Enforced Raid Rotation Discussion Thread

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Roshen, Jul 24, 2015.

  1. Shadva Del`Shai Augur

    Actually, when the server was announced, the old PnP was still in effect. IF I remember correctly, it wasn't until launch day or even shortly after that the PnP rules got eliminated. Also, the server was originally supposed to be a minimum of 6 months before vote about next expansion. That was the rule set people agreed to when they decided to play on the TLP server. DBG agreed AFTER server open to re-evaluate because of some very vocal players.

    My point is, things change. DBG seems to be trying to listen, learn, implement changes and fix things that are perceived as broken. They won't ever be able to make every player feel like it's all sunshine and glitter but, they seem to be making an effort to learn from mistakes and at least make it acceptable to the majority of the player base.
    Fallfyres, Rhiyannon and Batbener like this.
  2. Vaclav Augur

    PNP was dismantled during the Beta timeframe a few weeks prelaunch (2-3 weeks I'd guesstimate but too lazy) but yea, it was in place when the initial announcements were made.
    Rhiyannon likes this.
  3. Wiluven Journeyman


    Love your post. Well said!

    Haven't we all aged a good 15 more years by now? Grow the hell up and learn to play in the sandbox together.
    Shadva Del`Shai and Rhiyannon like this.
  4. MaestroM Augur

    Dear DBG,

    This is awesome. I'm really pumped that you guys care. This will certainly give the server the legs it needs to survive until....

    You instance it. There's a reason no one really wanted raid rotations. They're a pain in the to police. Even with enforcement there will still be toxic drama and cheating. Instancing requires virtually no maintenance or GM support, which is expensive. The outcomes from both are functionally equal. With a well designed and properly enforced raid rotation, guilds will have an unmolested shot at raid targets on a predictable schedule. enforced rotations are a gap-bridging solution. Instancing is still the best option for the future of Everquest novelty servers.

    I resubbed. I'm grinding as we speak. Take your time and instance it properly. <3

    Also. If staff can enforce a raid rotation, then staff can enforce a no-KS PNP. <3
  5. Elkay Augur

    Amen.
    Rhiyannon likes this.
  6. taliefer Augur


    they are never instancing this stuff, they have said on numerous occasions now the work is too intensive and they would have to stop work on other projects.
  7. MaestroM Augur

    I'm going to keep bringing it up until it either happens or my fingers fall off and I can't type anymore.

    Its not cost effective for TLP 3.0, no. But doing it now makes TLP 10 and Quarm a real possibility, which makes it seem like a drop in the bucket cost wise, which is more than worth it. The costs are high, but once instancing is done the costs can be spread out across many many more servers in the future. We could be doing this again in 20 years.
    Rhiyannon and Elkay like this.
  8. Hateseeker Augur

    What they need to do is work on instancing for Velious; that gives them a lot more time and less work (they wouldn't have to do Classic or Kunark).

    And they have mentioned the idea of TLP4; this issue isn't going away for that, either. The sooner they do it, the more cost-beneficial it is as it can be ready in time for TLP 4, instead of waiting til TLP 6 to get the hint that the "team's strong feelings" and the community conflict.

    Best case scenario that keeps people willing to come back, is they don't instance Classic or Kunark to be fair to the ones who truly want that, and they do add instances for Velious/Luclin/PoP. People will be a lot more willing to come back to TLP4 if they know that instancing is ready for Velious and beyond. Heck, maybe even start instancing with Luclin, but cap Classic/Kunark/Velious at 4 months each so we get there in 12 months. They definitely need to instance PoP, as that was the beginning of the most egregious content blocking (to block keying).
    Rhiyannon, Elkay and MaestroM like this.
  9. Elkay Augur

    Look at your signature quote, then tell me what the decision of this thread says about it.

    "Never" is a strong word that seldom sticks.
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  10. Vaclav Augur


    Eh, with appropriate coding they could be reused for Live as well - anniversary content, monster missions, or whatever.
    Rhiyannon, MaestroM and Elkay like this.
  11. taliefer Augur


    casual guilds arent getting in to these rotations. if casual guilds get in, you would have rotations 7+ guilds long, and noone is going for that,
    Rhiyannon likes this.
  12. Hateseeker Augur

    Here's where the definition of casual becomes extremely important...and last I checked, Holly Longdale has remained silent on providing such a definition.
    Fallfyres likes this.
  13. MaestroM Augur

    What's going to keep them out? If they can kill naggy then.... ?
    Barton and Elkay like this.
  14. Vaclav Augur


    Eh, if you read the initial phrasing the scope he chose to phrase it as was "guilds" not "high playtime guilds", "hardcore guilds", "guilds currently doing this content".

    Assuming what the scope is currently is presumptuous ATM.
    Rhiyannon and Barton like this.
  15. Elkay Augur

    And those capable guilds will petition a Guide, and a Guide will say they deserve a spot.

    Maybe DBG will be forced to finally realize that there are too many raid-capable players for too little raid content.
    Rhiyannon, Barton and Sebbun like this.
  16. taliefer Augur


    one could hope, but they arent going to have instances ready soon, assuming they decide to drop everything and do it (theyve stated thats what it would take)

    how many guilds in a rotation before people just stop playing? 7? 10? content gets thin quick in a rotation.

    not tryin to be negative,these are valid issues imo.
    Elkay likes this.
  17. Silentchaos Augur

    I will happily spend another few months being bored to death farming Everquest's Monumental 21st Expansion The Darkened Sea™ if we could get instanced TLP raid content.
    Rhiyannon likes this.
  18. MaestroM Augur

    Well I imagine if there are 10 guilds in the rotation that would mean 6-7 guilds worth of people that might have quit but now stayed, or that left but came back (like me).

    So even if you lose a few from the top 1-2 guilds, the bottom will pick up the slack.

    To be honest, I think of all of the possible solutions, enforced raid rotations is the least desirable. Not from my perspective. I will get more loot under a force rot than I would without one (some loot vs. no loot).

    However, rotations take away content from one group and give it to another. I'm not thrilled about this kind of system even though it benefits me. It assumes that content must be artificially and arbitrarily limited, which I think is a stupid assumption.

    Instancing with 1 week lockouts and leave the world spawns where they are would have , literally, made everyone happy.
    Rhiyannon and Elkay like this.
  19. Lateryn Augur

    I agree on your two worries.
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  20. Elkay Augur

    /nod

    I (along with some other forum members) try to bring up easily foreseeable issues before they become catastrophes.

    I'm not sure what a good solution is without adding expeditions. I wouldn't recommend more servers, as I see that as yet another band-aid. That will draw hard lines between the communities that expeditions won't do, and will require unnecessary re-mergers down the road. Expeditions will keep a healthy population longer.
    Rhiyannon likes this.