Camp ownership question

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Galliana, Jan 27, 2020.

  1. Galliana Elder

    I have a question regarding acceptable use. THere is a group in a camp I want that has been unresponsive for almost an hour now. Occasionally they move, casting spells. I suspect these are AFK bots. Whatever is going on, they are not answering repeated messages, so I'm wondering what is protocol here. I got a mind to just take the camp but don't care to get in trouble with the GMs. At this point I don't care about what they think.
  2. Vumad Augur

    Unfortunately you might be a little short on options. While I haven't had any direct experiences, I have read about other people who have trained bot groups and been banned. If the owner is running recording, and sends the evidence to the GMs as griefing, you might be the one ending up paying the price.

    You either need to pick a different camp, try for a pick zone, report them and hope someday some action is taken or take an action yourself being prepared to accept the consequences.
  3. Tolzol Augur

    Well “officially” there are no camps in EQ. That is more of a common courtesy between players. The rule is pretty much first to engage a mob is the one with rights to said mob. So as long as you do not train, steal a mob they are actively killing, or grieve them in any other way you should be clear. If they are afk bots they won’t complain. If they aren’t you’ll probably find out when they start complaining that your in their camp.
    RPoo, FawnTemplar, Annastasya and 3 others like this.
  4. Xyroff-cazic. Augur

    Respecting first to engage is also just a courtesy among players. Officially the only rule is if you do more damage, you win the kill. The only exception to this is for triggered spawns, but most of these have now been flagged for loot locking anyway when they are triggered.
    Duder likes this.
  5. CatsPaws Augur

    Depends on if your on live server or TLP
    Yinla likes this.
  6. Silver-Crow Augur

    Sadly, play nice is a thing of the past.

    Camp ownership, engage first are all from back in the day when people had some courtesy, and reputation mattered.

    Todays Krono lords and $$ bot groups don't give a monkeys about play nice, it's all about chasing the money. DBG got tired of policing this and actually didn't have the resources to keep sorting this out, so the official policy is DPS race is king. If you do more damage, gratz you win.

    Of course this was just the green light the server dregs loved, and they thought up all sorts of ways they could rain on someones parade. Charm stealing, warping wizard bot groups and 24 man necro teams monopolising camps all over the place. You could see from all the wailing and gnashing of teeth on these forums about how nice a place Mangler was.

    Basically, as long as you don't train anyone, you have the right to turn up, steal a mob and make off with the loot based on todays ruleset.

    This is at it's worst on the newer TLP's where making money is the aim of the game. The older TLP's like Phinny have shed most of the malcontents, as there's no money to be made, so tends to be more how you remember it.
  7. blibityblop New Member

    Let's see what we can extract from the actual game rules per Daybreak Games.

    1. There is no "First to engage" rule, and it will never be enforced. Fair enough.

    2. From Rule 3, we see that if a specific activity doesn't impact most/all players in a zone, then that behavior isn't considered "zone/area disruption". So, if I was to say, train that person at the camp, it isn't considered "zone/area disruption" so it must be considered under a different rule.

    3. "You may not abuse other players" is rather vague, and is made even worse by the "...list is not all-inclusive".
    If I train a level 1 decaying skeleton onto a level 115, is this abuse?
    If I train another player is this abuse?
    If I kill steal is this abuse?
    If I feel like I have the right to a camp that I don't currently own, but would like to take from a player that "might be" afk, or "might be" a bot, does that mean I can do it?

    These are all very good questions, and it's a good thing that you asked here. The only thing that could ever diffuse this situation is a post from a developer. I have no knowledge of developer posts (probably because of poor documentation or simple incompetency) on the nature of camps.

    What we can point to is: How have these situations been resolved in the past?

    fast forward to 12:05

    Video evidence of someone training a full group of players and doesn't get banned, suspended, etc.

    This is one example out of , I'm sure, 1000's if not 100's of thousands of instances of players training others and not getting punished.

    I would interpret the training of other players as a form of abuse, and therefore against the rules.
    -Lack of manpower, or lack of willpower to enforce this rule is neither here nor there. It's against the rules in my head canon so I won't be doing it.

    Kill stealing, however, is never mentioned at all in the rules. It is, in effect, a form of bullying, but so is claiming "a camp" (there are no camps) for all time just because you can. I would say that *unfortunately* every player has the right to kill steal whatever monsters they want in the entire game.

    Since there are no "camp rules" in the official rules, then we must assume that there simply aren't any. Kill steal away.

    4. Unattended gameply is against the rules, so if you feel that a player is breaking the rules feel free to report the character in question and submit a report ticket.
    Good luck stealing the camp!

  8. Yinla Augur

    There are no camps that EQ enforce, but the players will if you are on a live server. If your on TLP servers forget it there is no respect there for others camps.

