Class Balance - What Does It Mean To You?

That wasn't what was said. Specifically it was stated no cleric should ever do more DPS than a rogue without any note of equally geared, etc. I expressly compared a cleric with the best gear gear and optimisation vs a marginally played rogue with bad gear with the intent of implying the same level against the same target.

Yes, equally geared, leveled, and played rogue vs cleric, the rogue should have better DPS because the cleric does have other skills they bring to a group against challenging content. AND, I am entirely sure that in that comparison, a rogue does do better DPS than the cleric even if the rogue's DPS shoul be increased.

If a door is sealed with a basic locking mechanism, let it be defeated by more than lock pick skill.

Lock Kick
Lock Stick
Lock Shock
Lock Tactical Nuke
Whatever...

If lack of stealth has consequences...that is fair.

Bards should get evac and res!

Class balance means creating content first, and then deciding on how a class system can work around it. Unfortunately, modern day Everquest doesn't get that luxury. Mainly because time is working against it, and raid type mechanics came after the classes were already well established.

It's fair to say the balance between melee/casters started out very clunky. Now, to the developers credit, transitioning between melee and magic is less clunky today. But it's still pretty bad. Certain classes end up in some of the most awkward stages.

For my bard to function post 100 he needed the best gear, and even with that gear, I put in work. Fortunately for me, Bards start to slap around 111 and awkward doesn't mean it isn't fun.

Conversely, playing a shaman post 100 is so easy. Let's see, oh they get combination dots, so with 2 casts that's like 5 dots that kinda slap. Can cannablize all their mana back in like a minute. Awesome groups heals, and a pet that's pretty meaty.

Don't even get me started on the differences in these 2 classes progressive spells. The shaman one is on spam, and the bard one literally never gets slotted. Ultimately, classes that play so differently can't exist in a balanced system. Because who the hell wants to button mash when other classes can do the same thing in a few keys?

It means nothing to me because the devs don't care and nothing is going to be done about it.

The problem with balance is that people want classes that perform well than they should to get nerfed into the ground. Maybe it's not that those classes are overpowered but perhaps the real question to be asked is "Why don't we buff the other classes to be where they should be?"

buff beastlords and give us insta cast sawrm pets thanks

Class balance to me is any class is within a role type can compete with other classes within that role type. I.e DPS classes should all be able to fight for top 5 spot if they play their classes well. If everyone is doing well then everyone is within a small % of each other and where you fall on the dps meter doesn't matter because everyone is performing well and close to each other.

If that makes sense.

No class under any circumstances should be able to solo current grp missions.. just saying..

Thats not how class balance works hah.

I agree but the issue is tuning more than class balance. Make mission's hard, like they should be, like CoV had. The issue with that is then most group players then complain the missions are to hard or only tuned for raiders.

Anything easy or that can be handled by particular tools that only some classes might have is nothing new. Raid geared rangers, shadow knights, necromancers, mages, whomever have always been able to put their tool kits verses named, missions, tasks, old raids and do things that others couldn't going back to the games beginning. The difference was not everything had to be so watered down for others to still feel like they had content for them.

More lag no thanks!!! in all seriousness beastlords are in a great spot in nos.

I feel personally attacked!

/solos Mean Streets and Under Seige and Door

That would mean all group and possibly even solo encounters would need to be tuned for top tier raid equipped on max optimised min/max characters. That would potentially block all non-raid equipped characters from doing ANY content.

In my opinion, there shouldn't be a raid requirement to be able to do group content, not even the raids of the previous content. However, the rewards from raiding should allow a character to do group content on an "easy mode" which, for those who have the top tier raid gear and who have optimised their character for maximum min/max, could mean some would be able to solo/molo group content of the low tiers of the current or even up to the highest tier of the previous expansion.

The only way to prevent soloing of group missions is to have a minimum participant number or mechanics requiring at least two things in opposite locations to be done simultaneously, both of which end up being annoying later when the current is several expansions old. Different things being done simultaneously in different locations not only prevents non-groups, it can also make it a lot more difficult for non-optimised groups, blocking them from doing content.

Nah it doesn't mean that at all. The difference between raid gear and non-raid gear is pretty small. Plus they can always add mechanics that can't be handled solo.

I disagree. That is not class balance at all.

That content is dead on arrival. If it has mechanics that prevent anyone from ever soloing it, then "it's dead Jim". It is one and done. It is a waste of developer time and server resources. It has almost zero replay-ability. That is bad for business.

'member Underfoot Boomerang missions?

100% wrong. Could make encounters harder easily by adding 1 mechanic. Less player characters (not pets) on agro. The harder mechanics hit you for. To include melee and the less effective things like props taps and heals are on the player characters.

This could be accomplished rather easily via zone wide ae permanently placed on any in zone until the proper number of player characters are there. Then obviously aes of the mission do the rest.

More player characters (up to max # ) the less of a hindering thst would be until a full grp is achieved and it negates the effect totaly.

Don't remind me... but the gold token weapons sure were a hoot. Fortunately we have these now.