DoT Revamp

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Hadesborne, Feb 17, 2019.

  1. Forcallen Augur

    Had a feeling that was the case. Hell after he didn't do it post EoK beta as promised all the warning signs were there it wasn't happening or at least happening based on feedback to prevent previous mistakes. Basically how you are now is how it will be when the game ends, they just don't have time for anything with the current state of things. Reason I was so vocal about some recent nerfs.

    But you still can't sell me on the fact that they did 50 other things instead in the past past 3 years. We didn't need chat tabs, we didn't need faction windows, many game changes/nerfs that were more pet peeves instead of OP broken and tons of other stuff at the expense of less AA, less spell time and revamping necromancers dots to reasonable again sometime in the past 3 years with the debuff cap being what it is. And while its out of many peoples day to day stuff it could have been tackled as a team to get it done before we were down to skeleton crew we have now that wasn't the cast 2-3 years ago.
  2. Ryak Augur

    I had a suggestion awhile ago that would be immediately doable and would at a minimum be a big step towards improving this issue.

    Reduce the base duration of every necromancer DoT in the game by 33-50% while keeping the total damage the same.

    What is the effect of this, you ask?
    • in a long fight, EXTREMELY MINIMAL DPS DIFFERENCE!
    • NO MORE MULTI BAR MEMING because your spells would wear off faster
    • MUCH REDUCED DEBUFF CAP problems!

    I will admit, this would increase the ramp up of Necro dps and overall dps a little. But I even proposed capping the necromancer 2.0 focus at level 80 to compensate for the fact which i know the devs want to do badly. EVERYBODY WINS!
    menown likes this.
  3. ShadowMan Augur

    That is still basically the same amount of work they don't have time for. Someone would have to adjust each dot and each rank reducing its duration and increasing its damage.

    Dzarn is the only one who holds the simple work around fix card in his hands with lingering death. He could set each dot durations, 12, 18, 30, 42, etc, bonus damage and duration reduction as needed by just changing that AA line. Making it so spamming 10 or so 30s base dots, though they might not last that anymore, with dooms the best bet stopping the 18 plus dot lineups, debuff cap need and 4 spell set madness.

    But considering Dzarns viewpoint on the game or necros in general from his track record the last few years it is a very risky roll of the dice. Considering what the reasons for necro changes have been with how zerkers and sk's have rolled around under his adjustments.
  4. Machentoo Augur


    They are never going to say, "We aren't going to do it." It puts them in a box and if they change their mind down the road, people are up in arms.

    But, complete silence on the issue for a length of time greater than it took them to do the revamps for every other class combined is the next closest thing.
  5. Machentoo Augur


    This would not actually be a minimal dps difference. With synergies, it could actually result in a quite large dps boost during burns--much faster ramp up. And even outside of burns, cycling 8 of your highest damage dots repeatedly would do considerably more dps than cycling 8 highest damage dots and your 8 mediocre damage dots and your 8 lower damage dots before they all start to wear off and you begin the cycle again.
  6. menown Augur

    First of all, I believe that it is crucial for Necros to gain a large DPS boost during a 60-90 sec burn. Currently, it takes me about 90 seconds to just get all my DoTs cast. This means that max dps potential of a necro in the group game and some raids is impossible.

    Even a 50% reduction in duration would make the necros best DoT still take 90 seconds to do full damage.

    A DoT revamp and consolidation is definitely needed. But I wholeheartedly agree with Ryak's sentiment. DoT durations are too long. If DoTs are consolidated down to only 8 lines, that would still leave down time between refreshes.

    This can be solved in 2 different ways. (1) Shorten DoT duration and compensate lost DoT ticks with an increase in base damage, and (2) introduce new coding to allow DoT ticks to take shorter intervals than 6 sec ticks. The first suggestion would just add more time needed for the spell dev to do a DoT revamp. The latter would shovel some of the chore off onto coders. If coders do it right, then they could set interval DoT ticks to be 2s, 3s, 4s, etc. depending on the situation. This would also give Aristo more options in the future.

    I did talk with a coder about this idea, and they said it would take a long time to do a code like this. So I still don't have any hopes for this change to happen.
  7. Machentoo Augur


    On which TLP are you referring to? Even on Phinny today it doesn't take 90 seconds, so I will imagine you aren't talking about the TLP's. In which case this isn't the right forum to argue your case.
  8. BlueberryWerewolf Augur

    DoTs hitting on shorter intervals between ticks might have unintended consequences as well.
  9. Ryak Augur

    I suspect shortening DoT ticks is probably not likely to happen. The entire point of the proposal is to make it as easy as possible while preserving balance as much as possible and obviously solving the problems as much as possible.

    I believe the easiest and therefore most likely to actually happen solution is to simply halve the number of ticks the DoTs last while doubling the per-tick damage.

    For odd numbers of ticks, just maintain the old damage/tick ratio based on the new number of ticks.

    I should point out, simply making this change effectively nerfs DoT duration foci because they require a minimum duration. I would still support it because solving these problems is so much more important than basically anything...

    Even stuff like capping the epic focus, (which if it was changed on its own would piss off a lot of people), I guarentee you people would look at the overall package with duration halving and say, "yep, this way is better".
  10. javiere New Member

    Any necromancer EVER complaining about 2.0 getting a level cap like all the other focii - stuck wearing it for 12 years just ******* - if it coincided with dot amalgamation it would be laughed at. Some people while whine, it's what whiners do, but it's actually an improvement to the class if those come as a pairing.
  11. Tros New Member

    Mangler Necro pop is just fine, check solb and Rathe...oh wait all 50 of those are the same person. Nevermind me go back to your conversation.
  12. Ryak Augur

    Yes, that is the point! (besides also being relatively easy to implement)

    Do it! Halve all Dot Durations instead of trying a big complicated "traditional" revamp!
  13. taliefer Augur

    why is it so much harder to consolidate the necro fire dot line like they did druid and shaman dots? that seems like a fairly straight forward thing to do at the very least

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