Enhanced Minion inflation - Let's get this over with.

Does anyone else feel like the pace of Enhanced Minion upgrades has recently increased?

This chronology follows the group-level EM items (excluding Golden Sage and Summoner's Descending Moon) based on database search of raidloot.com set to pet class and order/score by 'focus: increase pet power.'

ROF T1: EM12

ROF T2: EM13-14

CoTF T1: EM15

CoTFT2: EM16

TDS T1: EM16

TDS T2-T3: EM17-18 - First non-raid presentment of EM18.

TBM: EM18 - There seems to be a pause at TBM.

EoK T1/T2: EM18

RoS T1: EM18 - Plateaus at 18 until RoS T2 with 1 tier upgrade.

RoS T2: EM19

TBL T1: EM20

TBL T2: EM21

Again, the interesting observation that draw's my attention is that EM18 sticks from Sparking Bauble (prestige) in TDS to Shade's Phase (non-prestige) in TBM to Engraved Bone Earring (non-prestige) in EoK to Summoner's Conflagrant Earring & Sound of the Howl Earring (non-prestige) in RoS.

I think EM should settle at 21 or 22 at most for the next expansion with the sort of 2-expansion plateau we saw between TBM and ROS T1. The raid EM tier currently sits at 27 which can move up to EM28. Additionally, the EM "chase loot" (Golden Sage Earring at EM24 and Summoner's Descending Moon Earring at EM25) will have staying power. (And, if EM chase loot is forcing the pace, then a temporary pause on EM chase might be necessary).

I fear the pace of EM upgrades may lead to future pet nerfs or nerfs to EM itself. (It is better to "manage" what we don't yet have versus nerfing what we have).

What are your thoughts?

I hate "lets get this over with" threads.

Perhaps if they were all condensed into one thread. We could serve cheese.

I wish getting EM upgrades actually did something meaningful lol.

I feel like my pet is tankier (better avoidance/mitigation stats) at EM25 versus EM18 with max pet AA. It might be the placebo effect.

Anyways, the current levels are fine and rather not see knee-jerk nerfs when we reach EM25+ for group and EM30 for raid in 2 expansions time at the current pace.

When u jump up 7 lvls, sure. However on an expansion per expansion basis, 1 lvl does basically nothing.

Whereas if u take a weapon upgrade from where EM 18 was to where EM 25 is, there is a distinct gap. It used to be worse, but still EM increases are incredibly poor.

So what do you suggest? No em upgrade next expansion? Allow the chase loot for next expansion equal the raid loot for next expansion?

If the next expansion chase loot is anything like this expansions then it won't matter, because your talking about maybe the 1 item from the chase loot that anyone might have cared about.

From what Ngreth has said, Enhanced Minion focus is pretty tedious. I wouldn't mind seeing it go away with the next expansion.

True.

However, if I would kindly submit, comparing era weapons to pet increases is like comparing apples to oranges.

It would be a truer statement if you compared weapon augments that scale or evolve with era.

In the same sense, the pet increases power with the new expansion's pet summon spell with enhanced minion modifying that base power.

While I am not an expert on the engine under the proverbial "pet" hood, EM spell data refers to a separate numerical increase:

Enhanced Minion XXVII

1

: Pet Power Increase (185)

2

: Limit: Max Level(125)

3

: Limit: Min Level (106)

Enhanced Minion XXI

1

: Pet Power Increase (155)

2

: Limit: Max Level(115)

3

: Limit: Min Level (96)

Herein, I fear the calculated increase to base pet power will exceed the devs' expectation (unintended consequences) thus resorting to a re-calculation or nerf.

Please correct me if I am wrong here.

I am suggesting that EM21 (currently TBL T2) follows the model of EM18. Yes, so probably no upgrade.

Yes, that's why I've suggested pausing EM chase loot drops so it won't force the EM upgrade pace.

The numbers are somewhat irrelevant. From what I understand under the pet hood, different levels of enhanced minion summon different MOBs as pets. These are all handcrafted with different stats, which is why it's so tedious because when Ngreth adds a new level of enhanced minion he has to make ~30 or so new pet MOBs.

That is insane. I remember Ngreth said something like that when I suggested making "Elemental Mastery staves" for TBL. I am not sure if I agree with your earlier comment doing away with EM but at least a slowdown in EM can alleviate his work load (or at least let him add new models to summoned pets lol).

If my point is true, then having a bunch of VERY minimal increases, how is it seen as too much power?

And realistically, EM increases are weapons for pets. It is also their stat increases based on the summoned back item they get per EM lvl.

It feels like you are putting a lot of stock on a focus that provides minimal increases year over year. It would be a different story if we saw 5 EM levels per expansion, but we do not.

I am putting stock on the meta-trend.

However, based on Tucoh's information, Ngreth handcrafts a pet mob for each spell/tier combination. And, if it's minimal increases as you say (this is disputed), that begs a better question if the work load - linked to the new pace (2-3 new EM tiers per expac) - is worth developer time. Now, I am not saying do away with EM as Tucoh suggests.

Edit: I suppose Ngreth has created the pet mobs for the raid-level EM items that are later applied to group EM items minus new expac pets. However, we can surmise that any increase in pace among group EM items creates upward pressure.

Considering what other things dev time is devoted to, making appropriate pet upgrade paths seems pretty legit.

I was over with it after the first thread!

This is so true. I hope that all the dev's get busy with things like pet focus and such. So that we keep things like the potion belt and fade.

Too much dev free time leads to nerfing of things that we like.

This grievance makes about as much sense as the post about the level cap to the next expansion not being a high enough increase since 5 levels above 110 isn't as much of a change in ratio as going from 60 to 65. (50-60 was an outlier, obviously)

Trust me. I'm the guy on the forums asking about "Elemental Mastery staves" and more global chase loot. I like EMs at the current levels/strength so I am curious as to the direction we are headed in that department (e.g. if EM overinflates)

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq...burning-lands-chase-loot.251857/#post-3707123

Edit: Ngreth's "behind the scenes" explanations of pet earrings are in that thread.

I read absolutely nothing in this thread except the title...… I refuse to read anything in a thread with "lets get this over with" in the title. it needs to stop