Distillate Potions gone till PoR?

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Nuggziee, May 16, 2018.

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  1. Krezzy Augur

    @Darchon_Xegony: Your potion list seems off. For example, the recipe replaced by Distillate of Alacrity X is the Potion of Graveyard Dust, which has 65% haste for 108 seconds.
  2. taliefer Augur

    Those potions are useless at any era in EQ, no wonder alchemy was revamped.

    Good thing we are regressing EQ on the progression server
    Risiko and Uumdano like this.
  3. trollivesmatter Journeyman

    It was a mistake in the sense that there were craftable potions in this era. That there was a TS path for alchemy in this era. By simply removing all recipes and not replacing them with the former in era recipes, yes yes yes it was a mistake. Judging by previous posts by Ngreth in the first couple pages of this thread it was a complete oversight. A mistake or not, call it what you want.

    Give up on the 'out of era' arguement already. The TLP servers are not some purist era experience. Far from it. This ongoing, random, selective witch hunt for era fixes is ridiculous. This 'fix' is just another example of the purist police running amock screaming out of era, and removing things without considering anything but a calendar date. Poorly thought through or not at all.

    They expansion locked some clarity distillate recipes to luclin was it? a couple weeks ago. Why not remove the celestial healing pots the same way, by linking them to PoR, and leave the other stuff alone?

    That would have removed the OP heal potions, left the other potions that are nothing but a convenience to some peoples play styles alone, left shaman to raise their alchemy as they saw fit, and not appeared ( although we've been reassured it isn't the case ) to be a storebought potion push. Also completely avoided the need to even consider removing those, to appease the people screaming about that, right or wrong.

    If you're so upset having those potions available to other people who perhaps enjoy having them, you could always just not use them. Some people do enjoy playing EQ solo with clarity or haste potions. They also sub to the game and help keep the servers going.

    Personally they are something I used mainly after a res to speed up a recovery. You regen mana too fast after a res, that extra 9/tick is out of era! Oh the horror! Not exactly a game breaker, but yes, it's irritating to have small conveniences removed after having had them for what seems like forever. For what? Med slower, kill slower, xp slower, sit around and stare at your screen waiting a little more often. Way to improve gameplay DB. When I think about why I love EQ I'm sorry but the downtime is not what comes to mind.
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  4. GeauxTigers Elder

    You're not wrong, the issue is this isn't a debate. They make decisions and then seem to refuse to revert them. The only cases i've seen on TLP is when it's an actual mistake. The potions were removed intentionally, for whatever reason. If these topics were open to debate they would get this type of feedback before making the change and your argument would stand a chance. I just seriously doubt anything anyone says at this point will get it reverted.

    Will we get original pots? Maybe.

    Were they changed originally because they were basically trash? Definitely.

    Are they going to keep making changes to make TLP's more 'classic'? Probably.

    Are they shooting themselves in the foot? Yes, without a doubt in my mind.
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  5. Uumdano Augur

    One wonders how often a company can do this and still thrive. Apparently it s as often as they like w/ SoE and DBG. I for one have not played since Wed, I am finding other things to do, look at other options to spend my money on.

    So many good suggestions on what seem to be more reasonable and simpler solutions, I suppose I am holding out hope that this company will see the light. Good posts on both sides of the argument, I sure hope this can set a precedent for future changes such as not making them without thoroughly thinking them through or even bouncing them off the player base for feedback.
    Krezzy likes this.
  6. HoodenShuklak Augur

    Hard to argue dbg is thriving tbh. Thriving companies don't typically have massive layoffs.
  7. GeauxTigers Elder


    I'm just not sure if it's rose colored glasses or what. If nostalgia is the goal, potions that don't stack and were basically never made or used is not going to help. The old potions had major issues. They did not stack with basically anything else of the same line (regen, str, dex, slow, etc) and the materials were out of the way and annoying to farm. When they launched/announced the new potions it gave a great way to max out alchemy and also a useful product.

