Hadden (and respecting camps)

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by EchoFreya, Sep 29, 2020.

  1. Protagonist Augur

    He already said he's a p99 player. That encapsulates weird cringy roleplay, not knowing the rules, not knowing the mechanics, and being a complete prat that insists everyone else is wrong when their terrible gameplay goes wrong.
  2. jeskola Why no Erudite Female avatar?

    We need Jonee to weigh in.
  3. Funky Augur

    so after all this, you are admitting to boxing 6 toons on aradune?

    From : https://www.everquest.com/news/eq-tlp-aradune-rizlona-2020

    Aradune Ruleset -
    Mangler Ruleset for XP Progression
    Agents of Change Enabled
    Pick Zones Enabled
    By playing on Aradune you agree to:
    Absolutely No Automated/Unintended Game-play, any incident of automated gameplay is immediate suspension, second offence is a ban including Aradune associated accounts.
    Boxing any more than 2 characters will result in the following actions taken against your account. First Offence: A written warning from the GM. Second Offence: A 7 day suspension of account privileges on all Aradune related accounts. Third Offence: Permanent ban on all Aradune associated accounts.

    while you are just whining about Hadden "camp"? no camps, but boxing rules do exist. watch what you say
  4. Arhok New Member

    Literally the first sentence of the OP.
  5. Funky Augur

    thanks, i misread a different person due to the back and forth of P99, riz/aradune. lol carry on :D
  6. German Augur

    You said weren't at the controls when it was killed, you said you were going to watch Netflix and camp the spawn. Next time pay attention, use a timer and be ready to engage on spawn.

    The very fact they engaged first and killed it while you attempted to Netflix binge for several hours while trying to stay awake while camping something half paying attention means you weren't serious about keeping the camp.

    If you're trying to get the item for a crew of six, you're the other end of the many threads of people whining incessantly about some box crew monopolizing a spawn.
    Funky likes this.
  7. Elskidor Augur

    TLPs are pretty toxic in the early expansions. I would probably stick with P99 until later on personally or lower expectations on camping anything.
  8. Loze Elder

    Do you even sarcasm, bro?
  9. Loze Elder

    This might be the dumbest thing I've ever read.
  10. Tweakfour17 Augur

    It's not dumb, just not correct. Watching netflix on 1 screen with eq on the other is not AFK, however Captain has a good point that if OP was actually paying attention he wouldn't have missed his spawn. Snooze ya lose. Also, I think there is a big difference between killing all the mobs around you that respawn every 16 mintues because you're xp'ing and thats a camp and wanting people to leave you alone, a solo mob that spawns every 6 hours is not a camp at all, game on.
  11. RizLoaner Elder

    Why sit at Haden for hours when you can kill him every time people run through to go kill Vox. Pick threshold for qhills is so low and Hadden always spawns on pick up.
  12. Loze Elder

    I get all that. If you fall asleep at the keyboard, while not technically AFK (I mean, it means Away From Keyboard), you're gonna lose. My beef is more with the might makes right mentality.

    Remember what happened when your big brother stole the toy you were playing with, simply because he wanted it and he was strong enough to take it from you? (I AM the big brother, so I don't)

    Remember what your mommy did, or promised that your father would when he got home?

    That's what this bunch of man-babies needs, a spanking from mommy. Beware the Vorpal Spoon!
  13. Captain Video Augur

    Yes, technically and otherwise, you're AFK. By the rules of the game, you have to actually type or click something to not be AFK. A little "AFK" warning appears after your name above your toon. It's been the rule since launch. On a Live server you could never get away with watching Netflix and doing nothing for six hours, you'd be booted to the character select screen. Things work differently on TLPs because so many people use third-party software to keep their idle toons "alive".
  14. Protagonist Augur

    Most the people in this thread will take that as a dare.
    Loze likes this.
  15. EchoFreya Lorekeeper

