Sunk Cost Fallacy

Why? What does this terrible mechanic do for you?

It allows them to file more petitions. They'll fill the queues with this is bugged, I lost FTE, and other players using it as a tool to grief others.

Truly, only a visionary could come up with such a great solution.

Funniest thing I have read from the anti FTE crowd is that FTE changes core gameplay to a 25 year old game and we don't like it. Yet when Mischief was released with a major change to core gameplay to a 25 year old game, everyone was excited and happy.

Because Mischief brought in more loot for more Krono sales. Whereas FTE (when properly implemented) may decrease Kronos sales from the Krono farmers. They will no longer be able to DPS race or train or sell PL like they once did.

If anything, this forum over the past 4-8 weeks has shown just how many players care about Kronos farming than they do playing EQ

Mischief = Increased Loot and more camp options, buggy implementation lead to loot pinatas
FTE = Increased Scarcity, conflicts over restricted locations

The stated goal is to reduce petitions. You think FTE is going to calm the Karens or drive the Karens more crazy?

They're about to be flooded with so many tickets over this system.

Actually I think most of the anti-FTE crowd is ones like me that have stated there is no way for DPG to implement it properly, and that it is going to be a broken and easily exploitable mess.......

Edit: also I beginning to think a lot of the Kronos farmers are on Mischief, and will probably stay there for the most part; hence why you constantly see a lot of "come to Mischief and for the low low price of 1-4 Kronos you too can be raid ready easily".

I am one of the biggest critics of FTE the way it is implemented, not because I do not want it, I am a raider, I don't really care one way or another about group content since it really doesn't affect me much one way or another beyond just levelling, in fact, I kind like the concept as they proposed it because it would let me cheese raid content and avoid boring trash clears. I have given more loot away in xp groups that I have won but someone else in the group could use than most folks probably understand. My entire criticism is not because I bank kronos, or farm (cause I don't do either), but because it was poorly thought out, poorly executed, untested and rushed to release.

I agree, I don't think we need the system or that it can be made to work well in short order.

However, yes if its implemented then it would be preferable to have the mobs return to camp at a run in a locked condition.

If not, that means the system will work one of two ways:

Mobs slow walking back to spawn in a semi-unlocked condition. That removes the dangers from the world even worse because then people can pick them off at their leisure presumably without danger.

Mobs slow walking back to spawn in an unlocked condition. This preserves the danger but also preserves the ability to train. Only now you can more precisely target whom you want to train without accidentally training people in the way and derailing your train. That hands a fantastic tool to the trainer that they don't have now (now they have to worry about people in the way derailing their train).

Also, if they run back its less annoying for people that are trying to camp those mobs.

Edited to add: After reading the new test notes it looks like its intended to be option 1. So less danger and not a fast run.

How does FTE increase scarcity? It's not causing slower spawn rates or decreasing loot. Actually, the additional rules of Oakwynd increases loot, exp, faction, etc.

Oakwynd, at worst, brings scarcity back to normal. It doesn't cause an increase of it. That's just straight lying.

You can perma-lock NPCs now. Kiting, mezzing, rooting, tank/healer combos can engage the NPC lock it, and maintain that lock indefinitely. They’re not breaking any rules just waiting for their “guildie” or “friend”to show up. This is one of the best changes to ever happen to Krono farmers.

P1 - I don't want to spend 4 pages of forum replies to debate what a "core game mechanic" is. That's silly, and actually happened in the feedback thread lol. I can call Mischief's changes and Oakwynd's changes "potatoes" and it still doesn't change that they are completely different changes. But to your point, yeah tons of people were happy with what Mischief did to a 25 year old game. It's ok for some folks to not like what you like, and ok for you to not like what others like.

P2 - If Mischief leads to more krono sales and Oakwynd decreases them, why would DPG be releasing Oakwynd and not a Mischief clone? Maybe I don't understand what you're saying. In my experience there's a lot more toxicity in early eras. When I read your posts I get the impression that your experience is just overrun with evildoers. I don't know how I have had such a different experience, its more rare than not. I think its obvious free trade leads to more krono purchases and circulation, but is that...bad? Its a free economy with tons more supply, so it stands to reason.

P3 - I personally don't think FTE is a good fit for EQ, I also don't think the sky will fall when Oakwynd comes out. But why does everyone who doesn't think FTE is a good idea have to be a evil krono boogie man? lol I just would prefer a different server, just speaking for myself.

If you flagged your box group as pvp then people wouldn’t be even be able to buff you to steal the mob from you by getting on the agro list. Current implementation per the notes, what’s on test and what is working on the make it intentional that beneficial spells can get you attacked and then you can defend yourself.

I am curious as to how this is going to play out in the real world after the first couple weeks. You can make up all the weird imaginary scenarios you want but until it’s real we don’t know. There will be some jerks at first specially since it’s new and it will be easier to mess with low level people. The current implementation really gives some super super easy pulling options but it really does kill training which is good. I really don’t care if it makes it so you can skip trash easy in raids though they might be able to disable fte in instances where it’s not needed.

Why don’t any of you pro-fte trolls ever use real arguments? You’re either bad actors or you’re dense. Mischief was a ruleset. That’s gameplay. FTE is Changing the mechanics of the game, as in the way players interact with NPCs during combat (GAME MECHANICS). This is core to the way the game works. Now is when you realize you’re wrong but won’t admit it and will argue the definition of game mechanics. Don’t bother.

We have , you keep seeming to not want to hear the arguments. I still want someone to explain to me how the current system is fair with a paladin vs wizard

As stated this is a experimental server , if you do not like the experiment do not play there.

They could literally add a timer to auto unlock. Your problem is a joke. The constant goal post shifting in these threads is awfully tiring.

Letsts also just completely not acknowledge your example is clearly rule violation of zone disruption and a bannable offense. If you're going to make up some idiotic theoretical situation, at least make it an honest one. Bad faith arguments just continuing to be used and actually taken seriously. People are so laughably gullible to bad takes.

Wow, a rule violation. Surely, they intend to have lots of GM involvement on a server designed to eliminate GM involvement.

Which is why I also mentioned the other possibility there, captain galaxy brain. Here, have a straw, keep grasping it.

So, they put on timer on it? Still ends up with less loot, and increased petitions and toxicity.

With FTE in place then the Paladins will still 100% lose to any wizard unless they are in social aggro or Taunt range of the mob, since Staff of Temperate Flux is instant cast and has a range of 200 ... and it can be spam cast on mobs that just spawned - ensuring that the mob is aggroed as soon as the spawnlock is lifted.

No it doesn't, because someone toxic or malicious can still decide to lock a camp down forever and simply delete the desirable loot or stockpile it to himself on every and any server without FTE. But that's another ridiculous what if scenario that it is doubtful of occurring, just like yours.

The paladin will be in taunt range , no worries! Also I love how you try and use a item as a justification The goal post keeps moving .........