Enchanters will now feel the DoT nerfs

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by mmats, Jun 12, 2018.

  1. Cleaver Augur

    We need adds that will instant wipe AE the raid if they're not mezzed within 1s of being active. :rolleyes:

    No one remember this post when they add this to a raid in the future.
  2. moogs Augur

    The dots will obviously retain their ridiculously massive aggro numbers post-nerf.
    Fadyena likes this.
  3. Cailen New Member

    In all seriousness there is ONE I repeat ONE raid in ROS where my guild uses mezz and it's one mob. Every DPS class in the game can out DPS me if they know how to play their class, the people whining nerf so and so and so and so cant play their damn class.
    shame Lock and Rolaque like this.
  4. Cailen New Member

    This event basically already exists: Silverwing and Xygoz
  5. Numzan Augur

    I really hate coming to the vet forums... You know why? all i have heard from years and years is character nerfs. Its really depressing when all these devs do is nerf the game after 20 yrs. What gives? work on the game itself, maybe a new engine but leave people alone. Enchanter nerfs now? then back re nerfing other classes? It makes no sense to me and it is the dang summer time when we lose so many numbers. Chances are you will be down to a handful left to recruit from after this nerf. Sorry i see it coming every time. I stopped playing on Live due to the old Mage nerf, its depressing.
    Rolaque likes this.
  6. Sindaiann Augur

    Do you know what would be nice? If the devs listened to us pre-nerf on Mind line the first time. We told them the mana return was insane and they left it. Then they nerf it the first time and we tell them they did it wrong and its still OP, guess what? Didn't listen.

    The worst part in all this is the 9sec recast delay, that absolutely neuters us on all events. You already destroyed the mana return to make it not even break even, explain the reasoning behind adding the recast delay of 9secs? There is none because if you had of left it as is, the mana usage is such that we still would of had to be careful on events where we could "dot the sh*t out of everything."

    This equates to about a 60k DPS loss as is on a single mob. Multiple mob DPS potential will be much worse.

    For the record - there isn't one single event in RoS where you HAVE TO MEZZ.

    Empire chokodai stun?? Don't even see them if you kill fast enough.
    Gorowyn forge elementals? Again don't see them if you kill fast enough and again can be tanked without issue.
    Basilisks on Hoshkar - could just tank and kill.
    Silverwing and Xygoz - certainly DO NOT HAVE TO MEZZ - you can easily just tank the guardian of xygoz and keep it within leash range of Xygoz and kill it.

    EOK?

    T1 - Gore? stun lock + mezz drakes to down them on Gore. Droga nothing
    T2 - Prince - adds stunnable. Queen - psycophants charmable. Vault - Nodda
    T3 - KarZok - notta. Dragon - Mezz/Root/Charm mobs for CC cheev (don't have to) Vault - CC room vs adds(most crucial)

    Outside of T3E3 no CC matters in EoK.

    TBM?

    Vim and Vigor? Nope.
    Wither and Decay? Nope
    Lady of Life? Nope.
    Damsel of Decay - root bokon (big whoop)
    Akkapan - stun lock massive trash ae pull....yay!
    Grummus? Nope.
    Emollious? Nope.
    Grannus? Mezz ooze....yay!
    High Bokon? Nope
    Anashti Sul? Nope


    TDS?

    Arx1 - nope
    1off - yes (most meaningful event from TDS thru ROS)
    Balance of Power - some CC
    Vicarium Nomia - stun skelly adds!! yay
    Indagatrix Lucia - stun a mob or 3, charm a mob. big whoop
    Calix? Nope


    The part I can never understand with these devs is we see the same YoYo crap every expansion.

    • Test and implement raids with all class potential.
    • Raids get completed by Top 5 and class nerfs start
    • Eventually event nerfs occur, massively
    • More class nerfs occur
    Do they really think this helps the lesser guilds beat events? How about just tuning other classes to the potential you think they should be and tuning events around consistent class balance? You know make raids harder????

    Did enchanters need nerf'd from a dps standpoint? A lot would say yes. The mana return certainly did need it, but are we going to get any role other than DPS/ADPS anytime soon because we haven't had one in forever?

    SMDH
  7. Cailen New Member

    you're right don't HAVE to mezz guardian, but it's way easier. it's the one event I mezz something so don't let my tanks see this ;)
  8. eqgamer Augur

    I must admit it’s been real nice. I suppose now it’s back to nukes, at least for my groups. Silver lining for me is this now will “force” me to keep one or two other spells up.
  9. ~Mills~ Augur

    This has to hurt and no one likes to be nerfed but come on man with those claiming they are gonna quit or this is the last straw for them. You knew this was coming the minute he made the changes to mind storm, everyone's reaction had to be is he serious, he has no clue what hes doing but holy gravy train. Never mind when he doubled down on the stupid with Tempest tuning for RoS.