    I feel that you have intentionally altered the facts here. To clarify:
    • I clearly indicate that I was watching Netflix (on another device with my computer screen positioned beside me), as I waited for the next spawn (Hadden is a 5 hour camp in a peaceful area of the map). Nowhere here do I state that I was away from keyboard, and to indicate this in any way is injecting an opinion based on assumption.
    • A play session may comprise of several hours, yet during this time it is be unreasonable to assume that a person is unmoving, glued to their screen, particularly during moments of downtime. This unreasonable projected expectation is likely not something that an accuser is capable of doing themselves. After all, people do need to eat, drink, go to the bathroom, etc.
    "AFK playing" and "Being AFK" are two different things. A simple method to determine this us attempt to communicate.
    1. If they do not respond to reasonable attempts to communicate (multi-modal approach through /tell and /say) within a reasonable amount of time (if they aren't moving, wait until they do), then you can assume they were/are "AFK".
    2. If they are not responsive and they are moving, then you can suspect they are "AFK playing", but you can't be sure. Tells can be missed for a variety of reasons, (UI configuration, colour blindness, vision impairments, etc.). There is a lot of room for assumption, and you may not be correct.
    You have made another incorrect assumption, but I will clarify if I failed to make this clear earlier.

    I indicated that had one character at that camp. Before this incident and when I first entered the zone (12 minutes before the interaction according to my log) I was playing 3 characters, one of which had track. When I saw that Hadden was up, and nobody was camping him, I chose to alter my plans and claim the camp for the rest of the night (my other two characters were unnecessary for this task).

    I only logged in my mage the following morning to an empty zone (no other characters were involved). Smoki logged in somewhere outside of my camera view before Hadden spawned. I had been sitting at that camp for approximately 45 minutes before Hadden spawned.

    I didn't notice Smoki's baiting dialogue until after he killed Hadden and logged out, so I don't know how long he was sitting there before Hadden popped. He certainly didn't send me a /tell (which I would have noticed immediately due to the new window that pops up). He killed Hadden within seconds of spawning, and logged out immediately after. I wasn't permitted reasonable reflex time to cast or send pet before Hadden was dead.

    I have been honest and truthful in my approach with this matter. This response is very one-sided, self-serving, and rife with assumptions that minimizes and shifts blame away from your own actions, and attempts to paint me in a negative light. It is telling of your character, and illustrates why coming to an amicable resolution to this matter with you was impossible.

    I also indicate that I played on live, and my recollection of the ruleset here included guidelines and expectations around player interactions outlined within a ToS (based on earlier versions of a EULA and PNP policy).

    Imagine my surprise to return here last spring to find players both in-game and on this forum advocates that rulesets meant to deter antisocial behaviour and promote cooperative gameplay are not longer enforced by staff, and players actually believe staff promotes poor behaviour! I still can't entirely believe this is true, to be honest. It's bad for business.

    To understand how this erosion in attitudes occurred, Bobbybick inserts a quote in this thread that I felt compelled to look up. He indicates that Daybreak once claimed that "DPS races wins all situations".

    I found an interesting thread from 5 years ago when this quote first appears on this forum. Reading through the pages of that thread, players were predicting that this exact scenario would be commonplace, and demanded clarifications around it. Clearly they were not wrong about predicted outcomes, as most of them have come true 5 years later and are now considered "fact".

    Some damage control was clearly warranted at that time, but it doesn't appear this was adequately followed up on particularly in terms of how this statement contradicts aspects of the original EULA and PNP that still exist in the current Rules of Conduct.

    I admit my my choices and actions (e.g., warning Smoki that if he continued in the direction he was going, I intended to report him for what I perceived to be aggression), as well as posting here when no staff assistance or intervention was provided are not the best approaches to problems. I not proud that I lacked the fortitude to just "walk away", as others have been conditioned to do over time by players like this. I have grown frustrated by a growing number of encounters just like this one since choosing to play here again last spring, and this incident was the straw that broke the camel's back for me.

    I brought my issue to this forum to gain clarity around the issues of griefing, camp-stealing, camp claiming, DPS races, spawn stealing, and every other antisocial behavior that appears to go against the Rules of Conduct, but continue to go unaddressed to the point where some players feel they have a "right" to mistreat other people for their own (or their guild's) self-gain. Some even claim that antisocial behaviour is endorsed by staff, as indicated within this and countless other forum posts.

    There are still enough things about playing this game on a TLP that outweigh these negative incidents. The majority of people here are awesome, friendly, and it is the positive social experiences that keep me logging in regularly. I care enough to post about this issue, because I would like to see a reasonable reduction to the negative aspects of this game which are largely associated with poor sportsmanship, selfishness, and aggressive attitudes which appear to be out of control because there is a lack of enforcement of rulesets.