    Live players tend to want to keep their reputations clean so tend to play nice, the odd one or two crop up once in a while, the name soon gets around and they soon find themselves being dealt with harshly by other players.
    code-zero likes this.
  9. CatsPaws Augur

    Agree with above. Being on live server is huge difference in player maturity and over all consideration of the game and the other players.

    I took a long long journey (in other words it was not easy or fast to get there) to a named aug camp in an area a few years old. Surprised when I found another 110 player and his box sitting there. I did /camp check - got one reply from someone else far away (according to track) and no response from this well known player who was sitting there. Usually he is running TOV stuff so was kinda odd him being there. Waited about 10 minutes, the named placeholder was up. No action. Sent a few tells but then I decided there was at LEAST ONE OTHER camp in the game. So I moved on:D

    My momma learned me manners! - wasn't so good on the grammer though.
    Yinla likes this.
  10. Razorfall Augur

    I used to run into this all the time in FM. This guy was making macaroni outside the fort and start pulling mobs from inside. So my group would set up shop inside the fort and just murder everything.

    Six hours later the guy finally came back to the keyboard and tried to say it was camped. Yes it was. By me :)

    So he decided to be a super friendly guy and bring 20 mobs to us. Half of us were raid he basically just delivered us free XP
  11. svann Augur

    First, ask if you can share the camp.
    Then you could take a couple mobs and if they say nothing that is tacit acceptance. If you are reported you can say you asked them permission and they never responded. That I think is sufficient to prevent any kind of gm penalty. Then just apologize and move on. Or if they never report you you are good as gold.
  12. Bobbybick Augur

    "DPS wins in all situations"

    Take the camp, if they're bots its just a bonus and maybe they'll give you some free dps. There are no camps in EQ, there are no "first to engage" rules in EQ. Long as you aren't going out of your way to target harass an individual player you are fine.
    Whulfgar, code-zero and Dythan like this.
  13. Corwyhn Lionheart Augur

    Unfortunately I am not so sure it is just maturity as much as there isn't as much RL money transactions. TLP servers start up with everyone needing everything. Big market which encourages camp stealing and greed.

    I guess a point could be made that this also creates an ongoing culture where camps are not respected. While on Live servers there is a tradition of continuing Play Nice policies.
    FawnTemplar likes this.
  14. ArtremasEQ Elder

    Sadly the AFK BOT groups are quite rude, and will just move in and take a camp from you, and bring in whatever it takes to out DPS you / drive you off. Without saying boo.

    Happened to me in GD Coldain caves just a couple days ago. Just came and camped out on my head. Grp could mostly out DPS them, but after initial amusement, its not worth the angst / loss of XP. Fighting with them is pointless as they really don't give a damn. And he's been in the same spot now, 24x7 killing, for 5 days straight.

    They in no way care about reputation or anything else, however they do video and WILL report YOU if you do anything like training them.

    Just take (try and take) the mobs you need, and move on.
  15. Zanarnar Augur

    Totally unnecessary. DPS race is the only actual rule in regards to who "owns" a mob or camp. Someone in your camp? Just setup right ontop of them and out-dps them. If you can't then its their camp. If you can, then its yours.

    Until [whatever they wanna be called] changes the gameplay rules, this is the only one that matters. No PNP, no camps, no first in force. Just DPS race.
    (and I think it sucks, but there is nothing you can do but respond in kind.)
    code-zero likes this.
  16. code-zero Augur

    Ehh no, I'll never forget the day on Ragefire when I was running 2 dark elf characters over to the commonland tunnel and an immature weasel trained me and then sent abusive /tells because I was boxing. As it happened I was boxing and using /follow but after a while the truly ugly and immature behavior of some TLP people detracted from the small amount of fun I was having.
  17. Galliana Elder

    Bot farmers are likely Chinese plat farming slaves who farm PP for that unnamed site that sells it. So chances are they don't speak English to begin with.
    code-zero and ArtremasEQ like this.
  18. Xyphen Augur

    I've reported disruptive bot groups via DBG ticket system and they were booted in less than 30 minutes, and I didn't see that group back online for a week or so. I don't report real players that do it as long as they're tucked away in a corner and not in a popular spot for days (pre-nerf Margidor). My server would be empty if DBG actually banned everyone that did it.

    It's not uncommon for the old farts to accidentally type a script command into general chat. No one seems to care that much.
  19. Whulfgar Augur

    Way I am in game and outta game is simple. I come at people how they come at me.

    In game this translates into when I enter a zone I do a CC in /ooc / shoult (same time hotkey) if say 32 people are in velks, an I get not a single reply in ten minutes with that # of peeps in zone I consider all camps open.

    I then go to which ever camp I want. As I did a CC and waited. If the camp I want is taken by what appear's to be a AFK killing crew, I simply kill everything round them faster. I have zero issues with bot crew's.
  20. Doomofshadows New Member

    Four paragraphs; three contradictions.

    Cya in game.

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