 or 100 at will, Heroic characters probably should be removed. Paying $35 to lose 15 levels and some amount of AA seems odd.

    I'd love an enhanced shroud system but I feel like that's unlikely after the Old Man McKenzie furor from, gosh, must be eight years ago now, and the hDex/TT thing, and really any time the quickest route to Max/Max hasn't been through the most recent expansion. I think that, if you contemplate a shroud-based or downscaling-based concept, the thing that has to be avoided at all cost is a group of 6 level 115s, shrouded down to 20, sitting in whatever the level 20 Hot Zone is to farm up their glyph AAs.
  6. Atomos Augur

    I hope you're not implying that people should magically already know to Google the thing that they didn't already know existed?
    You can't Google Everquest unless you know Everquest exists.
    You can't Google Everquest Overseer unless you know Everquest Overseer exists.

    I haven't seen Overseer mentioned in any new/returning player guide I've read so far.
  7. KrakenReality Augur

    Overseer is the opposite of a retention mechanism.
    Metanis likes this.
  8. ForumBoss Augur

    Some ideas, I'm sure some have been said.
    -increase level range for grouping, or implement a reverse shroud.
    -give better regular xp rewards for quests, preferably moloable ones. Only rof and tov gave noticable xp.
    -lvl cap minus 5 heroics, give tbm currency if itemization is the excuse.
    -allow players to divert xp into mercs when they are suspended if they are grouped with players, so they dont feel like they need a merc out to progress.
  9. jiri_ Augur

    I think the level range is big enough - the problem is that when it's taken advantage of, it's essentially just a powerlevel. There's nothing a group of 5 115s can do that a level 85 character can help with, unless it's shrouded where you aren't using your class abilities. The other option would be creating group content that basically requires one person to run around doing emotes and other non-combat stuff during normal xp grinds.
    Elyssanda likes this.
  10. ForumBoss Augur

    I'm not sure what is wrong with powerleveling, if the problem statement of this post is that catching up is difficult.
  11. KrakenReality Augur

    Power leveling is the best way to kill interest in a game.
  12. Rage Lorekeeper

    I think they should add an exp boost based on how far from the current level cap you are, for example a 3x boost to start that tapers down to regular exp when you are within 5 levels of the cap. Probably implement it starting in GoD on TLPs. There is already a similar system for AAs so hopefully it would be easy to implement and it would be a single solution that would help both live and TLPs.

    A lot of the ideas suggested in this thread don't seem realistic with the resources they put into EQ. Something simple is far more likely to be implemented.
  13. jiri_ Augur

    Nothing, it's just not a solution to the problem. A player whose max level character is 95 can't powerlevel themselves to 115. Powerleveling existing doesn't mean catching up is easy, it means that the only expedient way to do it is to find other people to do it for you.
    Niskin likes this.
  14. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    If you had
    100 @ $35
    85 @ $25
    70 @ $15
    51 @ $5

    for example, then players could jump back in at the point that they felt comfortable - not everyone is going to want to go right to 100 straight off the bat and you are forgetting that the options being there for TLP at certain points would be an extra source of a few bucks too.

    Shrouds can go die in a fiery hell, but level scaling newbs up to the end game range would be better I think, let them earn XP in the background while they are somewhat useful to a group. The difficulty lies in creating a system that does that in EQ's old-a$$ engine.

    Scaling Max level players down runs into the problem of making that rewarding for them because without AAXP at the very least being comparable to current era content its a complete waste of their time, and the devs really will not swallow that.
    Elyssanda likes this.
  15. Bigstomp Augur

    I think the problem is nobody has any pressing need to log in and help with stuff after we've completed progression.

    The missions give some coins many could use, but the progression tasks give nothing worth helping someone else through them other than good in game faction.

    So once you've done them once, why repeat them?
    Raids end, my XP and AA are in good shape, I'm a bit tired, my odds of staying are low.
    Skuz likes this.
  16. Stymie Pendragon

    I absolutely hate that WoW did this. There is zero power progression in the game except at max level after reaching a certain ilevel threshold. Oh, and every 6 months the gear you acquired needs to be replaced with the new season's power creep. And every 2 years all the systems are dropped and your class is gutted, all to start chasing the carrot again.