    The damage post nerf on tempest is probably still to high but at least its reasonable now unless he leaves the recast timer which to me is the part that is insane. If I were you guys I would be lobbying to get the recast removed or cut in half, as this is a really stupid addition he added to penalize you guys for his prior mistakes. And be working to get the mana part more in line with fair to how it was prior to the changes but not so that you have a free dot after 20 seconds.
  10. bigpapa Elder

    again why nerfing raid problem AND group game?

    shm and druid dots in raid with many support here and there could had a lot more dps, I don't know why DB nerfed the group game as well.

    same will be with chanter , can you separate raid environment and group game please..........

    you just had to make raid mobs mitigate some of the higher dot,s shm , druid, chanter had ( got ).

    so the group game would not be affected o_O
  11. Sindaiann Augur

    They don't listen or learn from past mistakes. It's like talking to a wall
    Slippry likes this.
  12. ~Mills~ Augur

    The group game was just as bad. This was a 30k dps dot that could be spammed on endless targets actually returning mana to the enchanter after 20 seconds duration.

    I've said this for 2 years now for every single revamped dot class and continue to say it for upcoming dots to be revamped. NO CLASS SHOULD HAVE A DOT THAT IS OVER 15K IN BASE DAMAGE WITH HOW DOTS WORK. There are exceptions for this such as recast timers, flagged for specific mobs like plant, group or summoned but thats a general rule based on tuning in game at this time.

    Druids, shaman and enchanters should all have gotten dots below 15k base damage. Rangers and beastlords should not have seen anything over 10k. All of this give and take and then piss people off could have been avoided if he listened.

    Necromancers should see 1 maybe 2 dots in the 12-14k range and then the rest need all be below 8k except for their doom dot and possibly group swift dots.
  13. EnchFWO Augur

    Can't wait till next expansion where every raid event needs CC but all the Enchanters already took off :cool:

    Of all, the recast timer is ridiculous. This should not have been added. The rest is kindof w/e at this point. I'm honestly surprised it took this long to happen with all the DPS hate that was going on.
    Verily Tjark likes this.
  14. Scornfire Lorekeeper


    Swift DoT boost or swarm pet boost (Which I personally don't feel is neccessary) is the way to go if you're after better group DPS for Necros, having normal DoTs with that high of base Damage would be nuts considering how powerful we already are on raids, which is why the revamps stopped
  15. SonOfABiscuit Elder

    So unnecessary. Another account goes by the wayside I guess.
  16. ~Mills~ Augur

    Revamps have not stopped. The necro CRT who knows more than anyone else comfirmed as much just yesterday. Aristo basically never responds on the boards, he does his thing in silence. So its a matter of when not if, and more importantly how. Aristo keeps repeating the same mistakes by giving people massive base damage dots so I don't want anything like he has done for anyone else or its just going to lead to unneeded trouble for the class like recast timers or something else stupid when in reality he just needed to tune the base dots better.

    Quite a few have very intelligently laid out plans that reduce the debuff cap problem, slightly ramp us up faster to help with trash and in the group game more but that leave us relative to about where we fall now in raids. Less the debuff cap problem most raid necros have and moving more of our total damage done to useful instead of a lot essentially being parse padding when it ticks away on locked mobs or when the critical dps aspect of the raid is being handled elsewhere.



  17. Rolaque Elder

    Apparently it's not just the offending priest and hybrid classes who dare to intrude into the realm of the dps gods, and must be put in their proper place. Now that one of the sacred intelligence casters have been touched, it's time we consider the real culprits. Seems to me the pure melee are behind all of these shenanigans.
  18. Scornfire Lorekeeper


    I'd call a year+ pause a stoppage, regardless whether or not it's still being looked at. Definitely agreed there, granted I feel we're in a perfectly fine place with our DoTs the way they currently are and don't require any tuning at all.

    I'd be curious of any method that would migrate or hibernate DoTs during HP locks, though to call a lot of our DPS parse padding is a pretty gross misrepresentation (Unless your Guild is struggling to keep adds down/balance Bosses at the end of choice events). Don't really feel like we need to be Gods at every single thing, our sustained DPS is miles better than anyone else's, we can still contribute on Trash at a pretty reasonable rate just nuking/procing FTV and DoTing secondary (Non MA) targets, especially if your team is co-ordinating alliance casts on trash mobs. Outside of wanting more debuff slots I just don't see the problem frankly
  19. moogs Augur

    Besides nerfing AE mez when a class community representative didn't know what they were talking about...

    Charm nerfs, rune nerfs, aDPS nerfs, and now this. Nobody needs enchanters except for those of who don't have tanks because tanks can tank like 10 things at a time in current content.
  20. ~Mills~ Augur

    It is only nuts if he continues on with the template he has used for every other dot revamp so far, because that template is severely flawed and never should have been used for anyone. You can't roll prior versions base damage into current versions base damage and then add a bonus on top of that for anything over 15k and expect it to work. Especially when many of these classes were not even using these older lines due to stacking issues or since dots are supplemental to them and they were using nukes or skill based spells instead.

    Necros already have 15k in base power from a few lines that they actually use, its just spread out over 3-4 casts for those lines. If he was to reduce that to 1 cast all he needs to do to offset that is reduce our overall dot stack power to account for the shift forward. He did none of this with anyone elses dots he just massively increased their dots to levels that do not match current tuning for other forms of dps. With current level dps from melee and nukes, and with how dots work no on demand castable dot should be over 15k in base power and any increase that shifts casting forward needs to be accounted for in overall dot stack power.
    Beimeith likes this.

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