Do away with "No Trade"

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Wyre Wintermute, Oct 6, 2014.

  1. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    ...and shift items to Heirloom similar to FV rules (IE: epics, specific rewards, claims, etc...)

    What is the big difference from killing mob X with toon Y and logging toon Z to loot?

    For raiders...
    It allows them to play their main toon on a raid and "buy" rot loot for an alt or pass down old items (not class-speific armor).

    YOU, the player, still completed the content to obtain said item.

    The possible drawbacks:
    impact on crafted armor/weapons (I'm expecting to draw fire from that crowd)
    Decreased market for tradeable items

    Just tossing out an idea for discussion... There are positives and negatives either way.
  2. Khat_Nip Meow

    There is absolutely no way to justify having something this absurd be common to all servers.
    There's a server for that and I think the majority would rather it stay there.
    Elricvonclief, Yinla, Sheex and 2 others like this.
  3. iniari-TR Augur

    it will never happen , and would be an extremely bad idea.

    if all servers had the FV rules its would unbalance the game. not to mention cause prices of everything to skyrocket even faster then they are already.

    most guilds allow alts to log in and loot rot raid gear already.
  4. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    It isn't FV rules. FV is completely tradable. This would just be transferable within a given account.
  5. Shang Augur

    I'd level up another Ranger on my account, transfer my gear to him, and increase my loot flow.

    Aka I'd exploit this feature and it shouldn't be put in.
    Fenudir likes this.
  6. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    While I was attempting to "move away" from the concept of class-restricted armor.. I have to agree.

    One oversight was the ability to load up another character and raid the content on a diff toon, trade gear, rinse and repeat.

    However, what if the timeframe of heirloom was limited. I know EQ2 has a tag that allows an item to be traded to anyone present fir up to 2(4?) hours.

    If a drop could be transfered within a single account, up to X hours after being looted before reverting to No Trade, that would negate said "exploit".
  7. Noirfu Augur

    I think the whole idea of heirloom is a dumb one. Why should alts on the same account get preferential treatment over those for which we pay their own subscription?
    Yinla likes this.
  8. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    I believe, the concept is that the majority of people have one account. Having multiple accounts has become more prevalent as internet access has become easier/faster and as population has dwindled.

    It would be nice to have accounts "linked" to a single owner. The seperation of the SC wallet has been a sore spot since they added it...
  9. Garshok Augur

    Which is going to then create hassles with raiders claiming that the item is for them - and alts getting gear faster than lower dkp mains, or having to pay more to outbid for an item. Because regardless of guild rules, there will be some skunks who will want/be willing to cheat. No thanks - I see enough guild drama as it is.

    I don't see as much impact on crafted armor- raid armor is typically class-restricted even if my old SK armor was heirloom . . . how many folks have multiple toons of the same class on an account? Less restrictions on weapons, but again - think impact would be pretty limited.

    Tradable items much more impact; hell, I can see myself xferring alts to my main's account every couple of months (as free SC built up) to get raid items.

    This could result in a dynamic where raiders use bazaar less overall to get gear for alts (same or different accounts), while groupers likely will use it at about the same rate - further increasing the benefit or 'payoff' for raiding play styles vs, grouping play styles. Even though I am a raider, I understand that that play style isn't viable for a lot of folks, and see no reason to further advantage/disadvantage one over the other.

    Sorry, count me firmly against Candy Land here.
  10. Repthor Augur

    instances dont lock anymore guys if u want something on your alts after th instance is completed go for the item u want log on your alt getr a dz add u dont get currency for the win but the instances are open to add as many alts as u want. theres no need for this herloom thing
  11. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    It isn't specifically targeted at raids/raiders. The concept, overall, was merely to reduce the arbitrary requirement to log out, log in a different toon, run them to the corpse, and loot an item. I mentioned passing old items down in the OP, but Shang pointed out something I overlooked while posting at 0 dark 30....

    It isn't meant to be "candy land." It is meant to remove an arbitrary series of events.
  12. Axxius Augur

    But nothing prevents you from transferring the character to another account. Or to FV on the same account. And then selling all your old gear.

