Cases where game masters will not intervene

Not sure what you are saying in the second paragraph. If they cannot prove who did it they cannot bring the toon back as it could have been the player themselves that did to profit on the items sold on the FV server. Also since sharing log in data is against the EULA they have no reason to reverse the delete even if it was someone other then the player who had the log in info. Because of this they cannot prove anyone who did claims it was done maliciously.

As you say it is probably a small number of individuals who accidentally delete a toon. Add to that that of the toons "accidentally deleted" most are probably minor toons. Or they have other major toons on their account in addition to the one accidentally deleted. If somone has more then one primary toon on the account I dont think they will quit. Of those left who dont have any other major toons and accidentally deleted their primary toon some of those will quit.

But that would then require that DBG have CS people to handle the "I've locked myself out" requests - and I'm betting more people have had to retype their passwords a few times until they got it right than have accidentally deleted toons

I've read every thread and every post related to these subjects for a week+. That's long enough. We're raking over the same ground. Without action items nothing changes. Here are my takeaways: (Recommendations highlighted to account for tl;dr)

General Recommendation - there are probably many players who are not very computer or security savy. Policies and required player actions should reflect this. Where they do not effort should be made to call these things to the player's attention and provide clear instructions.

Computer/account security
Do not share User ID and password - it appears (at least to me) that doing so can result in a outcome that will not be repaired by CS and could result in loss of your account, [speculation] even if that sharing was not the direct cause of the issue at hand. It's a violation of the Terms of Service.

Recommendation - the consequences of sharing account information can be so extreme a warning should appear on the EQ Welcome Screen.

Account Security Policy
https://help.soe.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/28977/session/L3RpbWUvMTQyNjI0NDY3NC9zaWQvUWd6aDVjaG0=

How to
https://help.soe.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/30061/related/1
There are other guides posted on the internet
Recommendation - a more thorough Computer/account security guide in the FAQ and a stickied link on the Welcome Screen when you log in EQ.

Purchasing and using an authenticator from Daybreak for $9.99 will likely protect you from unauthorized access and the need to contact CS for such issues. But use of an authenticator will not insure that your computer is virus free and capable of running EQ. You still have to perform normal computer security.

Recommendation - a stickied link for authenticator purchase on the Welcome Screen when you log in EQ.
And perhaps adding the authenticator to the SC catalog for cash as is done for expansions

Accidental Character Deletion
General -
Daybreak's other titles have the no restoration policy.

Recommendation - EQ2 adds you needing to enter the toon's name in addition to a simple OK/cancel confirmation box for character deletion. Do the same with EQ.

A leading competitor's product provides possible restoration of the toon through CS ticket in the condition it was in when it was deleted

Unattended computer -

There are freeware versions of this that operate a bit differently and perhaps more conveniently for a given user.

• All of this looks like complete bs and laziness on the part of customer service and the people make the game in general. I'll go thru each one.
• Deleted items: How hard is it to make it possible to restore items in game and how difficult is it for CS for restore them? Super lazy stuff.
• Accidentally sold items: So what if I sell something to a player but get scammed or something? Like I don't get paid. So I guess the scammer won't get in trouble for it becuase CS too lazy to do anything. Good job Daybreak.
• Accidentally bought items: So I buy a ridiculously expensive raid item from the vendor by mistake and I am being told to go raid a zillion more times to save up for the chits? This is complete ridiculousness to the extreme.
• Misloots: So I guess ninja looting is now okay. Just take all the stuff you need and then use marketplace stuff to change your name, race, etc and risne and repeat. Good job you guys.
• Guild Administration: This should be doable in game. This is the laziest thing that for close to 16 years and no way of doing this in game. So basically the only option now will be too reform the guild.
• Deleted characters: I guess i will just quit EQ if someone hacks into my account and deletes all my charcaters. God forbid I get some spyware keylogger or something my AV doesn't detect and I get hacked. And since accounts don't get locked after you enter the wrong password too much they could even blunt force get in too. The most insulting thing is saying "Just reroll your characters." No you tarts I am just going to quit and not ever look back if that ever happens.

This is so unbelievable I don't even know what to say. Except for all nasty things that are against forum rules. This is certainly well on its way to the end.(of EQ I mean) It does not shock me much at all that the Customer Service is the first thing to go.

I spent most of my DKP on an amazing item only to realize that my character couldn't equip it. My guild leader made me wear a dunce cap through the following week's series of raids. Totally within bounds and completely deserved. While I sympathize (to a teensy tiny degree), I must disagree with your statement. It's your screwup, not theirs.

I think it comes down to if somebody thinks they should be held accountable or not over their actions. While this is a significant part of EQ it also extends into life outside the game. If a person messes up should they alone be held accountable for their carelessness/stupidity or should their actions be put on the shoulders of everybody.

Related to this entire mess is a subfield in psychology about subconscious risk assessment/management. This comes into play with the game because the safer the dev's make the game the more risks players will take. If DBG hired an army of CS people to take care of careless mistakes (ie, sharing your password with "friends", mislooting items, etc.) players would naturally not pay attention to most of what they do. Many studies have been done in this area. This isn't fringe soft fake science. It goes hand in hand with the "If you make something idiotproof the world will make better idiots".

Expecting DBG to make the game foolproof is just going to drive up the cost. Nobody in their right mind would pay $100/month for a game regardless of how foolproof it is. I'm seeing some people expect this level of CS but they aren't willing to pay for it. (ie. just look at the premium server that folded awhile back).

Short of committing a crime or some sort of financial malfeasance, it is very difficult to screw up 10 or 15 years worth of accomplishments in two mouse clicks.

