Do procs & luck cause lag?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Evye, Jan 12, 2021.

  1. Evye Augur

    I read on here procs and luck cause lag?

    Would it help limiting everyone to 1 proc and then just having a stat that adds flat proc dmg?
    instead of having 10 different augs that proc you would have an innate SINGLE proc ability
    and the augs that add different procs just be retooled to add dmg to the proc?

    So on a raid instead of idk 1000 procs calculated per round you would have 52?
  2. Slasher Augur

    pets and swarm pets cause massive amounts of lag. EQ doesn't really suffer from graphics lag its when you /log you get massive amounts of it if you dont filter the damage other people are doing out. Some people lag some dont though.
  3. Jhenna_BB Proudly Prestigious Pointed Purveyor of Pincusions

    All the procs probably don't help - the shear volume of procs available to players seems to coincide with the lag issues of 2020-21.

    A lot of people with a better understanding than I have of how databases work point to the real culprit being just that - poor database systems that cause rogue queries that spin out of control.

    Two potential database hogs have been added to EQ in the time frame: Overseer and Dragon's Hoard. The opinion is that a large share of the blame pie should go to those two things.
  4. Benito EQ Player since 2001.

    While I have no doubt calculations are causing raid lag, Daybreak suffers from systemwide (portfolio-wide) lag and outages. EQ2 and Planetside 2 suffers from many of the same problems. EQ2 raid calculations run in the billions and trillions of numbers with the same report of lag.

    Before going crazy on procs and changing game design with unintended consequences, I'd like to know what is being done systemwide.

    *This is an academic opinion and not personal attack on folks who firmly believe in EQ1 raid-specific lag.
    Skuz likes this.
  5. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Every proc takes a check to see if it fires as well as every action that can trigger luck so those actions do add up.

    As for the suggestion of a single proc you end up with an all or nothing situation where if it is resisted you don't get any damage but if you had multiple procs each one has a chance of landing and they can be different resist types so some could have a better chance of landing than others.
    Skuz and minimind like this.
  6. Evye Augur

    You all bring up very fair points!
    I was just thinking out loud with likeminded folks =)
  7. Lisard Augur

    everything you do, from the moment you log in the server has to calculate it. the more of anything you have the more calculations, multiply that by the population
  8. Windance Augur

    The opinion of who ?

    I don't really see Overseer as a problem. Very little interaction.

    Dragon's Hoard - Maybe , but adding an extra 100 item checks to the few people who are using it is unlikely.

    NPC/Pet path calculations on raids with 50+ people with 1/3 of those using spam pets ...

    You can see this in action if you go to an easy zone line grounds and pull 40+ mobs at once. Things start rubber banding.
    Waring_McMarrin and Tatanka like this.
  9. Mazame Augur

    Sure blame pets that the go to for everything, it the pets faults.

    If they knew what the cause of the lag was I am sure they would fix it. I heard a number of things:
    Pets, Swarm pets (yet I don't lag with pets, those that due try /hide pets in the options.)
    Proc's / Logs (when I had lag issue people said to turn log off but it didn't fix my lag)

    What fix most of my lag issue was Metanis post

    I went for an old computer to a new computer and still had lag until I used the setting he out lined.
    I then went back to my old computer change the setting and it work removing all of the lag on my side of the game.

    As for the server side lag I don't know that you can point it to any one cause. They tried a number of fixes and have not been able to pin point the cause. How ever jump to conclusions could lead to things that are changes that you may latter regret. So before we blame Proc / pets / overseer or what ever flavor of the month is for blaming how about we take a step back and them them investigate.
  10. Skuz Berserker Logic: Kill everything.

    Logically every single calculation the servers need to make has a contribution to game performance or the lack thereof.

    Pathing & combat being the big resource hogs, the more things that are needed to be calculated in real time the bigger the draw on the server processors.

    Can blame pretty much everything that changes state in real time.

    The lag is the difference between what the processing on the servers are realistically expected to be able to manage & what they actually are managing. AKA the servers are fast enough but the hardware limitations are not the reason for the poor performance, something about the game code is throttling performance - perhaps more calculations than what are needed are taking place, some calculations are looping back on themselves instead of resolving correctly, or some of the functions to perform calculations are breaking down & causing bad data.

    I'm no coder so I'm just guessing here but the hardware was upgraded already quite a bit so that shouldn't be the issue, the code is likely where these lag issues are arising but finding the cause is likely highly complex and while it is entirely possible there is only one code change needed to fix it, more likely there are many things needed to be changed.

    Long term there might be some need to pare back the processor load by reducing the plethora of things calculated in real time but I suspect that isn't really the issue here.
  11. Beimeith Lord of the Game

    There are several different kinds of issues that people refer to as "lag."

    Computer lag is when your computer isn't fast enough to render the game. This can be CPU or GPU but also logging if you have a slow hard drive, have a VERY large log file (>1GB) and/or you are using an SSD without turning on /loginterval 1.

    Network lag (latency) is when there is a larger than normal delay between your computer talking to the server/world. This you can see via F11. This can be caused by DDoS against Daybreak or your ISP, an outage anywhere between your ISP and the Server, or just congestion if too many people are on the line.

    Zone lag is when the zone you are in is lagging. Swarming causes this. Massive numbers of procs cause this but also AEs (heals/nukes/melee) cause this as well.

    Server/world lag is when the entire server is lagging. Lots of people logging into the game at once like new server launch or after a patch cause this. Lots of players just being online all at once (new TLPs with a few thousand of people) cause this. Achievements seem to cause it as well like when you log in an old character and get a huge autogrant or when an entire raid gets hundreds of achievements at once. (Achievements might be zone lag and not server, I'm not positive about that one).

    Anyway it's a complicated thing.
    Sancus, Skuz and Sokki like this.
  12. Leigo You come here often?

    Can't speak for overseer, but DH only sends a DB check when you open it. It's the whole point of the hoard. The item's in it are not checked with your character data every time you zone or quiry the DB with other actions.
    Syylke_EMarr, Skuz, minimind and 2 others like this.
  13. Svann2 The Magnificent

    I dont think COV has any mechanic that is different than TOV, yet the lag is as different as night and day. My guess is something has changed in the way the server code operates.
  14. DeadRagarr Journeyman

    Any change to your damage will cause calculations. Including % modifiers.
  15. Sobmre Augur

    It's Probably some sort of log files not being cleared lagging the servers down as they increase to massive sizes
  16. Maedhros High King

    I know I had previously set the entire everquest folder as an exclusion from windows defender, but looking again today, it is no longer set and resisting my attempts to reset it as an exclusion.
  17. Maedhros High King

    Hmm nevermind, found it in the registry, just not displaying on the normal exclusion spot.
  18. Kaenneth [You require Gold access to view this title]

    There has been an abandoned/bugged "XXX's Ward" healer swarm pet in in Luclin COV West Wastes chain casting an AE heal for over a week. I'm sure that doesn't help.
    Tucoh likes this.
  19. Tucoh Augur

    There are so many procs and marginal swarm pets they could be deleted and replaced with basic stat boosts like +healing, +spell damage, +attack and it'd be a neutral change while dramatically reducing the processing cost of player actions.
    Syylke_EMarr, Evye and Barton like this.
  20. Kaenneth [You require Gold access to view this title]

    What I bet would help a ton is if all common auras were made like shaman wolf aura, which I *think* just skips the range check and works all the time (unless it's just set to a really big range)

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