Cya Everquest

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Elemental, Apr 4, 2022.

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  1. Cicelee Augur

    I think we all have those days when we don't want to be around others. There are times when I just want to chill and relax and not have to stress in a group and perform well.

    I think I just want the automation community to understand and admit that automation (while great for the individual) is bad for the server community as a whole. Automation does not promote grouping and socializing and teamwork, it promotes purely solo play at an efficiency and results that six individuals playing together can do.

    I mean, we all know driving 80 in a 65 is bad. Doesn't mean a lot of us don't do it- we do. But admitting it is bad and doing it is a lot different than saying it is fine and not harmful and doing it...
  2. Chikkin Augur

    oh geez, had I read just a little bit more on the server here before coming and posting all that.

    To anybody else, maybe I could do a month on a regular server to get myself warmed up for the TLP server. -- I still would happily read up a dummies guide. --- I imagine that the best answer that doesn't involve writing it here, is to google up the site, and go read on their forums, but I don't know how active they are, or helpful, plus, just another place have to register and make an account, and lastly, the bulk of the people on their forums (if they even have forums) would probably already know how to do the things I'm asking.

    There's the old fashioned way of just finding out for yourself by learning as you go, but time-restraints are the whole reason I'm asking this question to begin with. Just have a little time on Saturday early this morning, before I head out shopping for the rest of the day.

    ... a little more on topic, what CAN you do on a true box server, is there ANYthing you can do on a truebox that is "special"? I guess you could use ISB for 1 account for QoL features, but I don't know what they would be since it you're not multi-tasking, and thus it'd basically just be clicking your buttons for you... taking any ounce of fun or challenge of actually playing out of it...

    Hell, I'm just glad the game/playerbase/devs have evolved to the point where we can have open discussions about it. -- I remember back in my 99-2003 days, that even though Show EQ was linux-only (at the time I first heard about it) and thus was rare and hard to detect, that you still didn't even mention it in a /tell because supposedly the devs were Control-F'ing chat logs.

    Cheating in general on a multiplayer game does suck though, no question on that. Glad to see them raising the bar here... apparently this last January. -- That was one thing that really helped to end my time at Dark Age of Camelot, the radar-users that bee-lined straight to you and ganked you.
  3. Chikkin Augur

    Although you are understanding and open-minded at the beginning, and replying that you get it, the next paragraph goes back to framing it in a more absolute way, as black and white "it's either good or its bad".

    I'd love to play EQ as a 1 player game if they released it like that. But no money in that for them I guess, so therefore no choice in the matter. --- However, if given the choice between 1 player EQ vs. Playing EQ isolated/antisocial as if it's a 1 player game. -- With a fluid option that you pay 5 bucks more a month to "be online"... I think I would find myself wanting to spend that 5 bucks or (more, aka the monthly sub) because even if I don't talk to them ever (or 99% of the time) it's nice feeling like you're in a town with "real people" .. .and real player auction bazaars, and you never know, you may get lonely and after leveling up or learning the game, or tired of playing 1 player'ish, you suddenly "get social" and join a guild. --- So my point is, there doesn't have to be a "good for the community or bad for the community" this or that type thing, the option of both is probably good for both. --- Who knows how many people would be leveling up to join raid guilds these days if they didn't have mercs, or botting (on non-tlp servers) to get them "caught up".

    Opinions/debate etc. -- I'm not currently playing obviously and have zero emotion/attachment to things at the moment.
  4. Notanewperson New Member

    Hi, long time player, first time poster here.

    I confess, I'm one of those people.
    It's a sad state of affairs right now. DB's ever changing stance and definition has us all pitted against each other. Their blanket definition of "cheating" and their criminalization of anyone's alternative play style doesn't help. Not all who do it are bad actors.