    In essence, you want all items on regular servers to become sellable. Nice try.
  13. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    Actually.. no I don't nor have I ever had a character on FV.

    I clearly stated the intent.. which was to no have to:
    log out, log in a different toon, run them to the corpse, and loot an item

    Which.. in your scenario.. I can do right now anyway.. then transfer to FV and sell them, thus making it so "all items on regular servers to become sellable" Nice try.
  14. Axxius Augur

    Are you in a raiding guild? Does your guild give away loot for free? In all guilds I know, you either have to pay DKP for your loot, or there is a merit loot system that absolutely will not allow you to grab loot on your alts ahead of mains. And even when you are allowed to loot things for your alts (i.e. after paying DKP or when no mains want them), it typically comes at the cost to your main: you have less DKP or more loot hits and may not get the things you want for your main.

    Your proposal allows selling your old gear which is just 1 tier under the best in game. For example, I'm close to finishing my CotF T2 raid set right now. If my gear was Heirloom, I could have a CotF T1 raid set for sale on FV right now. Cha-ching! :)

    Just say No.
  15. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    First... Get off your ego trip.

    Am I a raider now? No. I have been, in several MMO's. Thanks though.. I toooootally forgot there is something called DKP.

    If you took any semblance of time to read the thread, you would have seen that Shang pointed this out.. ohh... 10 hours ago? I acknowledged and agreed that It was an oversight in my OP and that it would be limited to freshly dropped/looted items, not turning all items into heirloom permanently.


    Sorry if you couldn't be bothered to read the other posts in the thread before blowing an elitist gasket.. but SOE nixed the ability to edit older posts.
  16. Mysl Augur

    Isn't Solteris has a form of passing raid gear around? The limiting factor on that one is the receiving toon has to be flagged.

    When you won an event, you got a certain amount of raid currency, you could then bought the visible armor from the raid vendor. The raid currency are tradeable, and you can do a sell-back of your old gear, with a discount. People whoes toons were flagged for the piece, but did not won that during their raids can buy the currency in bazzar and got the pieces they wanted.
  17. Wyre Wintermute I'm just a butterly dreaming I'm a man

    Pretty much this.. just for things that aren't vendor loot specific... or simply that drop and would otherwise rot. Be it raid or group level items. The essence of the mechanic exists, I was merely trying to figure a way to apply it to the dropped items as well.
  18. Rogue Augur

    I'd support them making all gear from 2 or 3 expansions ago and back fully tradeable. Update it as a new expansions comes out. Why not?
    silku likes this.
  19. Dre. Augur

    I wouldn't have a problem with older loot becoming Heirloom, maybe 2-4 expansions back, like the autogrant/flagging unlock system, or anything lower than whatever the req level on T1 gear is.

    For current or even recent content, those items are still desirable. If a character that has to do progression/flagging/factioning in order to score gear, making current gear Heirloom would bypass the timesink for alts and cause unneccessary competition for items. This is compounded by the current prevalance of ALL/ALL drops for everything, and I gotta imagine that aug camps would be particularly ugly.

    Making group/raid currency tradeable would be another approach. Plenty of threads on this though.
    Aanuvane likes this.
  20. Garshok Augur

    Understand that it may not be intended to be candy land, but I can see it having lots of problems.

    1) The only way to have it limited to the function you are describing is if items are coded so that they are heirloom for, say, 6 hours after they are looted and then they become no-trade.I can see that as a lot of coding. Else if you make them permanently heirloom you are going to have all sorts of toons passing stuff to their alts as soon as they upgrade and/or flooding FV

    2) in addition, assuming that they get the above coded, you are still setting up a situation where mains in a raid will be able to bid or otherwise obtain something that the guild intends for them, but that he or she is instead going to pass to an alt. Guild may have rules against it, but there are likely halflings in almost every guild who will try that.

    I don't like the idea of #2 happening, but [putting on optimist's hat] let's assume that it will be small.

    I can see #1 taking a lot of work. Given SOE's very limited resources, is that what we want them to chew up their time with?