    For example, fighting at level 33 with 2000hp mobs and ding to 34. The next mob has 2500hp. The level increase meant nothing.It's just another number. The same can happen when you get a better piece of armor or weapon. Leveling serves no purpose beyond a fast paced tutorial. You can speed level to max in under 10 hours if I remember the number correctly.

    If EQ did this there would be no more blue or light blue con mobs. They would all be white. Sounds fun right?

    I don't even want to touch upon how much I loathe timed dungeons.

    I do think that EQ should spend some time on the xp drought after level 70 though. Everything is pretty smooth sailing molo until the trucks come out. Everything gets way too slow from there for me.
    Niskin likes this.
  17. KarmaKitty Augur

    Took a 23 mage to nerdia's landing for 9 levels in basically 3 lessen burns over a week. At that rate, I could hit 106 in about 11 weeks. However, this requires similar sweet spots across the level range. This is probably still too slow for a newb trying to catch up. They need to improve on this. Perhaps not 3x, but cut the time in half.

    I know, fellowships would help, but not everyone is trying to catch up to someone. Also, I know it is designed as a group game, but they need to facilitate doing things with offline characters on the same account. They also need to drop the 3 player requirement. If I think, I can take the mission with just my merc and/or pet, I should be allowed. I should not be required to spam general looking for someone to group with me long enough to pick it up. I hate that.
    Stymie likes this.
  18. Ultrazen Augur

    As someone who has been playing off and on since release, and has bounced off of the 80+ game a bunch of times, here's the problem, for me at least.

    1. Mercs continued slide into sucking post 60. This is the single biggest issue for me, if mercs held their relative power to mobs that they have at level 60, I wouldn't really mind the grind nearly as much. When every pull becomes a life or death struggle, and you have about 18897983792849834 pulls to level, it get's old fast. At one point in the games history, having mercs suck was needed, as you wanted to encourage players to group. Groups just don't exist at this point, given how wide the level range is, the odds that you are actually going to get anything even resembling a real group are about 0%.

    2. How slow exp gets post 70ish. I've tried to molo, I've tried multi boxing, the result is the same, exp is just way too slow. That no mans land between especially 80-110 just takes forever, and the fact that it just continues to get worse as you go really shuts down any incentive you have to keep going. Mobs turn into these huge damage sponges, that take longer and longer to deal with, and one shot any class other than a tank.

    The speed of leveling, and the number of levels, is certainly an issue, but the fact that mercs become utterly useless, especially the tank mercs, really turns into a brick wall for someone trying to catch up.

    P.S. Note for devs. If you want to take a look at a place that has the perfect balance of merc power, leveling speed, etc, take a 2 or 3 box team with mercs into Veksar at about level 55. If there was a Veksar like experience I could have all the way to cap, I'd happily do it.
    Niskin, Stymie and jiri_ like this.
  19. Palamar New Member

    As a casual player who’s max character is 95, I agree with the above. You just hit such a brick wall at ~80.

    I’d like to experience the content and not just PL or buy my way through. I box, but honestly it is tedious and still takes forever. I’m not against grind, but when u grind alone it’s boring.

    Maybe it’s as simple as buffing mercs and increase progression XP to get you all the way to the next expansion up?
    Stymie likes this.
  20. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    On Live "some" of the returning players want to raid. I suspect if you are in a raid guild the returning folks you interact with will be the ones who want to raid. Likewise if you are in a casual guild you may be more likely to encounter returning players who are casuals.

    Since I do recruiting for my guild I encounter many of the returning folks and most do not have raiding at the top of their list. When I approach folks looking for a guild I end up referring very few to raid guilds as they are generally not looking for one when they first return to the game. Some do later seek out raid guilds though once they have gotten back into the swing of things.

    And to be fair for any guild it usually means a heroic 85 toon. I try and recruit every low level player I can get my hands on but I never get a decent amount of low levels for grouping. I am very up front with folks that if they join us they won't see much in the way of groups till they hit 85.
    Yinla, Metanis, Skuz and 1 other person like this.