    EverQuest was designed as a social game and back in the day it was great for that. But the day has come where the average player is 30+ years old. People are BUSY. By the time I have any availability to play it's late, few people are on, few classes are available to get a group together to accomplish anything. During the day playing isn't really an option - kids, work, caring for a disabled parent etc. The solo scene is crap, the lack of group tasks in ToL is >STUPID< and short sighted. Ok, all 5 of you, do you have xyz drop? oh, so and so is afk, theyll be back in 10 mins. Now person 123 is afk, break again for 10 mins. Alright guys, the hour I had available was mostly squandered to waiting for afk people, cya in a couple days. Also, lets admit it, most people outside of raid guilds aren't very good at their class. Giving them pointers usually doesn't help, they just keep doing the same wrong thing. Or you have a named in camp and they're standing there, not attacking, but talking to people in genchat. Yep, not grouping with them anymore.
    Aforementioned circumstances forces people into "botting" and boxing.

    For me I see cheating as warping (seems fairly rare, I've never had anyone warp and steal my kill, not saying it doesn't happen), duping, bazaar price automation (you guys are truly JERKS), flooding the bazaar with ground spawns, camp hogging, afk for days on end.
    Those are definitely unfair advantages which take away from the greater community and are detrimental. I fail to see how me playing 6 characters ruins your game play experience at 1am. You cannot convince me it does. I've never hogged a named, warped (the most common software doesn't even allow it), or used my group in a toxic manner. Quite the opposite actually. I try to be an asset to the community by helping folks occasionally and willingly give up my camp anytime someone rolls up and wants it.

    I'm in a large top 15 raid guild. I didn't box before I joined. After I joined I was kind of forced into it. Most people are in their little cliques of 6-12 and rarely group with anyone else. They smash out an expansion in a week and then disappear except for raid time. It goes without surprise these cliqued up people who help each other are the most outspoken about "cheating" but rarely volunteer to group with anyone else in the guild or help folks accomplish anything to stay current. But oh boy are they happy when you get them their last named kill or a collection they really need.They'd rather sit there and pontificate about the way you play than help you. It's disgusting. On the rare occasion I am on during prime time I love grouping with my other guild mates, chatting, and keeping up with each other's lives. Lots of us are even friends on FB.

    It sucks I have to box the way I do, it feels shameful sometimes, but options are limited. DB could fix things by making a string of solo options, fix anti pet tank mechanics in missions. Just a couple ideas but I'm not a game designer, that's their job. I often wonder if the devs even play this game? I see their discord handle showing them playing some other unrelated game.

    TL;DR - I box, I play nicely, not all are bad. Not all are cheating but the community debasing cheaters are a problem. Their definition of "cheating" is too broad and alienating. Tune the game to the 21st century. Stop being a pompous jerk to people who leave others alone and want to be left alone to enjoy something that's been part of their life since childhood.
  5. Bardy McFly Augur

    Many of us that box would not play at all if we could only play one account. I'm one of those people. So if you think suddenly you're going to have more grouping opportunities if boxing is banned, you're sorely mistaken. Many (maybe even most) of those players won't be playing at all anymore. I haven't grouped since 2005 and don't plan to start grouping again now. Box ban = full unsub and play a different game for me.
  6. Act of Valor The Newest Member

    Boxers are fine. People that are sympathetic towards the cheaters are trying to convince everybody, including you, that Daybreak is going after boxers, which they aren't. Don't believe that, it is false. Boxers. Are. Not. Banned.
    Szilent, Tarvas, Velisaris_MS and 2 others like this.
  7. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Boxing does not equal botting.

    Do the pro-cheat people really suffer from that level of cognitive dissonance that they cannot distinguish boxing (approved Alt+Tab/key broadcasting) from botting (automation and other mods)? Like dang.
  8. Bardy McFly Augur

    Thanks for the insult.

    And now you've stepped into the "gray area" that I had previously mentioned. DPG stance is (or used to be?) solely that "unattended gameplay" was against the rules.
  9. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Forums: Just trust me, bro. I'm at my computer. 1 character is being played and 5 are automated.

    In-game: Sends tell to bot group: "Are you camping this mob?". Player responds 30 minutes later: "Sorry, man. I didn't see your tell due to battle spam. Yes, I am camping the mob."

    Real world: Works the BBQ grill as he has friends over for an NFL game.
  10. Bardy McFly Augur

    Innocent until proven guilty. I do not advance my accounts when not at my keyboard. I move to a safe spot in the zone and avoid mobs even if I just have to go pee. I followed all the guardrails as they were previously laid out.

