Higher ratio weapons

If a tank is in a group with no adps then I think they should do about zero DPS. Possibly less.

While it would make a lot of sense if that sentence were true, that does not actually describe EverQuest. Tanks have the best innate damage modifiers, and therefore the highest innate melee DPS, of literally any class in the game.

Where melee classes make up some (but not all) of the gap is with activated abilities/disciplines/modifiers.

I don't know why tanks should produce DPS, very good, just ok ... whatever type of DPS.

Awkward example: wizards tank for crap, not very good, not just ok.... Why should warriors be any DPS? If you want to dps, go roll a dps class imo.

Given that warriors are called out later in the post, I think when they say 'tank ratios', I'm pretty sure they mean knight ratios.

I do roll a DPS class, I roll an EQ Warrior. DPS isn't enough to keep me interested in a game, I want to be able to tank too. I can do exactly 2 things well, Tank, With a ton of support, and DPS, with a ton of support. I can't solo, I can't pull, I can't buff, I can't port, I can't track.
I can take hits and dish them out.

I've leaned heavily into the DPS end of the warrior through Mangler TLP from Kunark up to now TBL. Given full adps, I can hold my own close to the best Monks Rogues Zerkers, I can't beat them. The ones who don't know their class as well, get smoked. Warrior DPS is where it needs to be for most of the games curve. We have no use outside of tanking otherwise, and only 1 can do that at a time.

That being said, if Monks Rogue's and Zerkers are behind Warrior dps, given equal adps footing on live, something is definitely off and those classes have been neglected.

So Druids and Shamans who are in a group with no ADPS should also do zero DPS ? Enchanters and Bards who aren't in a DPS group should also do zero DPS because their main job is providing ADPS to DPS classes ?

I'm not sure what is the problem with tank DPS in tank group with no ADPS. Any DPS class who has a least a bit of support in their DPS group should beat without problem tanks in tank groups.

Ah yeah, Warrior are very bad at soloing, one of the worst soloers in this game, have barely any utility in group (cannot port, cannot evac, cannot cast levi and perfect invis other group members). Should do only tanking and nothing else.

Druids / Shamans can heal, why should they be any DPS? If they want to dps, they should go roll a dps class too ?

Druids are a DPS class. Bards are hybrids so should do both and same goes for enc as they're really just caster bards. Neither have particularly good DPS at this point anyway. Shaman probably should do basically no DPS without a DPS group as their healing is insanely strong and it is their main role.

Is it tanks like those rolling on the battlefield or tanks as in storage?

If it's battlefield, firepower, armor and mobility are defining characteristics of their namesake. It is the combination that makes them a threat. Why would an enemy focus attacking something that is hard to destroy if it is just there with a weaker enemy continuously fixing the damage it takes and even more scantily armored enemies taking uncontested shots?

If it's storage tanks of hit points, just roll that role into clerics to simplify things. They already have the no DPS thing locked up tight.

Either way, tanks for letting me stand behind you so I can make the parse.

That's a good question.

I think a lot of people don't know what a well played shaman can achieve when it comes to dps so not many called for nerfs.

When Reluctant Benevolence was nerfed and made basically trash AA, people asked and a reply from devs was something along the lines ... a class cannot do both, we don't want necromancers to be able to dps well and heal well ...

Yet here we are, years later, and suddenly a class can heal extremely well and can dps extremely well.

It seems that things have changed. Maybe AA dev can bring up RB to a reasonable level instead of it being just a junk AA at this point.

The game has been very intentionally designed so that you cannot function without a tank. Any time a class has broken away in the past, they get beat down with nerf sticks so that tanks are needed.Real balance would mean the tank also cannot function without the dps (obviously ignoring raid gear in group content, cause its not designed for that).

A Wizard cant do much on their own. They'll get beaten down. Same thing with a druid. Neither will be doing named and group tasks without a tank. The idea is that since other classes require a tank to function, the tank should ALSO require other classes to function.
The tank does the tanking, the other classes do the damage. 5 SK and a shm can curb stomp anything. 5 wizard and a druid? They can't even play gems anymore.

Why play a monk if the warrior can do 95-100% of the dps and ALSO tank? See the point here? If any tank can approach ANY dps class in damage, the tank is broken.

This is a group with six healers. The shaman is by far the weakest of those healers.

Yes. An excellent statement!

Have you tried to play a warrior on his own ? They are worst than wizards / druids at soloing. They can't do much on their own too, and by a bigger margin. So you want to make them against worst than giving them 0 DPS. So, while the druid / wizard keeps his DPS and can still do something even if he cannot tank the mob, the tank can only tank the mob and does 0 DPS, the mob HP doesn't go down, great warriors would go from bad soloing to impossible soloing lol.

That's when people don't read. Warriors aren't doing overpowered DPS in tanking groups with no ADPS which make for 95 % of raiding cases. So reducing tank DPS is a very bad idea. Better idea : Reduce the impact of ADPS tools on Tanks own DPS tools.

Sure warriors shouldn't do 0 dps. But you give off the impression that they are the worst soloers which is far from true.. Try playing a cleric and begging for dps or adps upgrades for years and getting nothing but your abilities given to mercs.....

As a cleric I can't even reliably kill ros/eok mobs that are 15-20 levels below me (even with a tank/dps merc it takes forever while my bard plows through them)