@devs, for the love of Agnarr...

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Donroy, Feb 19, 2021.

  1. Xeris Augur

    I'm not sure what fake claims anyone was making. MOTM reduces damage players do to mobs, and increases the damage you take from mobs, and lowers your resists, and increases their HP. You can quibble with semantics if you want, and if you don't agree that MOTM makes fights more challenging, then that's your opinion.

    As a person who plays on Agnarr exclusively, and who often does old raid targets, I am telling you that I don't want MOTM removed. I personally feel like it would make the content too trivial.

    Your argument seems to be that the only impact of MOTM is that it makes fights last longer. However, in your post where you outlined exactly what MOTM does, you showcase how that isn't the case. It isn't just about mobs having more HP: MOTM makes you take more damage, lowers your resists. It also decreases your damage output.

    I can give you some specific examples. When POP/LDON were current (I.E. 2ish years ago), I had a 4box crew of SK Cleric BST and Bard. With elemental/some potime gear I was able to kill Gorenaire, but it was a challenging fight. There were very noticeable power increases as my characters got better gear, and now with fully BIS characters, I can take this same setup of 4 characters and kill Gorenaire very easily. The slow used to land on my guys and I'd have to manage buffs/dispels to keep it off, and now it doesn't land at all.

    Ditto with KT. It used to take me 40 minutes and I'd have to run through 2-3 cycles of paragon/CR to get KT down. And tanking him used to be a big struggle, where if I misstimed a heal I'd get splattered. Now with BIS characters I can get him dead in 1 cycle of CR and the tanking is pretty easy.

    If there was no MOTM, my original elemental geared crew could have probably killed Gore very easily right from the beginning, KT would have been much more easily doable right from the start. So, yes: MOTM makes the fights harder. I wouldn't have struggled so much earlier in the server to get these old raid mobs if MOTM wasn't a factor. It adds a level of difficulty because it literally makes the mobs harder to kill.
    Skuz likes this.
  2. Vedian Lorekeeper

    Here we go again...
    Yes.

    No, that's POTM, and it's a trivial amount on spells only.

    No, that's POTM, and in practice no it doesn't.

    No it doesn't. HP was boosted separately.

    You don't even understand what MOTM is and only managed to get 1/4 claims correct. No matter how many times you say it, a longer fight is not more challenging, or fun, or good for the health of the server. If you want that then go ahead and take some gear off and enjoy the extended fight length. Because if the increased length of going from no MOTM is good, then you must believe extending the fight as long as possible is even better.

    The mechanics of this aren't even credible. With elemental/time gear and a bard you shouldn't have been getting slowed to begin with. Now it isn't landing at all, and you claim (incorrectly) that removing MOTM would make this more trivial because it wouldn't land, which is the same situation you are currently in? So removing it would make no difference then?

    So you're saying if this used to take you 30 minutes instead of 40 that would be detrimental to the server? You are actually in favor of a fight lasting 40 minutes and suggesting that's a necessary improvement over 30 minutes? No, I disagree with that because that isn't fun, it's boring.
  3. Donroy Elder

    I guess the changes I proposed are more universal changes to the game across all TLP servers - not Agnarr specific. Was just some thoughts on general improvements for the TLPs which would also happen to breathe a little more life back into Agnarr. I'll edit some of the other suggestions including the motm stuff into the OP. I honestly don't care if Motm is removed or not but being a mage, I HATE the pet agro stuff with it. Regarding Truebox, I'm not in agreement to remove it. I think it's fine but that's just my opinion.

    I'd also like to add a big one I forgot.... where's the account to account xfers!? Take my money please!
    Vedian likes this.
  4. Donroy Elder

    Actually, I do have one (possibly) Agnarr specific complaint? Not sure what goes on on the other TLPs, but the very infrequent GM events always seem to occur at the worst times - middle of the day when everyone is at work. I've literally missed out on every single cool weapon ornament given out during the life of the server...
    PipotheAFILADOR, Vedian and curio like this.
  5. Xeris Augur

    Lol. You're just arguing semantics at this point. Whether it's MOTM specifically, potm, or what you wrote as "unlisted changes," it's all part of the same thing.