    These antisocial encounters are growing tiresome not just to me, but many others as well. The anxiety attached to certain activities, milestones, and encounters because of the despicable acts and behaviours some players resort to self-gain is out of control, and I really do hope server staff acknowledges it, and addresses it in a similar manner that was employed during the early years of this game. I truly believe that if something like this was done, communities could become healthier and this can only lead to more commitment and reductions in the rate of attrition.
  16. Skuz Berserker Logic: Kill everything.


    Literally speaking they didn't ever say that exact phrase so you are factually incorrect, however I can see why you have mistakenly interpreted the conversation in such a way as it was muddied by the term "bot" being used to refer to 3rd party software assistance of an active player's boxed characters.

    e.g. "1) Is the community who likes to "bot" large enough to sustain a full server "

    This word "bot" was clarified later by Holly as:

    "Botting is automated boxing. THe issue of offline/automated is not okay for us."

    Well, no again you have added 1+1 & come out with 4, they referred to it as

    Let's move to 3) What would dissuade you from playing on the "Bot" server?

    Which isn't really the same thing as it being their actual name for it, no actual name for the server was stated until it was called Rizlona.

    I'm being very particular here but since you are the one who is saying they "literally" said things which they actually didn't you should be corrected.

    Also, this one line referring to it as such doesn't qualify as "repeatedly" and again comes after the clarification of:

    "Botting is automated boxing. THe issue of offline/automated is not okay for us."

    "2) what rules are most appealing to this community to keep it thriving as long as possible 3) What would dissuade "botters" 4) How do we keep this server healthy"

    So these questions were aimed at players who intended to box & have some of their characters using 3rd party software assistance. They weren't at any point saying afk automated characters were Okay, their definition of "bot" server was about software assisted boxed characters under an active player's control.

    And pretty much every time botting was mentioned there was a question about how to dissuade it involved too.

    Or actually correcting your factual inaccuracies and clear tendency for taking creative liberties is a sorry necessity as you like to play up the drama-factor to garner more attention I guess.

    The dev chat was very clearly anti-AFK automation at all points.

    And a leaked chat where botting is mentioned does not qualify as a public endorsement of the practise, that's just your disingenuous mental gymnastics at work.
  17. Accipiter Old Timer

    Really? LOL. You must have limited bandwidth between your ears.
    Loze likes this.
  18. Skuz Berserker Logic: Kill everything.

    Or none.
    Loze likes this.
  19. Protagonist Augur

    This was a lot of words to say you've never known the touch of a woman.
  20. Lejaun Augur

    So tired of the "Camps aren't a thing" crowd. Yes, whether you choose to respect them or not, Camping a location or mob in Everquest is camping, whether you respect it or Darkpaw enforces it or not.

    The PNP is no longer in effect because it takes a significant amount of manpower to enforce, especially in these days of online gaming where anonymity and protection of being behind a computer are a real thing. The DPS policy exists solely because it requires the least amount of manpower from Darkpaw to enforce, because it essentially removes the need to enforce anything involving contested camps or spawns.

    People are encouraged to display bad behavior because it nets them more gain than not overall. Even if the entire server turned against someone, they are only a potion away from changing their name or race or sex or all of them and having a brand new identity. EQ no longer tracks a website that shows what names everyone changed to.

    Even if a player gets banned, it is no longer that big of a deal. These are the players that force their way into camps at will that drop items that they sell for Krono. They usually have multiple accounts, At the worst, they have to create a new character. It takes less than a week for a dedicated player on a TLP to get to max level.

    As a result of the change from PNP to DPC contest, as a result of the ease of getting a character to max level if you get banned, as a result of alternative forms of paying for accounts is there, as a result of simple procedures to change name/race/sex, there is now a very toxic environment in the game. Thankfully this starts going away as content becomes more and more instanced in later expansions, but early on it will continue to be a major problem as the population competes for these spawns.

    This toxicity is shown clearly as well with the "entitled" membership. People who claim that others are entitled, as they themselves force themselves into a camp that someone has already beaten them too first, as they play certain classes that are better at DPS racing and thinking that they have the right to take what they want. You play a necro or mage or multiple of them and just walked up to a camp that someone has already been at before you got there, but you deserve the item as much as they do, and if they complain about your actions you call them entitled? Huh? You have it backwards.
    Elskidor and EchoFreya like this.

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