EQ Development Roadmap 2023 -- TLP Edition

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Brontus, Feb 25, 2023.

  1. Brontus EQ Player Activist

    I took a look at the recently published EQ Development Roadmap 2023 and removed the items that pertain to EQ Live. Here's the new infographic presented without commentary:

    [IMG]
  2. MischiefTLP Augur

    You eliminated raids in the newest expansion which makes sense. Then you eliminated new content for Events, new 24th Anniversary content is essentially meaningless to TLPs, Mischief is the first TLP ever which might see later expansions with more than a couple of dozen people seeing if they can beat the raids and it's still pretty optimistic that there will be a strong population in 2027 to enjoy those events. Every other event will probably be available when it's as relevant on those servers as it is on Live.

    Then you eliminated pre-orders which are new bags for TLPs and expansion launch which are new illusions, new mounts and possibly a new feature like Tradeskill Depot on TLP servers.

    Mostly it just points out the terrible priorities of the Dev team, hey guys we don't have much staff so our focus for the year other than the new expansion is to churn out content that will be available for less than a month out of every year as opposed to working on permanent content. Kunark Archaeologist is probably the last new permanent content not tied to a new expansion release, in theory Hero's Journey home city quests could have been something along those lines but instead it's just a way for a subset of Live players to get a few more ach points.
    Brontus and Shakara like this.
  3. generic Journeyman

    devs actually REALLY dislike TLP servers, a large group of people that want to replay content from generations of previous devs but not their wonderful new content..
    Corporate likes them, new bags, new subs, new DBC point spending, new krono...

    but because devs distain for them, they put 0% effort in to any TLP work. why woulf they when they can make new ice graphics for velious and zones for luclin 2.0... PoP 2.0 is coming this year.. obviously.
    Brontus likes this.
  4. Brontus EQ Player Activist

    Astute analysis in the replies. The TLP product roadmap is essentially threadbare with some performative filler.

    When comparing EQ live product to the EQ TLP product, I find it perplexing that TLP requires a membership fee "All Access Pass" and EQ live does not. To be fair, you can play on EQ live servers indefintately until you level to the point you have to purchase the current expansion.

    For that required membership price, it's not unreasonable for a consumer expect TLP servers to get commensurate attention from the devs. We had a revolution over the issue of taxation without representation.

    Given the age of EQ, TLP servers seem the best way to onboard new players as there are still vestiges of the original magic of EQ found in ther TLP servers. It's mind boggling that they don't strive to enhance and polish the EQ TLP experience as it's a big part of their revenue stream.

    In the past when I asked if Darkpaw has two dev teams, a dev replied that they only have one team to work in both EQ live and EQ TLP. From what I have seen, most of the devs are working on EQ live and not the TLP servers. The bug forums is mostly full of EQ live bugs which is taking up all of the attention from the devs.

    Blizzard's WoW now has two distinct dev teams working on Wow live and WoW classic. This makes perfect sense, since they are different products. Yes, they are a bigger studio with more resources, but I think that Darkpaw should follow suit and have at least a few devs soley in charge and responsible for the EQ TLP service. Besides, EQ live and EQ TLP players have different needs and different expectations.

    We need dedicated devs that work only on the TLP experience. As TLP players we should not be afraid to speak up and request this from Darkpaw.
  5. Robnie Augur

    Do you really want full time devs "touching up" tlp?

    You may not like the results lol
    Appren likes this.
  6. Xeris Augur

    Speak for yourself. I support EQ devs good for them
    Brildon likes this.
  7. FranktheBank Augur

    I too support Brontus giving Darkpaw ~$1m to fund hiring and training new devs.
    Brildon and Appren like this.
  8. filthytlpplayer Elder

    I'm not super sure what a TLP dedicated team would be working on. There's certainly not consensus among TLP players what they would want that team doing. I think the point that the non expansion development that's happening is not accessible to TLP is a good point, and would like to see that change. The question is how do you design compelling content that's accessible to all players regardless of level/expansion and still make it meaningful? That would be a pretty major paradigm shift for EQ, and in some ways the genre, if they could do that in a good way.
  9. uberkingkong Augur

    What is there for a dev assigned to TLP to do?
    Make a new ruleset? Well they do do that already.