    You think the only thing MOTM does is make fights longer, and you're discounting people in the thread who are saying it's more than that. I'm not going to argue with you further. Think I'm wrong or delusional or whatever... I like things how they are, period.
  6. curio New Member

    Interesting discussion on King's Court Casino returning to LDON era on Agnarr (and other TLP). The items obtained from it - for the most part - could have been obtained in that era (i.e. Guise of Deceiver) on Agnarr (and other TLP). Therefore, it seem reasonable that this would not offer any major imbalance if it was implemented sooner. As others have mentioned, on a locked TLP server like Agnarr (and other future TLP) it would make sense to utilize this plat sink feature. Honestly, I imagine it would encourage a lot more farming and hunting of gold tickets, and I'm sure would keep some players around to add something else to collect.

    And a quick comment on the GM events. Yes I agree with this concern. Totally understand that the events are fun and require a GM to host them, so it is unlikely to expect way off peak hours that include everyone, because that is impossible. But - perhaps, there could be a change to the delivery of the rewards. Current system requires you to be available to play during most common daytime hours (referring mostly to EST here) and that you log in with a 15 minute notification, find the GM and participate / listening to their story. This is fine, but the request here seems to be - so many subscribers and faithful EQ lovers are missing these fun opportunities due to life/work and other obligations. I'm not talking about missing every other event. Like Donroy posted above, I have also missed virtually 99% of all GM events in 3 (nearly 4) year life of Agnarr server. It's pretty much an exclusion of a whole player base, depending on their timezone / work hours etc.

    I would like to propose a few suggestions that would make these rare events more accessible to wider variety of players. At the end of the day, as someone mentioned before - these are cosmetic rewards and just for fun. So there is no harm in sharing more rewards. What if more events were available in a /claim that was only available within a 12 or 24 hour period from the actual Live GM Event. If you are a subscriber, and can reasonably log in at least once a day, you can claim some rewards and maybe "read through a text or log of the event/story" and earn your reward on that character. This was done in past only once or twice as far as I can remember, some holiday rewards available on every character on your account for limited time, just with a /claim. Other option - would be for a notification text in game - approximately 24 hours before the event, or some sort of clue to the timing / whereabouts of the event. Essentially if folks had 24 hours notification of the event, larger number could be available and enjoy it. Just a few thoughts. Thanks!
    Vedian and Donroy like this.
  7. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    GM events are sometimes arranged ahead of time so it's worth keeping an eye on the guides website (link below), as for giving awards to players who are not able to attend, well that kind of defeats the whole purpose of the events so I don't agree with that suggestion at all.

    https://forums.daybreakgames.com/guide/index.php?forums/everquest-guide-events.321/
    Donroy likes this.
  8. Donroy Elder


    Wow, ok mind blown. Had no idea this particular forum was a thing. Thanks for that. It doesn't necessarily fix the timing, but it's a good heads up to plan around at least.
  9. Tweakfour17 Augur

  10. Vedian Lorekeeper

    https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/spell.html?spell=47489#NPCs_with_Ability
    Who's arguing semantics? Mitigation of the Mighty, the buff I have specifically identified that would like removed, does not do what you say it does. MOTM, the collection of things Xeris describes by this term, is something else entirely. There are at least 4 distinct buffs or mechanics that you're lumping together.


    Good points on the Casino. Several items previously dropped and nothing on that list is game changing if it's new. Just a collection of things that would be nice to have access to.

    This would probably be a bit of an overhaul but if GM events could run as they do now with the GM presence for the first hour to kick things off, then run as a scripted NPC for the next 24 hours or something like that. Limited availability during the afternoon really limits the audience.


    Another thing I hope to see make it's way to Agnarr eventually is the necro dot revamp. I think the initial changes were all from PoP onward so hopefully that gets extended back to classic.
  11. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    [IMG]


    That was for level 71+ spells otherwise known as the point in EQ at which Necromancer & Shadowknight spells are no longer shared & become 2 separate class-specific series, so you will not be getting that either.
  12. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    Mighty buff makes sense in era (where it arguably should be on basically everything due to power creep not just the raid bosses themselves). However once an era is no longer the most current specifically for that level cap, it doesn't really belong anymore.

