2h vs Dual Wield

Discussion in 'Hybrid' started by Davall, Mar 10, 2020.

  1. Davall New Member

    Assuming similar weapon tiers, is one superior to the other? I have been Dual Wielding (lvl 96.6 now) and would hate to find out that 2h is superior by a significant amount.

  2. Derka Augur

    What class are you?
  3. Szilent Augur

    changes as levels & AA advance & change

    there is no sacrifice in keeping all weapon skills up
  4. Fintank Augur

    Assuming you're a BL or a Ranger.

    Ranger has never been 2hander DPS optimal since I started playing 1 in TBM. I've TLP'd 1 from RoF as well and still not 2hander based. Feel pretty safe in assuming they never have been in any relatively modern expansion.

    Beastlords are more 2hander based once they start getting the chunky procs. Would be worth checking from EOK expansion and onwards. Good luck!
  5. Davall New Member

    Yeah, sorry. I am playing a BL. Keeping skills up is not an issue as it takes about 30 seconds after a level at this point, but I just want to make sure I am not shorting myself 10-15% or something.
  6. Cloud the Third Augur

    2H is probably better if you need to tank and can't use a shield otherwise I don't think BL ever were very good with 2H.
  7. Waldagar Augur

    Just normal sustained DPS without any burns running, 2HB is only around 80% of DW. A fast 2HB with 23 delay and a big proc can produce better DPS during the 45 seconds of a burn with bloodlust running.

    A slows 2HB with 36 delay can be useful if you need to beat on something with a big damage shield.
    Zanarnar likes this.
  8. Davall New Member

    I have been sticking with dual wield because it "feels" like more DPS (seems like even con mobs in HA's die consistently quicker, I am not the parsing type). I will make sure I have a 2h with me at all times just in case and at higher levels if I get a decent one.

    Thanks for the input, all.
  9. ShadowMan Augur

    Curious what would make 2 1h'ers beat a 2h weapon for bst or ranger? The only thing that should alter this is some buff or AA that flatly adds damage per hit regardless of delay. I can see 100% proc effects impacting this for the same reason, 500 damage added to 100 procs beats out 500 added to only 50 procs even if the 50 procs = 100 procs before the bonus damage.

    Most added damage from AA now scales based on delay. 2h'ers have better ratios and always gain the benefit of being primary hand attack. If you are tanking riposting with 2h is pure bonus. Burst of power favors 2h in number of extra attacks from primary hand. 2h'er procs are more than double the base from 1h'ers, outside of 100% proc rate effects.
  10. Nizune New Member

    On my 115 max AA Beastlord, I ran parses with an Ascending Sun Battle Staff and the one handed equivalent Ascending Sun Claws/Battle Rod. I should also note that I use all hdex augs as that might impact things. I averaged 100k dps with autoattack with the 2 hander and 110k dps with autoattack duel wielding the 1 handers. When I parced a burn however, I did 370k dps with the 2 hander and only 330k dps with the 1 handers. With that being said, if you wanted to min max, you would get both 1 handers and a 2 hander and weapon swap to 2 hander only for burns.
  11. svann Augur

    Suggest you get a test dummy and gamparse and parse yourself.
  12. Waldagar Augur

    For a BST we get an innate proc (Gelid Rending) that only works with HTH and 1HB weapons that does 9000 damage per proc at max level IIRC. This proc can't be forced to proc using Bloodlust.

    2HB benefits during a burn from Bloodlust forcing the big proc on the 2HB and the additional primary hand attacks from Venon's Vindication (30% chance for additional attacks for 45% damage).

    Bloodlust plus VV is the key to making a 2HB out perform two 1H weapons during a burn.

    Derka likes this.
  13. ShadowMan Augur

    I don't have access to a mostly finished Beastlord and Ranger to test it myself. I was curious as to why considering how many AA work for 2h verses 1h and all primary attacks vs primary + secondary attacks. Entire proc lines not working for 2h start to paint a picture.

    There are lots of things in this game that occur simply out of habit or I was told to do it this way 10 years ago and never changed despite the factors impacting it evolving over time.
  14. ShadowMan Augur

    Interesting. For sure Gelids doesn't proc with 2h? There are a few things that say they only proc from h2h or 1h for other classes that still end up proc'ing from 2h.
  15. Puzzling Journeyman

    for sure, look around the forums for the lazy 2her folks who want that to change. because swapping weapons to actually be the best of the best requires to much work.
  16. Waldagar Augur

    That is the reason why 2HB lags behind DW for normal sustained DPS. Gelid doesn't proc with piercing weapons either. There was once a raid where cold procs were an issue. Since BSTs do not have a way to enable/disable the AA proc, you have to swap in a 2HB or piercing weapons to *turn off* the cold proc.

    If a 23 delay 2HB is 80% of DW, then a 36 delay 2HB is more like 65% of DW. BSTs do not get enough 2H AA to really make them shine outside of a burn.

  17. Razorfall Augur

    ToV weapons have sympathetic procs in addition to their regular proc now. So it may be better to go 2h all the way unless you want the atk debuff from Gelid Rending.

    2H got a big boost during melee burns with RoS/TBL with the way they changed up the melee disc. I use one on named and other short fights because of the new procs. It's still hard to give up the mana procs from the cone/bone and tome though :(
  18. Waldagar Augur

    1h weapons have sympathetic proc as well. I am guessing you haven't parsed the DPS from sympathetic procs yet. Which is better when it comes to sympathetic procs? Two smaller ones or one big one? Gelid Rending is a BIG piece of our sustained DPS.

  19. Rashod Journeyman

    Anyone have actual numbers/parses with the new raid tradeskilled weapons? Being in a raidforce thats only beating T1 right now makes the ores hard to come by. Last year sustained was better dual wielding for me, and our low raid dps makes fights take forever so sustained plays a bigger role than for some folks I'm sure. Two hander burn wasnt that much higher when I parsed it last year so I stuck to dual wielding most if the time.

    Anyways any data driven discussion would be much appreciated before I blow an ore on a second offhand or go ahead and make a 2 hander.
  20. Szilent Augur

    even if dual wield was the answer, you'd only be making primary 1hb, right? & waiting for the drop 1hb for offhand, since procs on 1hb are bigger than the h2h. So if you've crafted your Battle Rod, then you're set for dual wielding for now. Make the 2h.

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