    I play TLP because its easy way to make kronos.
    TLP I'll make 5-7 kronos a week if I put my focus into that.
    Live, krono costs 4 million plat, yeah that's gonna be awhile to get people to buy stuff and then buy the krono. And the local buyer/seller will try screw me over with their 9 figure plat, 211,000,000 plat "what you doing buying/selling this is my territory it has been for 13 years, off my lawn"

    People penny pinchers on Live, hard to reach 4 million plat with tons of people penny pinching.
    On TLP oh this item that isn't too hard to get is worth 2 kronos? Oh how nice, sure give me the kronos I'll give you it. Krono is just 20,000 plat, oh thats not much I'll get that in a few days selling other stuff.

    If anything, they need to work on driving the plat prices DOWN for kronos on Live. Not raise the bazaar prices. They need to drive prices DOWN. Penny pinchers will be penny pinchers, drive the prices down so people penny pinching isn't so bad since kronos prices aren't super high anymore.

    I'd like them to hire an economist, someone who can get the krono prices down on Live rather than some TLP Dev that doesn't do much, not much to do anyways. It's TLP reliving the experience again, what are you hoping for a TLP expansion? Kunark dungeons lvl 55-60 expansion?
    Get me an economist instead lets fix the krono prices drive em down, not make people able to sell even higher with penny pinchers all over the place. That leads to monopoly which there pretty is already.

    This person 1000 of this and that and everything? Oh monopoly. You want prices to be higher, more amount? Oh that just means the monopoly is even tougher to beat.

    This is why I like TLPs, start over, can fight the monopoly day 1, I usually do good and I make tons of kronos, so TLPs are good for kronos if they good ruleset thats good too. Loved Vaniki server because bazaar is open day 1. Thats great! I don't do bots in EC tunnels.
  10. DeadRagarr Augur

    We still don't know new TLP server right?

    AoC's were made originally only for TLP's
    Mischief was quite a bit of work I am sure.
    They tried something new with level locked as well.

    So TLP's do get attention, I just assume they get them as new rule sets now.
  11. Yinla Ye Ol' Dragon

    The problem is a lot of players do not want new content for TLPs, many won't even venture past expansion X.

    All new content is future TLP content.

    Anduane, Rizola and Vaniki, will shortly be seeing some of the new content in the form of Overseer quests as they hit SoD.

    The lack of TLPs being listed on the road map doesn't bother me as long as they keep giving quality of life updates to TLPs, for example we got more flags form SoD raids, etc.

    They deal a lot with TLP issues as they arise, many of which they would not have been able to predict to add to a yearly road plan.
    Appren likes this.
  12. Brontus EQ Player Activist


    Yeah, I do. I want to know that there are devs that eat, sleep, think, breathe and *gasp* play on TLP servers. Blizzard has an entire team dedicated to ensuring that their WoW classic servers are deliving the very best experience, why not Darkpaw?

    Why do we have a seperate TLP forum?

    Answer: because it gives TLP players a place to communicate their concerns, feedback, wants and needs to the devs in one consolidated place.

    Why not continue this philosophy and have one or two devs specifically assigned to the TLP product line?

    It's unfair that EQ live product line is getting all the attention and the TLP product line is barely getting any at all. If we had devs focusing on the TLP experience, then we as players could hold them accountable. Then Darkpaw could hold them accountable as well.

    The EQ classic experience on TLP servers is not perfect. It could be so much better with refinements, additional polish and tuning, better zone populating, better itemization, live invasions and events. A more polished EQ classic experience, means more more new players and consequently revenues. Since all of these things are brought up daily here on the TLP forums, I can't understand why some people are opposed to this.
  13. Brontus EQ Player Activist


    All we'd need is one developer. It wouldn't cost $1 million. Game devs that are knoweledgeable about EQ classic are out there. Another problem is, what serious experienced dev wants to work at Darkpaw? Darkpaw isn't exactly a cutting edge studio.

