AA Focus Tab

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by LadyQuake, Jul 18, 2021.

  1. LadyQuake Lorekeeper


    (I am a Nec)

    Question on the Focus Tab in AAs

    Do they work on higher spells?
    Ones on there are low, one I done Mort Wounds to 10/15 to test and still lists 3 old spells.
    Will it work on the 115 spell in Group septic Wounds?


  2. Tatanka Augur

    Sissruukk, Kaenneth, Wulfhere and 6 others like this.
  3. Skrab East Cabilis #1 Realtor

    It's one of those things that makes you wonder if the dev team actually plays their own game. Other AA lines exist in the Focus tab that work across the whole spell line. They just chose not to follow that route in EoK+.
  4. Tatanka Augur

    The current way it works is fine for those who finish their AAs every year before the new expac comes out. For those who don't, we're stuck with this mess.

    In my case, I actually skipped doing all focus AAs except for two lines, for spells I use literally all the time. The rest, I purposely waited til EoK AAs were eligible for auto-grant (this past Decemeber), and only then filled out one more line. The rest? I've just trained myself to not care.

    Note: I'm talking about the AAs with "Focus: " in the name. Many of the others on that tab don't work this way, and were worth pursuing anyway. I'm just talking about the "Focus: " ones.
  5. Skrab East Cabilis #1 Realtor

    Nah, it’s just all around bad character progression design.
    OlavSkullcrusher likes this.
  6. LadyQuake Lorekeeper

    Thanks, and for page link.
    Ill prob only do 1 or 2 , so many AAs.
    May go back finish others after, some still to do but not as important ones.
  7. Soulbanshee Augur

    Before they made worn focus +5 over max level, it wasn't any different. You had to make a play decision which spells you changed out before you upgraded your focus.
  8. OlavSkullcrusher Augur

    Worn focus is about the magical effects of gear, whereas the Focus AAs are about the abilities and skills gained from experience. Besides, I don't think it was a particularly good choice to have worn focus effects fade based on spell level either. It is obvious that a player would want better gear as they level because of the increased stats. There is no need to further incentivize them to seek new gear by making only the new gear focus the effects of their new spells.

    The main problem with both design choices is that gaining a character level and getting a new, more powerful version of an existing spell should simply be an upgrade by virtue of having gained that level and gotten the new spell, period. Having to also spend a large number of AA and get a new item just for that new, more powerful spell to actually have a greater effect than the previous version of the spell is like having to pay for something twice. It doesn't make a lot of sense, as a matter of game design. It's only real purpose seems to be the extra time sink.

    Edit: And the fact that some of the focus tab AAs work on entire spell lines from the beginning shows that it isn't necessary for them to work that way.
    cadres, Wulfhere and Stymie like this.
  9. Sokki Still Won't Buff You!!

    It's still a pita for those who are max going into a lvl increase expansion. You're stuck with either using the new spell with no Focus or using the old spell with the focus until you buy the new ranks. Not quite as bad as being behind on AA's though. I know with my alt it was really discouraging to spend 100's of AA's for 0 benefit until you finally hit the rank that it started working.
  10. Hekaton Augur

    The way to get your spells to max effectiveness is so painful in EQ. I'm a shaman so heres the hoops i had to jump through to get Chaotic Venin to max effectivness. Chaotic Venin is a combo dot that can fire two nukes.

    So first i have to raid to get rank 3 of the spell which gives it a 20percent chance to fire the nukes. i also have to get rank 3 of the 2 dots and 2 nukes. So 5 rank 3's in total.
    Have to keep at it to get raid bracer (poison focus) and a back item (duration focus)
    Have to spend some decent cash to get Faycite for the 2 dots and 2 nukes.
    investments of thousands of AA to get the focus lines up but also mirrored pestilence, critical affliction, fury of magic, destructive fury, destructive cascade, extended pestilence, fleeting spirit, spire of ancestors, and glyphs.

    not to mention looking for clicky items (like circle of power 4) and farming tribute for tribute effects

    its all so punishing if you're just coming into the game.
    Stymie and OlavSkullcrusher like this.
  11. Tatanka Augur

    It's only punishing if you expect top-level results quickly. If you learn to tone down your expectations, you can still have a lot of fun in-game, and the improvements will come in time.