    On Al'Kabor (Mac server, precursor to Agnarr) at level 65 several classes could solo Gorenaire/Talendor/Severilous. I did it many times on a druid. On Agnarr however, due to mighty buff this isn't doable at all. To me that is lame as going back after an era to do old raid mobs was part of the fun for me.

    Keep Mighty Buff on PoTime and Elementals sure, those are relevant raid targets for this server! But most everything else it could be stripped from IMO.
  13. Dythan Ban Lev in Plane of Fire guy


    I sneezed the other day running through Dreadlands and killed Gorenaire. Feel free to leave your prison server and level up a bit, and you can enjoy the fun of killing Raid mobs. Hell, I took an hour and solo'd Time on sunday for giggles (and a damn range clicky, but no luck =( )
  14. PipotheAFILADOR Journeyman

    For the love of Agnarr this 1000% I've missed every gm event because they are seemingly always in the middle of the work day and in the middle of the work week.

    It's really knowing your playerbase at this point were all adults with professional careers. At least put the ornaments up for sale on the market after the gm event so those of us stuck working can have access to them even if we have to pay.

    Casino being added would be very cool as well.

    Motm I dont really have strong opinions on either way except for POP raids it should definitely either be removed or changed to not punish pet classes.

    While were wishing. Caster classes could use some love in this era. They are just so bad in time compared to monks who simply just make sure their buffs are good and then hit auto attack and some discs.
  15. Darchon_Xegony Augur

    I have a max level on Phinigel who can kill just as much as you don't worry! I just enjoy all eras of EQ and play on multiple servers.
  16. Indigo_Quarmite Augur

    AoW is currently very easy with less than 6 real players on Agnarr. Did it over 2 years ago. Not sure how it can't be done now. But yeah, removal of MOTM on all pre PoP content would be fine. Would only take a group of 10-15 friends with 1-2 boxes each to get everything done up to PoP and actually maybe help the population. I know I might jump back into Agnarr. Level up some new toons kill some time. It could help swing the decision.
  17. Xeris Augur

    Again, whether I'm lumping MOTM, Potm, or w/e other things I don't memorize everything in EQ. My main point is I personally enjoy how WHATEVER thing that is on raid mobs functions. I feel like it keeps things interesting and prevents any random lvl 65 character from being able to solo raid bosses. If you disagree with that, no problem.

    Do you mean to say AoW is easy with less than 6 characters, or individual people? Cuz I'd love to see anyone who's done AoW with less than 6 on Agnarr. I did it with 5 a few months ago before they took the Kala mount buff off when my SK had 17k hp without a glyph... I've gotten to AoW once with my 5box outside of that and got him to about 80% before wiping. And my 5 crew are all almost entirely BIS. Would be curious to know what class compositions, if any, can kill AoW with less than 6.

    I also agree that it would be nice to see necro dot revamp on Agnarr, but because necro lines are intertwined with SK it seems unlikely. I just hate how a necro has to upkeep 10 dots on a raid boss to max DPS, and a Shaman can cast 3 dots and do roughly equal dmg. (If you stack all necro dots you can probably do about 2800/tic of you have all dot focus), Shaman ultor, bane, saryrn is around 2500? For just 3... It's nuts.

    Necro is supposed to be THE dot class but they're outgunned by Shamans who have like 10 roles to play in a raid (secondary heal, debuff, slow, FA/dps boost the raid, buff, dot). Alternatively, if necros could get an AA to give them dot crits around this era that would enhance them quite a bit, in terms of emphasizing what their role is supposed to be in the game.

    + For casino and VP 2.0 as well. Never experienced vp 2.0, but people say it is around elemental level loot? I guess there are ~3 items in there that have effects (like Cleave) that are out of era... could just be that those don't drop. There's an item that drops in Paw that has Cleave, but it just doesn't drop on Agnarr... could do the same thing.