    Again, you're grouping a few bad actors with the majority that played within the allowable guardrails as dictated by DPG actions.
    MacDubh likes this.
  11. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Two days after the incident: Proceeds to laugh his butt off how many players were fooled hook-line-and-sinker. Walks away from Morwenna with 20 Type 5 augments to kit out his recently leveled Heroic Character.
  12. Bardy McFly Augur

    What are you even talking about? I don't even get your references or joke.
    MacDubh likes this.
  13. Zilkress Journeyman

    Great arguement except people who use Key broadcasting are catching the ban's too! So thats not the arbitrary line that they drew. I think the point most are trying to get through a lot of the self rightious and sactamonius crowed is that the all the bans and suspension are done beyond an abitrary line that they havent told anyone about.

    For example when a new law is created and put on the books lets say a "No Texting while driving" Law. Once that law gets passed and signed by the governer implementation is not immediate. a period of 3 to 6 months is given where law enforcement will give active warnings but it is not a legal ticketable offense. DPG went from near 0 to 100 especially while not informing its community their intentions. AFK play and being a were what caused suspension and bans. Using automation or broadcast programs on Truebox servers were the way. Now who the hell knows! Some are being band from I S, some from M Q, some from hardware and programable keyboards, hell I know one who caught one of the suspensions and only 3rd party program he uses is GINA. There is such a nebulous set of rules and inconsitant enforcement. Not to mention no talk of improving the game that causes any of these fixes by the community to be neccesary. Oh and another thing there is no way to know how many innocent people got caught up in the suspension wave as well. DPG has been known to have collateral damage when carrying out mass suspensions like this as with the VM ban wave that happend a few years ago.
    MacDubh and Bardy McFly like this.
  14. Evilness Gnome warriors are the best warriors

    Since not wanting to share loot is coming up in discussion, here is another suggestion. Increase loot drops from rares. Whatever the rare drops, it should drop 1 item for EACH real person in the group. Problem solved. This would ENCOURAGE (there is that word again!) people to help each other camp augs, etc.
    Vumad likes this.
  15. Zilkress Journeyman

    Easy fix for that is have the "Droppable" Type 5's Lore... then there is no reason for either Botter or player group to camp for days on end!
  16. Bardy McFly Augur

    I should also point out that DPG went so far as to have an agreement with the developer of unspeakable software that they would provide a build without active hacks that would be allowed on the non-Truebox servers. So people can say all they want about DPG not wanting that software in the past. They would have explicitly called it out as not allowed if that was the case.

    What I'm concerned about is *now*. If they have changed their stance, they should explicitly call out what is no longer allowed. Otherwise people are going to continue to get suspended or banned without knowing actually why. It's also going to waste a bunch of peoples time if players continue to use software that was quietly allowed in the past, only to find their account suspended or banned a month or two down the road having wasted that time for nothing.
  17. Zilkress Journeyman

    Or as much as i hate WoW do personal loot...
  18. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    The principle of camp and mob monopolization through advantages granted by 3rd party software (i.e. automation which reduces fatigue) stands.

    You can go to FV if you want Free Trade.
  19. Zilkress Journeyman

    So much this!
  20. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    The rules have been stated here:

    What Constitutes as Cheating?
    Jumbur likes this.
  21. Zilkress Journeyman

    So then set a time limit any one set of people can be at a camp! Or you know what someone can just move to your server and keep you from getting a camp 24/7 365 by rotating people in and out of the group and never automate. If your problem is with camp / mob monopolization then we can adress that. AFK play has already been adressed and denounced. You keep bringing up fatigue then someone with Insomnia has an unfair advantage and shouldn't be allowed to play in your opinion because of the unfair advantage that may be present allowing them to camp one area for long periods of time. Or what about the type of people that can Hyperfixate on repetitive tasks? I say again we can talk about the ways to free up "specific mobs" with "specific loot tables" so that people have access to them while banning and removing unattended game play fine but if your going to fall back on you stale, lame, and poorly reasoned "fatigue" arguement then the answer is you dont want a solution that may better the game you just want to troll.
    Kattria Minx likes this.
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