    The origin of rose colored glasses comes from chickens, they'd put tiny pairs on them so they couldn't see what was happening to the other chickens. If that's not irony I don't know what is.
  8. discordkitty Augur

    Those layoffs were for other IPs and had nothing to do with EQ from the information I've read online regarding them.

    I'm not a fangirl of DBG by far, I'm sure some of the devs etc on this forum have been annoyed or irritated by my posts. I don't like a lot of the stuff that they are doing, but I don't think they're failing and that EQ is going to disappear.

    I love this game, if I didn't I wouldn't still be playing it almost 20 years later. I've played off and on since 1999 and while I spent from ~2010 until last year on EMUs, I was still playing in the same off again on again way. Agnarr brought me back to live. At the time, coming from Velious locked servers I thought it would be the place for me as I loved PoP. When Luclin hit, I realized a lot of my most favorite AXPs were GoD and OoW. I was somewhat disappointed and then Coirnav sprung up and gave me hope - which was quickly dashed. I won't touch that burning pile of refuse again for the life of me.

    So now I bide my time on Agnarr and hope for a similar XP rate server that will go to live. I have an level 85 (leveled up, not a heroic pickup) on the live server I played from 1999 onwards, but there's way too much since I last played and way too much I forgot. I don't even recognize my own gear! So I don't want to mess around on live. I'd rather do the path that will eventually take me there - but with a better XP rate than Coirnav offers.
  9. taliefer Augur

    It’s not uncommon for successful companies to do layoffs. For the last 8 Year’s I e worked for a Fortune 500 company that has always been on the Forbes best places to work list, and in those 8 years they’ve done 3 rounds of layoffs at least
  10. Wiff Elder


    Why not start on Phinny with TSS Wednesday? Live xp rate and destined for Live.

    I'm over Classic - GoD and ready to see the new stuff. I'll be there with my warrior LFGing.
  11. Lumiens Augur

    So whats the deal, cash shop sales slowing down on Corinav so they removing distillates to sell more cash shop potions instead?
  12. snailish Augur

    We've been told "cash shop" will be era-restricted to match the distillates.

    This thread is really about a controversial (to some) pimple in the greater ordering of an idealized modern fun progression's overall complexion.*


    *which the devs will never get 100% consensus from the community on, as some want some things easier and others harder... but then the next forum poster wants the opposite.

    TLDR: devs must have reasons for bothering to make changes to progression. This one seems like a puzzle piece rather than a complete picture.
  13. discordkitty Augur

    Honestly not feeling like starting all over again after just doing it on Coirnav and I haven't played through GoD and OoW since their initial live release years ago. I might be more inclined if I could transfer from Agnarr and continue on from where I am right now ;p
  14. Uumdano Augur

    Except it really is not, it is more about a company that consistently is making changes that more often that not do not make sense in the grander scheme of things. Yes, we have heard the out of era and over powered argument which we all know only holds so much weight.

    This thread is really about quality of life for many as well as keeping a trade skill viable for yet many more. We all appreciate the work that is being done, some of us would just like to encourage them to think these changes through a little more before implementation. Unfortunately there are often unintended consequences when changes are pushed through without getting proper feedback from the customer base.

    It is a symptom of a larger and reoccurring problem, one that would benefit company and customer if it was rectified moving forward. Every uncalculated mistake is the straw that broke the camels back for someone.
  15. Ahze Elder

    If one places no value on originalism for itself, this change is senseless.

    Replacing a functional system that was implemented as a needed improvement on the old system, both to make alchemy more widely used and to eliminate the bugs in the old system by starting over with some cobbled together revamp of the flawed original system is a farce as a game improvement. Add on top of it breaking alchemy progression inadvertently. Why do this? So a very few obsessive forums warriors can have their in-era happy spot rubbed is not enough reason.