    But it also takes some cold-hearted examination of exactly what benefit you get from each improvement, weighed against how long it takes to get that improvement. If you play 20-40 hours/week, it's less important than if you play 8-12 hours a week. That 800 AAs to max one spell focus line might take one guy a week, and another guy might take 2 months getting there. That's a long time to go getting no benefit at all from spent AAs.
  12. Yinla Ye Ol' Dragon

    It isn't quite so bad now the EOK (8ish levels of focus AA) are auto granted, but there is a lot of AAs still to be gained after that to make the focus lines work once you get to max level. Those AAs need to be spread across expansion of the required levels, I think they start at 85, so AAs less than level 105 should be in the auto grant for earlier expansions.

    I really dislike the need of having to AA while leveling up to get any extra damage on spells from these AA lines, I don't think melee have any AA or discs that don't work on new weapons unless they level up their AA lines.
    OlavSkullcrusher likes this.
  13. Skrab East Cabilis #1 Realtor

    Overall, that's a pretty preachy statement to make. It's just not good game design. Additional levels should feel like your character is growing in power, which the current system doesn't accomplish.

    Presently, it feels like a reset and grind back your relative player power from the past expansion rather than growing in power from 110 to 115. It's just a poor and disjointed system. However, not as bad as something WoW's though.
  14. Niskin Clockwork Arguer

    They can be annoying, but the biggest issue for me was that the levels of the AA's don't always match the spells. I don't remember exactly, but I'm pretty sure I got new spells at 112 on my Enchanter that I couldn't get the Focus upgrade for until 113. I have almost 200 AA's banked now as I'm approaching 113, but that will only get me two lines upgraded and then I'll have to farm again.

    Focus AA's didn't feel like an upgrade the way normal AA's do, they felt like I was behind and had to catch up. I was behind on Combat Agility and Combat Stability for my level also, but I didn't feel doubly disadvantaged by that, the way the Focus AA's did.
    Wulfhere and Yinla like this.
  15. Gialana Augur

    It was similar, but not quite the same. By getting the new spells before the new focus gear, your character was still receiving an upgrade. It just wasn't as large as it would eventually be.

    With the inflation of the focus tab AAs, newer spells are downgrades until your character earns the new AA ranks.
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  16. OlavSkullcrusher Augur

    There is the warrior's synergy, like for other classes. It is based on a particular tier of Shield Topple, so you need to buy the next rank of it for it to work on the new version of the combat ability when you level. But other than that, yes, there is pretty much no need for melee to spend more AA just to get new abilities or gear to work with the previous AA you had bought in the way that spell focus AA do.

    [edited for clarity]
  17. OlavSkullcrusher Augur

    And this was the core problem. Within EQ, prior to focus AA working like this, there was no mechanic where a character would gain a level to get access to higher level version of an existing spell or ability, yet that new ability would actually be weaker than what they were previously using until they adventured a bunch more. The closest to this is the worn focus being level limited, which I've already said doesn't make a lot of sense either. I can't think of any precedent in any fantasy RPG I've ever played for it to work this way, or in fantasy literature.

    Tatanka wrote:
    This is apologetics for something that you've already learned to deal with. It is not a reasonable argument for having designed it that way.
  18. Tatanka Augur

    I never said it was. Sheesh you people are touchy. It is, however, a reasonable argument for dealing with it as it is.

    Look, here's the reality. We can point to TONS of things in a 20+ year old game which are bad designs. With the limited staff, most of the issues won't ever get addressed. So, you're going to have to play with it as is. You can either be p!$$ed off while you're playing, or not. I choose not.

    There have been many examples on these boards where someone raises an issue, and wants something changed. People point out a workaround or alternative. "Not good enough". They want the change. Well, it ain't gonna happen.

    Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
  19. OlavSkullcrusher Augur

    There are plenty of things that they have changed over the course of 20+ years of this game. The only way for them to know if I am unhappy with past design choices is if I tell them. If enough other players are also unhappy with that same issue and voice that unhappiness, then they have the incentive to invest the time to change it. Or, even if they don't change something in the game now, they may learn something about what players do and don't like, and it will affect their design choices going forward.
  20. Tatanka Augur

    Yes, and the fact that this thread exists means that they know. My comment doesn't change that. Or indicate that I think it's a good design.