Fire Trap

Discussion in 'Tanks' started by Frael, Apr 10, 2019.

  1. Aelen Augur

    I did go ahead and test this. I didn't do a proper "lab conditions" style test, but I'm reasonably satisfied that ripostes aren't proccing defensive procs.

    A bard with no weapons singing Reverberating Barrier, beating on a /dueled rogue with an empty mainhand, did not result in stun procs hitting the rogue while standing there idly, or while using the Counterattack disc, whitch makes every swing a riposte for a couple ticks.

    On the flipside, the rogue hitting the bard with regular autoattack did proc them, about 8 times in the short time I was testing that.

    That and the riposte version being a zero-variance case, hits statistical confidence reasonably quickly.

    The part where it wasn't "proper conditions", is I probably should've test copied, frozen buffs and done 2-3 minutes at least of straight autoattacking on the Counterattack disc looking for a defensive proc, then waited long enough to time out the fight before re-testing the rogue's autoattack to see it proc successfully off of that. Instead I had to look at the parse log to make sure all the defensive procs happened during a timeframe where the piercing weapon in my rogue's offhand was firing.

    Aside from that, there is some possibility NPC and PC are for some reason handled differently on this. I saw no evidence they're different when I tried it with a pet, but I also couldn't get anywhere near as many ripostes in a short timeframe, so It'd need to be a much longer test. Maybe someday I'll get a few people to help me set up something with roots, heals, stuns, and a Sarnak's auto-riposte ability to manipulate a somewhat quick version of an NPC test.
    Frael likes this.
  2. Elkar Headhunter Lorekeeper

    I just pull them, dump aggro on them, and tank while ducked and no issues.
  3. josh Augur

    For the last time, it is a defensive proc, meaning if you get attacked, it procs. it does not trigger when you attack, it triggers when you are attacked. Any melee can die to a riposte, but if a tank gets it, they are dead with 100% certainty, there is 0 chance of survival and there is nothing you could possibly do to survive, and anybody suggesting differently has no idea what they are talking about.
    Koryu and Syylke_EMarr like this.
  4. Qbert Augur

    I tank the mobs with this by turtling up with darkened cone of the mystics. I don't have attack on, I just use hate spells and such. It takes forever, and like many of the spells/abilities on TBL named, it really isn't built for having fun while playing.
  5. Syylke_EMarr Augur

    These are still proccing the effect defensively, rather than offensively (so ducking or no weapon have no effect on them).

    Either fix the description or fix the spell.
  6. Elkar Headhunter Lorekeeper

    I do know that just like shining fortress or any other defensive proc it should still proc while I am ducked with a no damage set up. Regardless I have had very good luck with doing it. There have been times while doing it I have the buff on me and someone starts gaining on the agro meter so I have stood to attempt to throw some agro on it and died right off. Coincidence? Maybe but either way "every" single time I have tanked one of these mobs with snowcone while ducked 100% of the time I have not died while having the buff on me at some point.
  7. Sithsonn Elder

    All you gotta do is turn pet taunt on and you'll be fine, doesn't get casted on my pet and he can handle the mob until the buff fades.
  8. Sithsonn Elder

    I also just kite him if i have to and send the pet! Just one of those mobs that keeps ya on you're feet!
  9. Sithsonn Elder

    Just realized this was for warriors, but you know if you got a pet tank class that solves the problem
  10. Allayna Augur

    SK pet tanks namers that wreck raid tanks....nothing to see here folks.
    Sithsonn likes this.
  11. Brohg Augur

    wru Allayna's Squire
    Allayna likes this.
  12. Allayna Augur

    The thing is DBG will give us a damned squire and he’ll be late to battle, have no armor and face the wrong way....then implode.
  13. Wulfhere Augur

    Fire Trap adds a defensive proc with no limitations. If the mob hits you with melee, it will proc.

    If it misses you due to avoidance checks, or better yet you use any avoidance abilitiy: fortitude, deflection, weaponshield, then it should not proc because it hasn't or can't hit you.

    I don't think it's a bug in the spell as there have been these types of self destruct spells before. Remember Cooling Crust in Argin-Hiz forced you to turn off auto attack? It's designed to force you to actively use your avoidance abilities, maybe even non stacking abilities ( and failing that kill inattentive or boxed tanks.

    I think just the description is misleading. If it said "threatening to burn you if you are attacked." then that would be correct.
  14. Brohg Augur

  15. Wulfhere Augur

    Yes possibly. I'm saying they don't stack. I'm not sure if that means they overwrite each other wrt a buff slot.

    If they do then activating any of those abilities in response to the "debuff" would cancel it. That would also mean that Fire Trap would overwrite the active buff slot that one of those abilities might have .E.g. your Brace For Impact would fade early under those circumstances. Similar to how a reverse damage shield can cancel a damage shield.

    If we can have only one SPA 323 buff in the same slot (I believe so) and they don't overwrite, then yes one of those buffs might block Fire Trap from landing (this idea seems to be supported by posters in this thread who find the fight "easy").

    ps: Allayna, paladins are the only tank class that does not have an SPA 323 spell in Slot 1 (besides COA bp click), potentially making paladins the worst tank for all of these mobs.
    Allayna likes this.

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