    Seems to me there might be improvements that could be worked on instead that would be widely valued by the player base. I realize many of the recurring requests and suggestions must be totally unrealistic once one understands the problem from a technical angle but surely a few of them might be possible? I have no understanding of programming, so I am not going to venture suggestions even though I certainly have my own pet peeves, but I do know that the rclick name in chat channel menu was done relatively quickly after a forums suggestion made by a player and is widely used and valued. Good things have happened.

    Even though I still maintain that the obvious and widespread lack of available healers for the raiding game justifies the existence of Distillate of Celestial Healing in its current form, that certainly does seem to be a minority position. If that one potion needs to be toned down so be it. I question why smaller raid groups with almost enough healers need to fail instead of succeed for more fun, but it is a subjective judgement obviously and people will disagree.

    Getting rid of the mana regeneration and haste is going to place a further time burden on the least fun aspects of the game. You know, those tasks you don't want to ask your friends to help you with cuz they are sucky to do and no one wants to do it. Grinding potion money. Grinding greenies for faction. Grinding grey trash for tradeskill drops. O what fun to have that slowed down. How does this change make DBG money in the long term?

    The modern distillate system is an improvement, not a problem. Things should be reverted as soon as possible and nothing changed on live until the whole solution is worked out and the most obvious second order effects of the changes like maintaining a route for skill progression are tested.

    What virtue is there in originalism? What are its benefits? Why should we have to work harder for our goals in service to originalism? Why is this piece of painful originalism justified, while other QoL improvements are allowed?
    Uumdano likes this.
  16. Machentoo Augur


    This is clearly the only remaining benefit to Everquest. Don't take away my tummy rubs!
  17. Mwapo Augur

    This may be too deep for decision makers. Can you please give this post another try using more direct profitability figures?

    Monetary figures makes the Siberian tundra seem warmer this time of the year.
  18. Machentoo Augur


    Maybe you missed the part about the tummy rubs?
  19. snailish Augur

    What if it isn't about "originalism" primarily, but rather a trimming back the hedge of too easy to make the game more challenging?

    Casters are already more powerful than original era and early expacs were tuned to. Melee were mostly historically underpowered (obviously not the case for all now). There are more good items on these servers in more hands in a much shorter time than ever happened originally... and so on.

    This applies to tradeskill leveling as well. Which in fact could be the main reason this was done: perhaps the devs believe the leveling path for alchemy was too easy for the era. I believe there is opportunity for a lot to be done with tradeskills to make them valued in era and reasonable to level (at least to certain points) in each expac era. This definitely doesn't mean making all tradeskill paths exactly as they once were because flaws in design should be progressively overcome/restored.

    I believe their is a better balance of "plays more like old EQ" while using many "should of always had" quality of life things, while accepting some "this isn't getting changed for reasons" aspects. This balance should be harder and more tactical to play (especially in era), not more tedious... and may require rethinking the "slow XP" model that has been employed so far.
  20. Uumdano Augur

    Oh come now, the reason given was distillates were locked to PoR because that is when they were introduced, which is all about "originalism". Stop trying to make stuff up to fit your agenda. If they thought these things were too easy, which the two healing pots have been acknowledged by the majority as being too strong, they would have said as much, same with the leveling path, which is a ridiculous notion.

    The harder & more tactical ship has sailed w/o a total rewrite of tlp code to be mirror what was originally. Those qol changes you say are ok also make the game less challenging in many aspects, so your arguments here really do not make much sense, much like this change to alchemy.

    I can appreciate wanting the game to be more difficult, I like to 6 box raid content in era if possible, I recently finished enc & shm epics with just my box in the oow era. I do not use third party and most of the time I am too busy trying to use my basic tools to use all of the tools available to me across my 6 toons. I am all in for more difficult, however not at the expense of enjoying the game and dismantling a tradeskill, especially on servers who will be having these potions for sale in just a few months.

    It all makes so little sense, especially the execution.
    Ahze likes this.
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