    I support Enad Global 7 using the existing revenues that the EQ franchise is earning and reinvesting them back into the franchise. EverQuest is a cash cow that been mistreated and abused. It's time the old cow got some serious love for all she's done for SOE, Daybreak and EG7 over the years. :)
  14. Yinla Ye Ol' Dragon

    That runs the risk of losing more players than it gains, many play TLP for the nostalga, you start changing that and there is more that players will dislike. There are reasons why players don't play passed POP/GOD/OOW. I've been surprised recently how many players have never seen DoN + content. A lot of TLP players don't like playing outside of content they do not know.

    Good luck with Live invasions, Live servers don't even get those anymore and some rarely get guide events.
  15. Tarvas Redwall of Coirnav, now Drinal


    It takes the current team a year to turn out an expansion, plus do all the housing keeping chores that keep the game running. I do not think having a developer specifically for TLP is going to do what you think it will. It is the same code.

    As for holding DPG "accountable," you already have the means to do that.
    Appren likes this.
  16. uberkingkong Augur

    It's burnout thats why people leave.
    Either server moves too slow or too fast.
    Mangler was moving a bit slow, Vaniki was really fast pace. I think Vaniki is at a normal pace now, but at 50-60 really killed off a lot of the population, so those unlocks went by so fast.

    Mangler I quit because too slow, not because I don't like PoP/GoD/OoW, I love those expansions it just takes forever to get there. I left before Kunark even started it was that slow in the beginning. After so many PoHate PoFear runs it gets boring fast.

    Thats why I suggested a TLP,
    timelock raids, and day 1 of timelock raid is x20 loot
    I just want to do those early raids super serious once the other times is just for fun not 5+ tryhard PoHate raids that gets boring quickly.

    When you look at guild tab and people not showing up for raids, its because burnout, PoHate PoFear that gets boring quickly. Fun the first and second after that boring meter raises real quick.
    I don't even make it to Kunark and I try hard to stay motivated.

    If it was me, I'd say original 3 weeks Kunark/Velious 3 weeks (this part burns me out, I go so hard in the beginning it needs to move quick after about 6 weeks I start to cooldown)
    Luclin/PoP 8 weeks
    Do LoY/LDON/GoD at sametime theres a lot but its hard but many expansions so 8 weeks
    OoW/DoN/DoD open up these sametime 10 weeks
    PoR/TSS/TBS 10 weeks
    SoF/SoD/UF 10 weeks
    HoT/VoA/RoF 10 weeks
    CotF/TDS/TBM 10 weeks
    EoK/RoS/TBL 10 weeks
    ToV/CoV/ToL 10 weeks
    NoS/30th expansion remainder time/server merge
    Luclin, LDoN, DoN, PoR TSS, SoF, SoD, HoT, CotF, ToV, easy expansions, don't let them be the latest unlock. Those are for groupers being happy. End with challenging expansions like TBS, UF, TBL where the end game raiders have to really pick up the pace because theres 3 expansions unlocked. It makes raiders happy because they like having stuff to do.
    Groupers happy, Raiders happy, everyone happy.

    this way I have a lot to do I don't get burned out easily since a lot of expansions, all these grinds I can work on.

    Burnout is my killer, so maybe more per unlock is better.
    Vaniki I didn't get burned out from content, it was from being behind, guildies leaving because they upset achievements did not get done. Loved multiple expansion unlocks.
    Mangler a regular TLP burnout from lack of stuff. No I don't want PoHate raiding again. I'd like to work on some keys or something nice instead.
  17. Yinla Ye Ol' Dragon

    This is my favourite part about Vaniki!
  18. Mashef Augur

    I'm not sure what a full time dev would do for TLP. Seems unnecessary.

    It would be nice to get 2 months dedicated to the TLP say end of March thru end of May to make sure we get a good one and maximize new subs coming back. Maybe that is what we get currently. If so then they just need to find a way to create TLPs that are more aligned with player wants then what we got in 2022. I can't ever imagine more then a few months for TLP would be necessary.

    After exploring live servers for a few weeks now I can say the populations aren't large but man I think for every unique player there are 5 boxes or more. So I get the yearly expansion thing - it just makes sense. Those players have to buy copies of the expansion for every box.

    They would be much better off dedicating a team to making a new EQ or remastering this one to modernize it without changing the essence of the game.