In some cases clicking "Reply All" instead of "Reply" can do it

It's certainly possible to go overboard and make CS costs prohibitive. However, there is usually some low-hanging fruit that can be addressed first. In this case, changing the "Are you sure?" confirmation box for the character deletion option to "Please type your account name to confirm" would be cheap and effective. Of course, nothing is 100% effective, but going from 99% to 99.95% at the cost of a few hours of development time seems like a reasonable compromise.

Auto unlock after X period of time. Even 10 second lockout limits a brute force attack to few tries per minute vs millions. sufficient to dissuade most attackers from using this method.

I haven't received any tweets. Any word, aside from some random person accusing him of handing out his login?

Daybreak keeps CS actions private.

The random person isn't entirely random and I admire the effort to set the record straighter.

I think players are far more lazy than CSR. There are many tools available that enables players to solve their own problems.

Token of Reclamation. How long have you played this game?

The trade window only works when BOTH people agree to a trade. What you are mentioning tends to be a problem if you are selling stuff through 3rd party websites.

I do agree there should be a measure that would correct a mistakenly purchased item. SWTOR has a buyback & sellback timer for instances of accidental sells or purchases.

Raids have mechanics that you can set specific looters. Perhaps a group mechanic can be introduce; overall though - I didn't think ninja looting was such a huge problem still 15 years later in EQ.

The only issue I see is there should be a recourse available in the event a guild leader is MIA for a specific amount of time. Other than that, CSR has no business dealing with guild admin - or do you want them to play the game for you to? Rather than moan about it - come up with ideas. It always is easier to criticize than be constructive with ideas.

Have you even read these forums or are you just skimming and riding the wave? Roshen already came out and stated that Daybreak takes hacked accounts seriously and those matters would be investigated. However, they must be TRULY HACKED ACCOUNTS. Sharing your account with someone does not constitute as being hacked, it constitutes as being naive and is a violation of the TOS. The funny thing is - people do it anyway, and when crap hits the fan - people whine & complain about it.

I think its no more unbelievable than what you wrote. Hopefully you have never made practice of writing a book report before reading the book because I have never seen such ill informed remarks. If you got nothing but nasty thoughts about the game - why are you here? Just go. Oh you are still here? Of course you are. Because you love it and love something to complain about even more.

Quite frankly, other than some tweaks that I think should be made regarding buyback/sellback of items and guild leadership assistance ( if in need ) - I think these changes are necessary. I am glad to see they are going to focus more energy toward developing the game and CSR situations that are not solvable by players.

The bottom line, all you complainers cannot have your cake and eat it too. If no one knows what that means, it means you cannot have it both ways. As stated many times, if you legitimately have a complaint about something - come up with an idea and resolution that may make something better to back it up; because all the "this sucks, you all suck, Daybreak sucks, CSR sucks" - just goes nowhere. You will end up doing more harm to the game you all proclaim to love so much than good.



PS.You will have to highlight the above quotes; for some reason - its grayed out. I tried to do edits to correct it, but its too stubborn.

Aren't we done here?

One could only wish...

I still think that DBG should put in two optional flags:
1. Never move this char to FV
2. Never delete this char.

Shouldn't be THAT hard to implement and would leave people with a much better feeling.

How about a popup "Please type the following to confirm moving/deletion of this character: slajnhfgangjnajksdgnla ;rjita;jtr;oajerio;tjaerjljadgkdgkjadfgjadfgoeut8904u89076q34outilqjtahrekgnjkahgrjahdggadjkadhg9uy4tg89quy4p3t89h3p89y5htuahkjhjkdfhagjdgagl4yghuioahgkgdjgag4yht89y894ytg89fyq489tygfa8i9fgyhuti4ahitgohaohegt;oahgoi;j4ahe;oftg43tha4toiqah4otih0q9p8utyg890qah4gthpa89h4pgayhp90uha490g89qahpg98qah4p98ghp984hgp98hq4pgp89q3h4g9h", you have one attempt only.

That should help prevent accidental moving/deletion.

Who "rolls" a character in EQ?

How did you know my password!!!!

Player Joe plays EQ on his laptop, he travels with his laptop and plays at various places. Thus the geographical location he is playing from changes. That paragraph was intended to address those who have been saying that DBG could find the geographical location someone logged in from and acting like that would prove anything.

Joe, as well as everyone who plays EQ, uses the Launchpad to start the game; at least whenever he patches the game. The Launchpad saves all of your login information so that one only has to log in one time and not each and every time one plays. Joe does something that upsets his ___________. Joe's _________ gets onto his laptop starts up the Launchpad for EQ which gets that person right into the game, and they easily enough find their way to the server Joe plays on and delete all of Joe's characters. Joe shared his password with no one, he didn't even intentionally allow the person to use his laptop. (Feel free to fill in the blank with friends, family, significant others, coworkers, or whoever else might get upset with Joe at some time and might be able to gain access to his laptop at some point in time.

DGB cannot prove anything was not done maliciously; for that matter they cannot prove anything was not done by the player regardless of the IP or location from which the action occurred. Yet, they claim they will restore any deleted characters which are the result of hacking or done maliciously. Since they cannot in anyway prove these one way or the other all one has to do is lie, and DBG will end up restoring the toon; as such that part of the new policy is utterly stupid and unenforceable.

Personally for the above reasons, I think what they are going to start refusing to do for guilds that have a long MIA or AWOL guild leader is a bigger issue. But both of these could be easily solved with some kind of automated method for the player to fix it themselves as well as stronger identity checks before character transfers.